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robscate
Apr 10, 2002, 5:46 AM
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I was wondering how many different techniques there are for bailing off of the middle of a sport climb. I have seen a few rather questionable ones. ie feeding the rope directly through the bolt hanger (pls don't make me explain the dynamics of the rope over the sharp edge of the hanger)
Rob c
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upfreak
Apr 10, 2002, 6:00 AM
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Just jump...
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miagi
Apr 10, 2002, 11:56 AM
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your post is somewhat similar to the previous one. If you bailing out on the route then simply put your draw on the bolt, hook in, and lay back (or if you cant reach the bolt, free fall). You can leave the draw for the next person up the route.
If it's the end of the day, and you want to collect all your draws, there are a few things you can do.
1. Setup a top rope and rap down to get your draw you left behind.
2. Try as hard as you can to reach the shuts or have your partner try. Then rap down from them since they are permenant.
3. (This method is sketchy) Some say placing webbing through the bolt and lowering directly from the webbing works. Im not sure I would try this because the webbing just might melt if too much friction is present.
4. Just leave the draw for the good of someone else (doubt you want to do that)
5. Carry old biners with you up on the route. When you get to the last bolt that you can reach, put in your old biner, thread your rope through it, take off the draw, and lower away.
There might be more ways to get your draw but these are the ones to my knowledge
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crux_clipper
Apr 10, 2002, 12:42 PM
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Depending on how high up you are, and how difficult the climb is, just downclimb.
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rrrADAM
Apr 10, 2002, 1:41 PM
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You can just use a biner off of a draw if you don't have a "leaver biner" or quick link, no need to leave the whole draw.
But bear in mind that you are trusting your life to one piece of gear as you lower and clean the rest of your draws, and that's bad practice.
rrrfADAM
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kelownaclimber
Apr 10, 2002, 1:48 PM
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Quote:3. (This method is sketchy) Some say placing webbing through the bolt and lowering directly from the webbing works. Im not sure I would try this because the webbing just might melt if too much friction is present
Mike what the hell are you saying here????? Everyone, please NEVER EVER lower directly off a sling.It WILL break. If you are using sling through a bolt you must rapp off of it.The safest way to bail is to use a biner.Bail biners are something you should carry.If you are too cheap to buy some for that purpose then buy quicklinks at the hardware store!!!!!!
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theamish
Apr 10, 2002, 1:50 PM
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Use a quick link (like the ones made for slicing chains together) they're cheap
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phylp
Apr 10, 2002, 4:27 PM
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Miagi-
I am really horrified that you even made the suggestion that someone might LOWER thru webbing. I've got to add my two cents to the correct comment above: NEVER EVER EVER lower thru webbing; always rappel. NEVER EVER EVER toprope thru webbing either.
Phyl
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robscate
Apr 10, 2002, 4:27 PM
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The point about rappelling offof only one loop of webbing is something I have seen done more that once, I just close my eyes and wait for the sickening thud and bounce when the webbing melts/breaks. I like the idea of snap links, they are a lot cheaper than 'biners and can be purchased in bulk from climbing companies that sell bolting equip.
Robc
[ This Message was edited by: robscate on 2002-04-10 12:34 ]
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miagi
Apr 10, 2002, 7:04 PM
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Jesus people, im saying a suggestion that someone else had, and the only reason I stated it was so that people know that it is "sketchy" and dangerous, incase they get the idea of doing it. Read my quote....
Quote:
3. (This method is sketchy) Some say placing webbing through the bolt and lowering directly from the webbing works. Im not sure I would try this because the webbing just might melt if too much friction is present.
I specifically said the webbing could melt and I would not use it.
[ This Message was edited by: miagi on 2002-04-10 12:05 ]
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theamish
Apr 10, 2002, 7:37 PM
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It was listed as your 3rd method. The question asked for techniques, not methods of possibly ending your life. I can't speak for everyone else but the price of the most expensive biner made doesn't compare with your neck. People jumped you because even though you gave this as a "sketchy" method, you listed it as a method that sounded like a means of being lowered by belay. It's not even a good idea as a rap anchor.
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mauta
Apr 10, 2002, 8:32 PM
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Lowering a climber off a sling is not even an unsafe method,
IT IS DEFINITELY A DEADLY ONE !!
NEVER, NEVER, NEVER TRY IT !!!
It is amazing HOW QUICK THE SLING BREAKS BY MELTING !! (just a few meters of lowering is enough to completely melt the sling...)
Please, read the following article from the UIAA journals, where some very interesting tests are exposed (you need Acrobat Reader, because it is in PDF format)
http://journal.uiaa.ch/archive.asp
The article in question is in the 3/2000 issue, on page 20 and is titled:
"Lowering off and abseiling - a huge difference".
JUAN
[ Este Mensaje fue editado por: mauta el 2002-04-10 13:55 ]
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crazywacky
Apr 10, 2002, 9:20 PM
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Miagi,
Sorry my suggestion got you so much flack..
Everyone else,
In a different thread, here: http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=8719&forum=18&start=0
The discussion about lowering and rappelling off of webbing first came up.
I understand some people have great respect for safety, and I'm not knocking that.
However, if you read my post, you may understand the situation a little better.
The group of climbers I was with at the time had much more experience than I, between 5 and 10 years depending on the person, and none of them even thought twice about being lowered off a climb using webbing as the only point of contact. That was the way we did things. Keep in mind, this is still almost seven years ago..
Even then though, it's not like we were letting the rope fly through the ATC. All lowering off, whether on chains, cold-shuts, whatever, was done slowly.
Safe? Not very. Maybe not at all.
But that's what we did.
And I'm curious how 1 inch webbing would compare with the 5 - 10 mm cords they were using in their test at the UIAA in that article...Guess I'll load up a haul bag and check that out this weekend...
Later..
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mauriceb
Apr 10, 2002, 9:33 PM
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What are snaplink/quicklinks?? Although I haven't had to bail off a route yet (leading at an impressive 5.8/) I'm sure it will come up and something and the idea of leaving behind my $3.68 REI ovals sucks . Are these something I can pick up at OSH HomeDepot etc.?
maurice
[ This Message was edited by: mauriceb on 2002-04-10 18:08 ]
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rrrADAM
Apr 10, 2002, 9:37 PM
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Removable chain links. Like those used to attach rap chains to the bolts, or draws at a gym to the wall.
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miagi
Apr 10, 2002, 11:41 PM
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It's ok crazy, im use to getting flack lol . Anyways, in the other post about bailing out, someone said that you can buy the links at a local hardware store. Im going to check out lowes and see if they have them.
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miagi
Apr 10, 2002, 11:51 PM
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Anyways since you people are still yelling at me, I said the webbing would melt and not to trust it. You would think that since i said that, it means that it's a "no-no".
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jt512
Apr 11, 2002, 12:38 AM
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Don't use quicklinks to bail from. It's not fair to the next climber, who is going to have to unscrew it and clean it. Leave a biner instead.
-Jay
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miagi
Apr 11, 2002, 12:57 AM
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Get some omega pacific biners, or the Petite dru biners which are from http://www.rockempire.com. $4
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