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far_east_climber
Apr 13, 2004, 12:36 PM
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Just wondering how many of you buy your hexes already wired/stitched with sling or if you just buy the piece and string it up with cord yourself. I want to buy a couple more hexes unstrung as it's cheaper but I have been told strung ones are much safer (for obvious reasons). So, what do you reckon, cord them up myself?
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phylp
Apr 13, 2004, 6:59 PM
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What are the "obvious reasons" that prestrung stuff is safer? I'd welcome feedback from the other trad climbers on my belief that a self-tied cord or runner is as strong as a sewn runner. I use a water knot. The difference is you need to inspect it everytime you pull out the rack to make sure the tails are not getting too short. But I inspect my gear every new day I rack up, whether I'm climbing sport or trad. IMO the only real advantage of the sewn runner is that it's a narrower profile than a knot. Comments?
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melekzek
Apr 13, 2004, 7:06 PM
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In reply to: What are the "obvious reasons" that prestrung stuff is safer?
If somebody trusts too much on the prestrung stuff, it might become obviously less safe, since you would not need to check it as much as you would have been checking your own knots. imho both are good, and both needs to be checked frequently.
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gunked
Apr 13, 2004, 7:09 PM
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I agree with Phylp on the unstrung part and completely disagree with his method of stringing. Sorry dude! :roll: If for not other reason, the fact that it can untie alot easier. Unfortunately, flat webbing should always be tied using a water knot and that's why cord beats it out in this circumstance.
The preferred method of stringing hexes is with 5.5 mm spectra, gemini or the like. I prefer Spectra. :wink: The knot recomended is back to back triple fisherman's knots. On some of the larger sizes ( I believe #9, #10 and #11) you can actually construct the knot inside of the hex itself.
That's my 2 cents! :wink:
-Jason :D
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overzealous
Apr 13, 2004, 7:33 PM
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There was a post about this sometime ago on rec.climbing.... I believe that a double fishermans is actually more secure for line types that have some friction (i.e. gemini and the like) since the middle loop is not tightened as much by friction as with a triple fishermans.
The triple fishermans is still preferable for spectra and other "slippery" materials.
Hope this helps...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=4m400b%248iq%40usenet.srv.cis.pitt.edu&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26q%3Dtriple%2Bfishermans%2Bphil%2Bsidel%2Bgroup%253Arec.climbing%26meta%3Dgroup%253Drec.climbing
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fitz
Apr 13, 2004, 8:25 PM
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FWIW, I prefer to buy hexes unslung. I use modern 'super cord' (usually Spectra) for slinging. I like the Spectra because it is a bit stiff, which helps with some placements, but it is not so stiff that it precludes a placement - like wired hexes do for me.
I tie a double fishermans, which fits inside on all the sizes I still use. I can't picture why a triple fisherman's might be 'worse' on some cord - I'll have to go search for the thread mentioned. I use a double because it is easier for me to inspect, not because I think it is 'stronger' or 'safer'. And, put the emphasis on 'me' - I always do a double take when I look at a triple, it must be a mental block.
-jjf
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ben87
Apr 13, 2004, 8:39 PM
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and I take it you folks prefer cord over braided steel? I've got a few hexes and their all pre-strung with wire. I prefer the stiffness of it, and take it to be more durable and abrasion resistant than any cord. but I know people are of two minds about this and I wondered what people thought
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jono
Apr 13, 2004, 8:52 PM
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i use cord, not as stiff as the cable.
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phylp
Apr 14, 2004, 2:00 AM
Post #9 of 16
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Registered: Nov 3, 2001
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Gunked and others-
Of course you are right about the cord and I wouldn't use a water knot in cord. Thanks for pointing out a dangerous interpretation of my too fast writing.
I actually haven't carried any slung hexes on my trad rack for a long time! I carry wired nuts and camming units and a few lowe balls. At least 3/4 of my cam collection is original vintage friends with fixed stems. When I first bought them they did not come with webbing. I had them on webbing with water knots for years and then during one of my "broken" phases when I was out of commision for months, I sent them in to Wild Country for inspection, and now most of them are on sewn runners.
The point I was trying to make, obliquely it seems, is that you need to look at your gear.
By the way, fellow climbers, Phil is a guy's name, Phyl is a women's. But I'm a Californian so I don't mind being called dude!
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akclimber
Apr 14, 2004, 2:40 AM
Post #10 of 16
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Registered: Mar 17, 2004
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Evidence :lol:
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jono
Apr 14, 2004, 3:11 AM
Post #11 of 16
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youre gonna want a double at least. cord slipage
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keithlester
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Apr 14, 2004, 8:28 AM
Post #12 of 16
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I use the double fishermans in softer cord, and the triple in spectra, which is my favoured method. I dont put the knot inside the hex, as its too easy to forget to check it if its out of sight.
I must admit, the hexes I am buying these days with sewn slings are much lighter, easier to use and take up less spaece on your rack, so I would only now use cord if I was re-slinging a hex. I'm doing that today with one I rescued that was out all winter stuck in one of our local climbs.
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jgrierson
Apr 14, 2004, 8:39 AM
Post #13 of 16
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Registered: Nov 17, 2002
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Brought all my hexes separate and then brought the cord, all secured with triple fishermans knots and not had any problem with slippage or loosening. :righton:
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antepater
Apr 15, 2004, 2:05 AM
Post #14 of 16
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I'll just pipe up a bit. I used 5.5 spectra and depending on the size just got creative and tied the knot inside the hex. I prefer the selfslung. I used a double fisherman's to tie off. Use what ever you feel safe with. I usually inspect my gear manically, like a crack addict. You can never check too many times.
To respond about braided steele verse slings, It's all situational dependent, where your climbing and on what kind of stone. Sometimes you might want the stiffness of the braided steele to help aid with the setting other times have a sling is ideal. To each his own.
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rocknmedic
Apr 15, 2004, 2:59 AM
Post #15 of 16
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Registered: Jun 23, 2003
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I just restrung all mine with cord. If you look at CMCrescue.com they have a tech cord that is killer......5mm rated for 5,000 lbs.... the little 3mm is around 3,000 lbs.....
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fitz
Apr 15, 2004, 8:11 PM
Post #16 of 16
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Registered: Jul 15, 2002
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In reply to: and I take it you folks prefer cord over braided steel? I've got a few hexes and their all pre-strung with wire. I prefer the stiffness of it, and take it to be more durable and abrasion resistant than any cord. but I know people are of two minds about this and I wondered what people thought
Cable has its advantages - the pieces rack nicer, and it is stiff enough to extend your reach on a tricky placement, but I don't like it on hexes. The problem is that, since cable won't make a tight bend, you give up one placement orientation. I also don't think that the stiff cable works when you make a camming placement with a hex.
-jjf
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