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fishypete
Apr 22, 2002, 8:30 AM
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I have a pair of twin (half) ropes, if I remember around 8.5 mm.
Being half ropes, officially they should both be clipped through each protection biner.
However I have often heard that people only do this for the first few placements, and then begin clipping only 1 rope, i.e. reverting to a double rope system.
My questions are how many people out there do this? And what guidlines do you set yourselves about when to swap from twin to double technique?
Thanks maties!
Fishy.
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apollodorus
Apr 22, 2002, 8:49 AM
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Double rope technique usually means clipping every other piece with one rope or the other. That's the classic European method. If you're going to clip every piece, why not use a single 11mm rope? Or a single 10.2 Mammut SuperSafe rope?
I have a book by Rebuffat that shows the double rope method for reducing rope drag. You clip alternate pieces to keep the ropes straight.
On a wandering line, double ropes could be good. But, if you're clipping both ropes to the same piece, why use two ropes?
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fishypete
Apr 22, 2002, 10:19 AM
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Just a weight issue I guess, when you must take two ropes (e.g. for descent).
The info I have at the moment says that twin ropes go down to nearly 8 mm, quite a bit lighter than the comparable "double" ropes, which generally start around 9.5 mm (I think).
Is there no-one out there using twin (sub 9 mm) ropes??
I must be crazy!!
Fishy.
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pattray
Apr 22, 2002, 12:25 PM
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I use two 8.5 mm. they are classed as double ropes and not twin.
On wandering routes i will clip say the red on all pro placed to my left and clip the blue on all pro placed on my right, sometimes i may not clip the red for at least 2 or 3 clips up.
I first started climbing with my Dad in 1972 in Ireland and he climbed using two ropes.
I've never climbed with twin ropes, I really don't see the point, use a single or stick with doubles. I like using doubles even on straight forward climbs as it makes the desent go quick pluss you dont have to carry up a second rope on your back.
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fishypete
Apr 22, 2002, 12:56 PM
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By chance do you know the brand of your 8.5 double rope? This is exactly the reason I raised this point: I was given the info that the ropes I have (denoted 1/2 on the end stamp) should only be used as twin ropes.
I wonder if in fact they are double ropes!
Anyone know of other distinguishing features between double/twin ropes?
Thanks!
Fishy.
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theamish
Apr 22, 2002, 2:00 PM
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Double ropes (or half ropes) are used only in pairs. These ropes range from 8.2 to 9 millimeters in diameter and are identified by a number "1/2" within a circle on the label at the end of the rope. Double ropes may be clipped alternately through the protection, reducing rope drag and decreasing the chances of rope failure over an edge.
Twin ropes are a third classification offered by some manufacturers and are certified by the UIAA. These are delineated by a "ƒ" symbol (sometimes an "infinity" symbol) on the UIAA label. Both of the twin ropes are clipped through every protection point. The strands should never be separated. Twin ropes are uncommon in the United States. Double and twin ropes are designed to be used with a matching rope. Use of unmatched ropes will cause undue wear on one of the ropes, usually the one with the lowest working elongation or greatest diameter.
The preceding definition is from ORCA
[ This Message was edited by: theamish on 2002-04-22 07:14 ]
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tim
Apr 22, 2002, 2:35 PM
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Twins go down to 7.5mm. They feel like dental floss and scare the s--- out of me, but some people swear by them. You have to clip both ropes in the pair to each piece.
Doubles go down to 8mm and also scare the s--- out of me, but I lead on mine anyways because I don't have to carry a rap line that way (and more often, because I can climb with two seconds). They're great for ice where one rope can get the chop without the leader/second suddenly having to free solo. Mine are 9mm, but I *REALLY* wish I'd gotten 8.1mm lines now. I usually clip both through a given piece unless the going is tough or I know I'll be turning a corner, in which case I alternate or strategically reserve one or the other for the appropriate section. The UIAA standards say that one can alternate clips with doubles/half ropes (eg. their tests take this into account).
I think they're great when called for, otherwise too much hassle (eg. I would never lead a straight-up crack with a single partner on a set of doubles!). I don't think many people who don't climb ice or with multiple seconds are interested in investing that much money in a rope system.
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pattray
Apr 22, 2002, 10:52 PM
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Hey Fishy,
I have PMI 8.6 dry, Got them on a pro deal for around $156.00 for both.
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beyond_gravity
Apr 23, 2002, 12:05 AM
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I have one double rope that I use for mountaineering, I've never really seen...well...anyone using the double rope method on wonderting trad climbs, why not just get longer slings?? Just the way I see it.
Jeremy
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awsclimber
Apr 23, 2002, 2:27 AM
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When taking a fall one doubles, I have heard that the friction of teh two ropes sliding togethere can burn through one of the ropes in a frighteningly low fall. This is why they nearly demand that you buy twins or doubles at the same time......and why doubles are not often used in the USA, just alternate clips and safe yourself the worries
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Ned_Ludd
Jan 15, 2011, 3:41 AM
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I have a related question, sort of:
I bought twin ropes by accident, with the intention of buying half/double ropes. Very few people seem to use twin ropes and am having a hard time finding someone to buy them from me. My question is; has anyone every climbed on twin ropes but used them as half/doubles? they are on the larger end as far as twins go 8.0 mm. Half/double ropes go down to 8.0 mm so i am tempted to give it a go.
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marc801
Jan 15, 2011, 4:36 AM
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Resurrecting an almost 9 year old thread? That's gotta be a new record!
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patto
Jan 15, 2011, 7:42 AM
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marc801 wrote: Resurrecting an almost 9 year old thread? That's gotta be a new record!
Noob posters can't win.
If they ask a common question that get told to do a search. It they do a search and the post then they get chastised for grave digging.
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marc801
Jan 15, 2011, 2:56 PM
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patto wrote: marc801 wrote: Resurrecting an almost 9 year old thread? That's gotta be a new record! Noob posters can't win. If they ask a common question that get told to do a search. It they do a search and the post then they get chastised for grave digging.
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