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climberdave
Feb 1, 2004, 4:54 AM
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For 2 bolts with chains what anchor set-up do you use?
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estwing
Feb 1, 2004, 6:55 AM
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For this setup the fastest way to go is the crossed sling, take a nice shinny two foot runner, clip it to each shinny bolt, twist and add a big shinny locker. Note the use of the term shinny, it refers to new solid gear, because the is no redundancy in this setup.
visit, and click on anchors at the bottom of the page.
http://www.chauvinguides.com/guidelines.htm
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hema
Feb 1, 2004, 8:36 AM
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I wont go the the sliding (death-)x-sling but I would use two slings girdhitched to the bolts (one sling per bolt) then a fig. of 8 knot to form a bight at the opposite end of the bolt . Two locking biners cli´pped gates opposite each other and through both slings.
Pros and cons vs sliding-X
- Safer, if one bolt fails won't shock-load the other bolt
- Almost as fast to set up
- Uses less gear (well two slings vs one, but two locking biners vs three)
- SAFER!!!
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iltripp
Feb 1, 2004, 3:14 PM
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In reply to: For this setup the fastest way to go is the crossed sling, take a nice shinny two foot runner, clip it to each shinny bolt, twist and add a big shinny locker. Note the use of the term shinny, it refers to new solid gear, because the is no redundancy in this setup.
This isn't a bad set-up, although some don't like the sliding X anchor. I would, however, disagree with the lack of redundancy. Just add an extra sling and possibly an extra biner (opposite-opposed) for the rope and it's plenty redundant. There is no reason to use a set-up that's not redundant here.
In reply to: I wont go the the sliding (death-)x-sling but I would use two slings girdhitched to the bolts (one sling per bolt) then a fig. of 8 knot to form a bight at the opposite end of the bolt . Two locking biners cli´pped gates opposite each other and through both slings. Pros and cons vs sliding-X - Safer, if one bolt fails won't shock-load the other bolt - Almost as fast to set up - Uses less gear (well two slings vs one, but two locking biners vs three) - SAFER!!!
Hmm... I haven't used this. Why do you girth hitch the slings? I would think that loading an anchor like this might damage your slings over time, but maybe not. Sure, it's great to save a little gear, but why not use a biner on the bolts?
Also, the benefit vs the sliding X, the lack of shock-loading one bolt if the other fails, is good, but on bomber bolts, this should hardly be necessary. Would you use this over the X in any situation (say, for example, a nice pair of shiny new bolts on a Yosemite classic).
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mustclimb69
Feb 1, 2004, 3:56 PM
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Girth hitch a bolt???? :shock:
OK...REDUNDANCY is the key!
Use this anchor!
Use one 4 foot runner and tie overhands on the ends use 2 locking biners to climp to the anchors. Then add a twist into one of strands and clip 2 opposing locking biners.
This adds redundancy to both the sling and the anchors if ANYHTING fails your safe. Including the freak chance of breaking one of the strands in the middle.
Fast easy to set up and clean, self equalizing and SUPER SAFE!!
The best sport anchor I have used.
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simplistic
Feb 1, 2004, 3:58 PM
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I think that the two foot runner equalized as mentioned above works well if you tie the runner of at its apex to ensure there is no extension if a bolt should fail, also in the unlikely event that the sling should fail, the knot allows it to function as two separate pieces. This was taught to me and works quite well when utilized with two light wire gates and a solid locker at the apex, i often will throw an extra biner on just for redundancy. I have not heard of the method of girth hitching slings to the bolts, and agree that it would save weight, probably something i would not do if i had other gear but like the idea for the time i have no other choice, cheers. Its always great to learn something new. I also try to follow the acronym from John longs book, i believe it is s.e.r.n.e. (solid, equalized,redundant, no extension) If i am ever in doubt, i'll bulk it up. cheers
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duckwalk
Feb 1, 2004, 4:41 PM
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wait, wasn't there chains up there. Assuming they are also shiny, clip two lockers through the links, and youll be good to go. The chains aren't very dynamic, but if you're only toproping ( which is what I'm assuming here ) you should be fine.
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asandh
Feb 1, 2004, 7:16 PM
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:?:
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andy_reagan
Feb 1, 2004, 11:51 PM
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what would be the reason that you would want one sling modified so it is acting as two slings when its just as easy to buy 2 slings? They dont cost that much.
(honest question I know next to nothing about anchors :oops: )
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din
Feb 1, 2004, 11:53 PM
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I use the conrad anker.
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rokshoxbkr19
Feb 2, 2004, 12:14 AM
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wow, there are a scarey number of people who don't know what they are doing on this site and should, as all facts seem to be displayed, BE DEAD.
NEVER GIRTH HITCH A BOLT, if you fall on a sling girth hitched on a bolt it will most likely fail. bolts are not designed for webbing or slings to be put through them
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rokshoxbkr19
Feb 2, 2004, 12:21 AM
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The simples system:
Clip a locker into each bolt. Clip a runner into the anchor carabiners: then grasp the top part of the runner, between the two anchors, and put a half twist in it, forming a loop. Then clip the loop and the bottom part of the runner together with a locker. The loop in the runner prevents the biner from simply sliding off of the sling incase of anchor failure
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whipper
Feb 2, 2004, 1:24 AM
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wow, are we talking sport climbing here? how about a quick draw on each bolt with the ones on the rope opposite and opposed.
a sling girth hitched through a bolt hanger will MOST LIKELY FAIL???????what, do you people climb or just read books???? It is not the best, but it will NOT most likely fail. The (oh so scary) death x as you call it is fine if you have climbed at all tell me how many slings you have broken? how many bolts have you pulled??? give me a brake people, you dont have to use it but it is NOT unsafe. why not just use some 1/2 inch static rope and 14 steel locking carbineers?
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nickb
Feb 2, 2004, 1:41 AM
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sport top rope anchor: two draws with lockers on each end.
Multipitch : Spectra double runner, two lockers on the bolts and a figure eight to form a power point. Clip in with a locker to the power point and then back it up by clipping to one of the bolts . Use the other bolt to belay the rope through.
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redpoint73
Feb 2, 2004, 3:05 AM
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2 Draws.
Quick, and no fuss in setting up.
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mrme
Feb 2, 2004, 3:30 AM
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i use two draws.
has anyone seen the fish sliding x-anchor system?
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simplistic
Feb 2, 2004, 5:45 AM
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SERNE or SRENE as ASANDH noted in that posting is the only way to go, the reason for tying off the sling with an overhand is so the system becomes redundant. This means that once the direction of force has been determined on the anchor, the overhand allows the sling to function as two seperate entities. This means that if a portion of the sling should become compromised the oppositte side of the knot will still be solid. The meaning of redundancy is doing more than is absolutly neccessary, so that if and or when the shit goes down, you will be backed up. If a person is learning to build anchors it always helpful to consider what would happen if each portion of the entire system should fail individually. This means considering what would happen if bolts were to go, if a biner should shear or become compromised in any way, either at the bolts themselves or at the apex of the system. If any one piece coulf fail and result in the entire anchor failing then it is not redundant. In reference to my previous posting, some people, including myself at times, will substitute wire gates for lockers at the bolts, to safe weight only, this is only done by me on routes I know well and am attempting to save time. However, anyone who is just beggining should be fully redundant, including at the apex of the anchor, either with two lockers, or two wire gates oppossed and oppossite. If in doubt always back it up, and always ask the questions, cheers.
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strider
Feb 2, 2004, 8:36 AM
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In reply to: wait, wasn't there chains up there. Assuming they are also shiny, clip two lockers through the links, and youll be good to go. The chains aren't very dynamic, but if you're only toproping ( which is what I'm assuming here ) you should be fine.
Just wanted to clarify and say to make sure you clip the chain LINKS and not the rings at the end of the chains. The rings are for rap only and and you should not clip a biner to them. Regardless of steel or aluminum.
-n
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jt512
Feb 2, 2004, 8:10 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: wait, wasn't there chains up there. Assuming they are also shiny, clip two lockers through the links, and youll be good to go. The chains aren't very dynamic, but if you're only toproping ( which is what I'm assuming here ) you should be fine. Just wanted to clarify and say to make sure you clip the chain LINKS and not the rings at the end of the chains. The rings are for rap only and and you should not clip a biner to them. Regardless of steel or aluminum. -n
For sport clibming? Two draws. Period. Remainder of thread is D1.
-Jay
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coldclimb
Feb 2, 2004, 8:18 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: wait, wasn't there chains up there. Assuming they are also shiny, clip two lockers through the links, and youll be good to go. The chains aren't very dynamic, but if you're only toproping ( which is what I'm assuming here ) you should be fine. Just wanted to clarify and say to make sure you clip the chain LINKS and not the rings at the end of the chains. The rings are for rap only and and you should not clip a biner to them. Regardless of steel or aluminum. -n For sport clibming? Two draws. Period. Remainder of thread is D1. -Jay
True. Keep it simple guys.
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cfnubbler
Feb 2, 2004, 9:42 PM
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Single pitch sport- 2 draws and dirt me.
Multipitch sport (swinging leads)- 2 loop eight or 2 loop bowlin and two lockers.
Multipitch sport (leading all pitches)- 4-5ft sewn runner used cordalette style. Clip-in with a fat locker and eight on a bight on the climbing rope. No magic X.
The responses to this thread are scary.
-Nubbler
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fredrogers
Feb 2, 2004, 9:55 PM
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If someone needs help setting up this anchor, I think they need to go hire a guide and take a class.
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superbum
Feb 4, 2004, 11:47 PM
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Yea...Nubbler has got it right...nice work. Don't forget an extra locker for your directional/belay biner on the multipitches!
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