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Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system?)
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pete_r


May 7, 2004, 8:08 PM
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Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system?)
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I have a quick question which I'm hoping I can phrase in a 'good style', so as not to recieve a host of abuse after lurking here for so long!

I am currently trying to work out the system which is going to be quickest for me, and having tried many (admittedly only on the bolts) I am hoping to try and stick with the two aider method (ala Karlbaba et al). However I am wonderng at what point this method becomes unusable due to the lack of a proper bounce test (ie: waist bounce only)?

A simple heads up in the right direction of an old post would be perfect though I have struggled to find a relevenat one

For those who are intersted the context behind this is that next summer a good friend and I are hoping for Tangerine Trip among others so I am looking to get my system smooth and hella fast :P before we get there!

Cheers for any advice

Pete


ricardol


May 8, 2004, 8:40 AM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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personally i think that using the 2 aider system on a wall as steep as the trip on your first big-wall (sounds like its your first big wall -- correct me if i'm wrong) .. will be slower than other systems ..

.. i guess unless you practice your ass off on 90 degree to 100 degree cracks ..

.. the only way to dial-in aider setups .. is to practice-practice-practice .. and in my opinion, you should be proficient with 2, 3, and 4 aider setups and have an idea of what works for you. under which situations ..

.. i originally had thougght that i would use 3 aiders on zodiac .. and quickly switched over to 4 aiders as soon as i saw the 1st pitch .. for my style it was way too steep to be doing the -- stand on one aider while i move the other aider thing..

.. of course practice makes the biggest difference ..

-- ricardo


ricardol


May 8, 2004, 10:51 AM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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You shouldn't be bounce testing with your feet in the ladders attached to the piece being tested. If it goes, you're taking a fall - either on the rope or on a daisy.

.. thats sounds like a load of BS ..

you can test with A foot in the ladder on the next piece .. while you have 1 foot on the current piece .. and a hand holding the piece .. that is enough to keep you from falling if the new piece pulls ..

-- ricardo


timpanogos


May 8, 2004, 11:01 PM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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Warning, this is a c1 placement method .

For example - assume you are daisied into a tested piece before step one:

1. hanging on daisy (not in steps) get your gear ready for next placement.
2. get on up there in those 2nd steps (ladders)
3. place pro and clip adj daisy – suck that daisy tight.
4. waist bounce that bad boy – and get right out of your aiders – now hanging on new pro on adj daisy.
5. suck yourself up with the adjustable daisy, while helping yourself up with your feet on the wall.
6. clip lead in lower piece, grab your aiders and clip them on the new piece.

I’ve found the real need for a 3rd/4th aider is for step 5 when you are pulling up to bodyweight only placements (i.e. a hook or other sketchy pro). The pulling up/climbing tends to be a bit jerky and semi shock loading on that new piece (bolts/solid larger cams you can really aggressively climb/suck up to). When you need to gently ascend – is also the times you want the solid bounce test anyway – that’s where you add the 3rd/4th aider to step 3 above – step 4 is a foot bounce test instead of waist, and gently climb the ladder to the 3rd step, suck up daisy tight knees to wall – basically off/out of aiders, clean clip/clean below repeat.

Yea yea, traversals are traversals but the above rule is about the same – ya happy with the next piece enough to place and basically get right on it with your adj daisy (typically with mini penji)?

It’s when you get that dang, slide on up (or over) there gently feeling that you want more than 2 – does not necessarily have anything to do with the actual steepness.

My 2 cents.

Chad


russwalling


May 9, 2004, 8:31 AM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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**You shouldn't be bounce testing with your feet in the ladders attached to the piece being tested.**

Flat out bad advice. Do a search on testing... I'm sure it is on here somewhere.
Next.....


timpanogos


May 9, 2004, 10:41 AM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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For some - going light and fast - decisions are made for 2/3/4 aider systems based on the whole route.

For us old slow guys - decide 3/4 based on route - then decide placement by placement rather to do a 2 aider or 3/4 individual movement.

does that make sense?


note:

this implies the Karl tecnique -i.e. you have 1 or 2 aiders that are not physically connected to your daisy - drop'em and cry!

Chad


justsendingits


May 9, 2004, 5:04 PM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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I use 3 aiders.


dsafanda


May 14, 2004, 4:27 PM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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In reply to:
personally i think that using the 2 aider system on a wall as steep as the trip on your first big-wall (sounds like its your first big wall -- correct me if i'm wrong) .. will be slower than other systems ..

I don't know...just used two aiders all the way up the Trip last weekend. I was never standing in more than one aider at any given time. Stand in one, keep the other clipped at your waist until you're ready to clip the next piece. I'll never go back to 3 or 4. Standing in just one aider forces you to get up high quickly and keep moving. I think you end up going faster. Granted, my aiders were Yates ladders, which makes walking up a single aider a bit easier. I'm still learning ofcoarse but I've had the opportunity to watch speed demons at work and I'm convinced their techniques work just as well for us mortals.


russwalling


May 15, 2004, 6:02 PM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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"feeble balk"

Not even sure what this means.

Bottom line: full on tests are best, there is an exception to every rule, and most people here will be far better off by just doing real tests and to quit cocking around. Don't discount the luck factor, be smart enough to save your own life by not blindly following RC.com posts, and if 1% of us ever get on the whatever pitch of the Reticent, we will probably not bounce test ourselves into the grave. Chalk that up to experience, luck, skill, nerves of steel, zero will to live, a better than average mechanical mind, and the onboard abiltiy to think on our feet.

Now what were you blabbing about?
Russ


russwalling


May 15, 2004, 6:07 PM
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Re: Waist Bouncing vs Full Bounce Test (another nOOb system? [In reply to]
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"feeble balk"

Not even sure what this means.

Bottom line: full on tests are best, there is an exception to every rule, and most people here will be far better off by just doing real tests and to quit cocking around. Don't discount the luck factor, be smart enough to save your own life by not blindly following RC.com posts, and if 1% of us ever get on the whatever pitch of the Reticent, we will probably not bounce test ourselves into the grave. Chalk that up to experience, luck, skill, nerves of steel, zero will to live, a better than average mechanical mind, and the onboard abiltiy to think on our feet.

Now what were you blabbing about?
Russ


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