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ledges: single or double?
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Partner camhead


Jan 16, 2004, 8:02 PM
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ledges: single or double?
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well? compare, contrast, and discuss, dammit. which should I buy, and why?


skiclimb


Jan 16, 2004, 9:07 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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Single if you have partners with their own ledges...double if your likely to drag some newbie along....

suggest spending the dough on BD if you can...love mine :D


smithclimber


Jan 16, 2004, 9:08 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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This has already been discussed here time and time again. Try doing a search or just scroll through the aid forum and gearhead forums, I'm sure it's there somewhere.

Really quick here:

Ask yourself how important is weight. That pretty much should decide the issue for you.

If you are doing remote walls, plan to do a lot of soloing, or ALWAYS intend to be the third person on the team (therefore needing your own ledge) then you'll probably just want a single.
Advantage: weighs less, costs less.
Disadvantage: can't do a wall with someone else unless they also have a ledge (and their's had better be a single too lest you'll be taking up gear for three - their double plus your single. Not exactly the way to save weight.)

Since most people don't fall into those catagories they generally like a double.
Advantage: easier to find wall partners since they don't have to have their own ledge. When you solo, you have lots of room to relax (drop the sharkfin dividers), less overall weight than hauling two singles (important when not soloing).
Disadvantage: weighs more (only slightly) than one single (only important when soloing), costs more (only slightly more than the single), when sharing the double with a partner you have slightly less personal room than if you were on a single by yourself.

That's it in a nutshell.

If it wasn't apparent, I favor the double.

Good luck.


Partner trguy


Jan 18, 2004, 7:19 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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I purchased a single ledge from a friend second hand, cheap. I don't do big walls frequently so I've only used it one one solo trip. Every other time I've borrowed a double for my partner and I rather than dealing with (2) single ledges on a route. If you're planning to solo or you find a great deal the single is ok but otherwise I'd go with the double. And as smithclimber said, it's much easier to find partners if you have a double.


Partner trguy


Jan 18, 2004, 7:22 PM
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I purchased a single ledge from a friend second hand, cheap. I don't do big walls frequently so I've only used it one one solo trip. Every other time I've borrowed a double for my partner and I rather than dealing with (2) single ledges on a route. If you're planning to solo or you find a great deal the single is ok but otherwise I'd go with the double. And as smithclimber said, it's much easier to find partners if you have a double.


apollodorus


Jan 25, 2004, 9:39 PM
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The extra weight of the double ledge is virtually nothing, unless you are in the Himalayas or speed climbing. But, the extra room at the bivi and at belays is very nice. On hard walls, the ledge becomes a place to hang out, sort gear, etc. Larger is better here. You can flake two haul lines and the climbing rope on a double, and still have room to sort gear. As a bonus, if you get stuck in a storm, the double allows you to bring all sorts of stuff inside with you, instead of having to go outside to plunder the pig. The extra space, and the option to do walls with only one ledge for two people also argue in favor of the double. Get the Fish double. It's pretty light for its size, and is totally bomber.


okinawatricam


Jan 25, 2004, 11:44 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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A single ledge is much more confortable. It also give you some time apart from you partner on those long routes.


roughster


Jan 25, 2004, 11:56 PM
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I have been thinking about thi and going with a double for myself.


Partner euroford


Jan 26, 2004, 6:51 AM
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i vote double. the extra room is just way worth it.


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Jan 26, 2004, 7:01 AM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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paul --

double's the way go; for just a small increase in weight you get so much more room. you'll pat yourself on the back when you're sitting out a two-day storm -- living in the lap of luxury -- as you simultaneously lounge in your bag, organize gear and cook ... and all without having to be a yogic contortionist.


ricardol


Jan 28, 2004, 12:22 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3656964317&category=30107

for those of you looking for a ledge

current bid $600 .. not bad for a brand new A5 double w/fly ..

-- ricardo


aid312


Jan 31, 2004, 10:11 AM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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Here is a good deal on a ledge.

http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/threadz/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/303390/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/1


joe


Jan 31, 2004, 1:05 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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omfg, camshaft's getting a pornoledge? what's next, dave mathews greatest hits?

dude, get the double. trust me, even if you solo a bunch you will love the extra space to spread out on and they really aren't that much more $$$ than a single.

and fwiw, definately check out metolius' ledge. i got to try my friend's out at the base of the capt and it is DELUXE. the spreader bar is pimp and it sets up really quick.


skywalker


Feb 3, 2004, 2:15 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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I'm no expert but I've doubled in a double and I hardly slept despite 16 hours of hard labor. I've also done the single ledge thing too while my partner had the double. My conclusion is that having a double is the way to go. As mentioned the difference in wieght is not all that big. Further, if you're like me who generally climbs in areas where the approach doesn't take days and the walls are pretty steep its not so bad hauling even two doubles. I'm also 6'3'' and 200lbs.
Cheers!


iamthewallress


Feb 3, 2004, 2:38 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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My ideal situations...

1. No portaledge if possible.
2. A hammock to deal with the remote possibility of not making a ledge bivy. (I have the Pika parasite.)
3. Seperate portaledges for partners unless we're dating.
4. Double or single depending upon how far you have to carry it. I have a Pika single because weight is a big issue for me. It was also the cheapest at the time.
5. Black Diamond auto-pop-up two ton double if you have indentured servents carrying your stuff.


ricardol


Feb 3, 2004, 3:13 PM
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i am in the midst of deciding what to do .. have plans to do WFLT with a partner ...

probably will bring 1 single -- (for belaying comfort) .. and then have someone sleep in the ledge and the other sleep on the rock ledge at night .. if we get stuck midpitch -- then we can sit and sleep i guess on the single ..

-- ricardo


yosemite


Feb 3, 2004, 3:40 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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Depends (tm).

Some singles are longer than doubles. How tall are you?
Could make a difference if you are > 6 feet.

gm


brutusofwyde


Feb 3, 2004, 5:46 PM
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In reply to:
i am in the midst of deciding what to do .. have plans to do WFLT with a partner ...

probably will bring 1 single -- (for belaying comfort) .. and then have someone sleep in the ledge and the other sleep on the rock ledge at night ..
WTF?

Done the standard way, WFLT is 10 pitches. With that in mind, let's look at what you just said:

At least two of the pitches to Awahnee can be linked. That makes it three ropes to Awahee. With a lead line and haul line fixed, you would need to climb one additional rope length to get to Awahnee.

Awahnee is big enough and scooped enough to comfortably sleep 2 teams of two. If there are more folks than that up there, you don't want to be there anyway. imho Awahnee is WAY more comfortable than any portaledge.

The two pitches above Awahnee (P5 and P6) can be fixed with a single rope. So you could conceivably fix P5, P6, and P7 with two ropes.

That leaves P8, P9, and P10. A sittting bivy is possible at the belay for P10.

In reply to:
if we get stuck midpitch -- then we can sit and sleep i guess on the single ..

By all means take the single for belay comfort, and flag it between pitches so you don't have to break down/set up. But plan on enjoying Awahnee for what it's worth, and bring some nice red wine for your partner, keeping some in reserve if you happen to spend the night sitting on the portaledge. Tell her Brutus says that's the best way to enjoy a sitting bivy.


ricardol


Feb 3, 2004, 6:16 PM
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totally-- the ledge is for belay comfort -- not for bivy comfort..

-- ricardo


funkness


Feb 4, 2004, 9:49 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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"imho Awahnee is WAY more comfortable than any portaledge. " thats funny cuz I would say..imho my portaledge is WAY more comfortable than any real ledge."


iamthewallress


Feb 5, 2004, 12:07 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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In reply to:
"imho Awahnee is WAY more comfortable than any portaledge. " thats funny cuz I would say..imho my portaledge is WAY more comfortable than any real ledge."

Maybe true, but I also find cragging single pitch stuff with abundant snax handly, belaying in my puffy coat, with cold beers just minutes away in the car much more comfy than spending 2+ days on a wall. The thing is, the harder, less comfy experience is usually the richer one for me, and having the experience of sleeping on the rock is a big part of that. If you sleep on Anchorage Ledge, Sickle Ledge, or my personal favorite, The Pilar of Dispair, you'll probably agree that the accomodations provided by Awahnee are a gift of nature.


rokshoxbkr19


Feb 5, 2004, 12:09 PM
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Re: ledges: single or double? [In reply to]
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it depends on what you wanna do on that ledge. Sleeping only or bumpin and grinding, hehehe


brutusofwyde


Feb 7, 2004, 11:41 AM
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In reply to:
it depends on what you wanna do on that ledge. Sleeping only or bumpin and grinding, hehehe

:oops:

Busted...


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