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How important is it to swivel?
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supertopoz


Sep 22, 2003, 11:00 PM
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How important is it to swivel?
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This is my question.
What are your experences with a swivel?

What has happened to your haul rope when you didn't include a swivel?

Is a Petzl swivel the only option?

Thank you


mrhardgrit


Sep 23, 2003, 4:52 AM
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Swivels .... overpriced.

I don't knowa nyone that uses a swivel on their haul line and personally I have never had any problems without a swivel. I would have thought that using one would actually cause more problems as the pig is more likely to spin on the end of the line and hence get caught up with any loose lines.


lambone


Sep 23, 2003, 8:15 AM
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I use one now. I think it helps, especialy if the route is over hanging and it's windy enough to get the bags spinning.

Without one the rope has the tendency to get more twisted and kinky.

I think it is sort of a luxury thing, definately not neccesary. I did my first walls without one and never had any problems.


dsafanda


Sep 23, 2003, 10:05 AM
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I use one but damn it is a pricy little toy!


iamthewallress


Sep 23, 2003, 10:48 AM
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I have never felt like it was something that I needed.


dsafanda


Sep 23, 2003, 11:20 AM
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The only times I've been glad to have it are when I've been lazy and instead of using a lower out line opt for letting the bag going twirling in to space(see below). I've imagined that with out the swivel the haul line would get pretty twisted and would be a bit harder to manage at the belay. Based on what others are saying...I guess not.
http://www.safanda.com/...ngtower/images/5.jpg


epic_ed


Sep 23, 2003, 11:26 AM
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Damn, that bag is out there. Nice shot.

Purpose of the swivel isn't to keep your bag from spinning, it's to keep the rope from twisting. I bought one, but think I could live without it unless it was a really steep route (like the Tower). Then again, I'm not known for being conservative with my gear purchases. If I hadn't bought it, I'd feel like I was missing out on something. :roll:

Ed


iamthewallress


Sep 23, 2003, 11:30 AM
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In reply to:
The only times I've been glad to have it are when I've been lazy and instead of using a lower out line opt for letting the bag going twirling in to space(see below). I've imagined that with out the swivel the haul line would get pretty twisted and would be a bit harder to manage at the belay. Based on what others are saying...I guess not.

I have a 250 ft. haul line that I tie in short. It's good for fixing and lowering out. I'm too afraid of cutting the bag loose even on steep stuff after hearing about a cut-loose haul ine wrapping itself around the lead line on a friend of mine (who didn't realize that they were crossed out of view) and burning clean through the sheeth. :shock:


dsafanda


Sep 23, 2003, 12:01 PM
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In reply to:
cut-loose haul ine wrapping itself around the lead line

I don't get it. How would a haul line get wrapped around a lead line that is passing through clipped gear? Was it wrapped around the lead line before the climber left the belay?

250ft haul line sounds heavy but makes sense. What diameter?


iamthewallress


Sep 23, 2003, 12:06 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
cut-loose haul ine wrapping itself around the lead line

I don't get it. How would a haul line get wrapped around a lead line that is passing through clipped gear? Was it wrapped around the lead line before the climber left the belay?

Either that or the climber did some funky step around higher up?

In reply to:
250ft haul line sounds heavy but makes sense. What diameter?

It still lighter than the lead line and allows for some hauls to be linked (a bonus if you are using a freight hook anyway) or if you can link a couple straight off the ground or ledge. It's about 9.5 mm...whatever they were selling at Shoreline.


dsafanda


Sep 23, 2003, 12:10 PM
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Yeah...got the same BW static from Shoreline. I bought mine long. Now that I think about it...it might just be 250'.

Ed, if we team up in Zion I think we could probably open a well stocked climbing store.


rogueclimber


Sep 23, 2003, 12:45 PM
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I have a 250 ft. haul line that I tie in short. It's good for fixing and lowering out. I'm too afraid of cutting the bag loose even on steep stuff after hearing about a cut-loose haul ine wrapping itself around the lead line on a friend of mine (who didn't realize that they were crossed out of view) and burning clean through the sheeth. :shock: Hey iamthewallrus, Was this a pitch above the Kor Roof on Washington Column?? Nice guy with long hair?


epic_ed


Sep 23, 2003, 12:57 PM
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In reply to:
Ed, if we team up in Zion I think we could probably open a well stocked climbing store.

YUP! Now if I could just find a hefty set of balls, I'd have everything I need.

Ed


iamthewallress


Sep 23, 2003, 2:38 PM
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Hey iamthewallrus, Was this a pitch above the Kor Roof on Washington Column?? Nice guy with long hair?

Yep (the nice long haired blonde guy's friend anyway....) I think they were on Skull Queen. I was on my way up to start my (brief, abortive) adventure on the Prow as they were bailing off. Were you one of the guys praying for your life on Dinner Ledge as the bag hurtled through space and whipped around the rope?


russwalling


Sep 23, 2003, 3:01 PM
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I never use a swivel.
I always cut the ags loose.
Only been yarded out of the station due to the bag grabbing me once... Black Cave, N.A. Wall.... bags launch, rip me right out of the station, and we are both hanging about 10 feet from the wall. I'm last guy on a 3 man team. Thought about a belay knife but had none, and a swivel would not have helped. Used some superhuman strength thing to get the bags off me. A biner on the haul line clipped into my line/harness during the launch. Yep... it was an eyeopener.
Russ


rogueclimber


Sep 23, 2003, 4:34 PM
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Yeah, we were on dinner watching the whole mess. I had asked them why they didn't have a lower out line and warned them they might need one on pitch 5. WHOOPS! I hope they got back on the horse. Cheers! Gabe


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Sep 23, 2003, 9:59 PM
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I found a swivel to be invaluable on less than vertical terrain. The pig would generally roll around stuff much easier.


brutusofwyde


Sep 24, 2003, 11:00 AM
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I like swivels as well. Own two. Second the observation that they are best and most needed on less than vertical terrain, particularly
traversing less-than-vertical terrain.

Brutus


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