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diodesanddihedrals


Dec 14, 2003, 11:50 PM
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Cheater Sticks
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I first read about cheater sticks in Big Walls by John Long and John Middendorf. After aid climbing for a while I finally felt like I could have used one. So I built one from an old collapseable walking pole and was itchin to use it. I've been bringing it just in case, but haven't needed one since I made it. I dunno, when have you experienced guys / gals used em, or have you at all.


realization


Dec 15, 2003, 9:11 AM
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I'm not familiar with them, what are they exactly?


sbclimber


Dec 15, 2003, 9:45 AM
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I practiced some aiding on an old bolt ladder in Riverside and there was a missing bolt so I had to use a cheater stick to reach that next clip. Top stepping wouldn't even get close.


Partner euroford


Dec 15, 2003, 12:56 PM
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looks like trango is comming out with a new cheater stick dohicky. it appears to be geared to the sporto crowd for pre placing draws (sheesh) but it might be a nice aid gadget as well.

aid climbing = creative cheating in good style :)


climbsomething


Dec 15, 2003, 1:42 PM
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http://www.rockclimbing.com/...p.cgi?Detailed=12414

epic_ed's CSFH (Cheater Stick From Hell)- 22 feet long! hell yeah.


slavetogravity


Dec 15, 2003, 2:08 PM
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I've got two words for you. Smith Rocks. It is at Smith that Cheater Sticks are most commonly used. I think it had everything to do with the 80's conflict between trad and sport climbers in the area. In an effort to legitimise their climbs sport climbers went and placed the first bolt WAY off the deck. They did this, as if to say "Ya, you think sport climbing is for cowards?! Well lets just see solo up the first 20 feet of this bad boy climb and clip that first bolt!" If you go to Smith don't worry about brining one. You always find people willing to lend you theirs.


diodesanddihedrals


Dec 15, 2003, 2:17 PM
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epic_ed,
That has to be the biggest freakin cheater stick i've ever seen, that's awesome. Has it been used?


dirko


Dec 15, 2003, 4:50 PM
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If you wanna use it, hey, there are no rules in this game.

I bring one when conditions are less than ideal, i.e. I climbing the Prow between shifts at work... can't be late because there are too many blown heads, boss just wouldn't understand. I don't aid too hard, so I can't comment on their use for tricky aid.


epic_ed


Dec 15, 2003, 9:55 PM
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I have no idea what you're talking about. That's my story and I'm sticking to it...

I can clip the anchors of some sport routes with that thing. :P Fortunately for me, I've only had to use it in "appropriate" situations, like when I suck to bad to free the moves necessary to get to the next section of aid (Kate, does Sedona ring a bell?). My stick is a little over the top, but I take it on solos. It gives me some options about how (or if) to proceed in the face of missing fixed gear. And, yes, it is shameless cheating.

Ed


crackboy


Dec 16, 2003, 12:20 AM
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so how do you go about using that thing on aid? do you clip the piece with the rope and haul up on that or do you just string together your aiders and climb them?


epic_ed


Dec 17, 2003, 8:21 AM
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Depends on the piece. If it's a bolt or bomber piece of gear, I'll clip it with the rope like I would if it were a sport route. Anything less than bomber and doing it that way risks a big whipper. So there's no practical way to use it beyond the reach of my aid ladders when clipped together -- maybe 12 feet? Keep the ladders attached to you by using some accessory cord, since your diasey chain won't reach that far.

Ed


diesel___smoke


Dec 18, 2003, 11:38 AM
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If you don't like them being used - Duck taping the eyes of bolts, pins and heads will render them useless... I'd be careful with that practice though (drilling might be the result)


jammin


Dec 18, 2003, 12:06 PM
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If I'm about to start a climb and there is a bad landing or the first piece is very high, I'm all for cheater sticks and stick clipping.

It'll keep me from cracking my spine on some nasty rock or scree.


ksudyno


Dec 18, 2003, 12:18 PM
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Personally I dont like them, if you are worried about getting to that first bolt then you should not be on that climb or route. Thats my opinion and Im sticking to it. .


atg200


Dec 18, 2003, 1:10 PM
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get thee gone sport climber. you have no idea what we are talking about.


climbsomething


Dec 18, 2003, 1:44 PM
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In reply to:
Personally I don’t like them, if you are worried about getting to that first bolt then you should not be on that climb or route. That’s my opinion and I’m sticking to it. .
This is the aid, not sport, forum. Stick clips in sport cragging and "Lovetron"-type cheater sticks in aid climbing are not quite the same thing. You know, kinda like rock climbing in Kansas and rock climbing in Utah or Colorado...


epic_ed


Dec 18, 2003, 2:06 PM
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Oh my, these sport climbers sure can get fiesty. :P


climblouisiana


Dec 18, 2003, 2:20 PM
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last time i used my cheater stick was to hold a pinata. it worked pretty well, but my cheater stick was rendered useless.


jt512


Dec 18, 2003, 2:53 PM
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In reply to:
Stick clips in sport cragging and "Lovetron"-type cheater sticks in aid climbing are not quite the same thing.

Your opinion might be different if you'd seen me on my project the last couple of weekends. Lately, sport climbing and aid climbing have become been nearly indistinguishable for me.

-Jay


epic_ed


Dec 18, 2003, 4:08 PM
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Welcome to the fold, Jay! Even if it is temporary and unintentional. Now all you need is a portaledge.


jt512


Dec 18, 2003, 4:10 PM
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In reply to:
Welcome to the fold, Jay! Even if it is temporary and unintentional. Now all you need is a portaledge.

Given that my last work run on that route took 2 hours, you may be closer to right than you think!

-Jay


spike


Dec 19, 2003, 12:19 PM
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Jay,
You might become a Big Wall Climber after all.
I am always looking for a rope gun for those free moves on the big stone.
See you at NJC :D


Partner holdplease2


Dec 21, 2003, 4:46 PM
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Yes, Ed, I remember Sedona oh so well.

Seeing the pic of the cheater stick brought on a flashback before I even saw your post.

I won't say anymore, but oh man. I hope you never whip your stick out around me again!

-Kate.


mikeinidaho


Dec 22, 2003, 5:55 PM
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I use a cheater stick all the time. It is sized to fit into a haul bag. Any longer and it's a little unwheeeldy.

Make one youre self:

1 - an old adjustable ski/trecking pole is fine for starters.

2 - attach a small PONY hardware clamp to the end (use bailing wire & duct tape)

3 - attach a KEEPER LOOP to the clamp! Run it thru the spring, this is important!

4 - attach a piece of sting to the handle, long enough to clip into your chest harness. You need to size it so you can streach your arms out long while holding the handle.

Using it:

A - Attach the BINER you wanna clip into the clamp (keep a few key-lock bent gates handy, just for this)

B - Clip it with the gate held open.

C - and have a short runner on the key-lock biner, and another biner on bottom of the 'draw.

D - Clip the rope thru the bottom of the draw.

E - Clip the KEEPER on the clamp into the bottom 'biner on the draw too.

F - Clip the string to your chest harness.

[ NOW - You can't drop anything, it's all into something ]

G - Reach up, and clip the key-lock biner into the bolt (or whatever) and pray everything's good cuz you've got a sh*t-load of rope out. Batman up the rope.

( and )

If you are worried about the piece you're on or the piece you're straining to reach. CLIP a DAISY CHAIN into the key-lock biner. And this to the clamp - clip this above you, bounce test, and aid your way up the loops.


diplodocus


Jan 13, 2004, 7:11 AM
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it's a great safety device for those learning to lead climb. Nothing wrong with them. As you climb more often, and gain more confidence, you'll naturally stop using them

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