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fadeux
Jun 29, 2004, 9:44 PM
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Ok, you may have read my last post (Gym Belay Rules?!?!) But anyway, im sick of little kids! Sick and tired of them! Now, i dont have many belay buddies, im very particular in whom I trust. So I do a lot of bouldering. As I pull into the gym parking lot today, i get cut off by a bus. Not a mini Van or even a full size conversion van, a BIG-@SS Yellow Cheesebox! Then, I watch, as 30+ kids go storming into the already child filled gym. I make a few comments as a sign in and hit the boulders. guess what, They're teaching BOULDERING TODAY! Oh goodie, so, the bouldering area is immediatly overrun with little brats. Of course, they sit them down on every mat in the gym, to give them 10 minutes of instruction. Even so, I'm sure only 3 kids are actually listening, and no one is going to take heed. THIS HAPPENS TO ME ALL THE TIME!!!! Im sick of this gym! I dont pay 45 bucks a month to have my bouldering mat dragged away when im two moves from the top, so some little dumb@ss can f-ck around on the overhang, or practice his backflips. I feel like I have fewer rights as a member than a day-pass person. The employees all say,"Wow, you just pick the wrong times." My schedule doesn't permit me the luxury of PICKING gym times. Does anyone at AZ on ROCKS have to deal with this stuff? Let me know,
Thanks
Edited to clairify that i DO NOT go to AZ on the Rocks, im looking to switch to it.
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nirvana
Jun 29, 2004, 9:51 PM
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I'm a member at AZ on the Rocks. No kid problems, the few times I've been there during the day. They have kids there for parties, but not herds of 'em. The owner assigns a good number of his staff to keep the kids in order. No running, no madness.
On Tuesday nights there is a climbing club that comes in to practice--kids around 10-14, for the most part. Not tons of 'em, and they know not to make pests of themselves. And some of them really crank.
The owner of the gym is very attentive to members' needs & comfort. And the woman who manages the place is top notch. She keeps order at all times and isn't shy about telling people what the rules are and making sure they abide by them.
I love the place.
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metakinjo
Jun 29, 2004, 9:53 PM
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Though I haven't had to deal with this issue where I live. I can totally understand what you are going through because of a similar situation I was in at another time. I myself have only been climbing for about 2 months and the gym I go to is very quiet with great staff and nice climbers (sorry for rubbing it in). But one time I was bouldering and I was a dyno away from the top and some stupid little girls (attending a birthday party) came over and took my mat. AS SOON AS THEY TOOK IT I FELL. Now the floor is pretty soft as it is, but no matter how you look at it, landing on your back hurts. So I feel for yah.
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fadeux
Jun 29, 2004, 10:06 PM
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In reply to: Grow up. Maybe you should consider that they're just kids, and that's what kids do. They goof around and have fun and generally don't follow instructions. They have every right to be at YOUR gym, don't they? Just ignore them and climb.
I CAN'T CLIMB, thats the point buddy... the kids run around with poor supervision and do whatever they please, Thats why im considering switching.
Edited to delete poorly thoughout comment on my part. Sorry whatsupdoc...
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turbo
Jun 29, 2004, 10:08 PM
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Well I derived that you are talking about SRG, from reading your previous post. To the gym's defense, they are a business and they need to make money to exist, and it is summer, kids are out of school.
I personally don't think they would survive with just member revenues, i.e. climbmax. The day pass revenue is what pays the rent. Kids go to the day camp, then they beg their parents to take them back, then the parents have their kids birthday party their. In turn its all more $$$, not to say that the owner is in it for just the money. Me being a member, I don't generate additional revenues like that model does.
SRG is a good gym, with good people who work there, and there are always good routes going up(Eric's routes).
But yes it does suck topping out on that v4 all pumped out ready to jump only to find there are 5 kiddies on your pad playing tag. Thing I hate most is the flying gri gris, and then the thud as it hits the wall. Watch out when those things are thrown, they are at the below the equator region and can have you seeing stars.
P.S. You are going at the wrong times. Week nights 8-10 is when its at. That is when all the hard plastic is pulled.
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climbsomething
Jun 29, 2004, 10:11 PM
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In reply to: Christ, you can't post anything on this place without making someone mad... |
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fadeux
Jun 29, 2004, 10:17 PM
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In reply to: Well I derived that you are talking about SRG, from reading your previous post. To the gym's defense, they are a business and they need to make money to exist, and it is summer, kids are out of school. I personally don't think they would survive with just member revenues, i.e. climbmax. The day pass revenue is what pays the rent. Kids go to the day camp, then they beg their parents to take them back, then the parents have their kids birthday party their. In turn its all more $$$, not to say that the owner is in it for just the money. Me being a member, I don't generate additional revenues like that model does. SRG is a good gym, with good people who work there, and there are always good routes going up(Eric's routes). But yes it does suck topping out on that v4 all pumped out ready to jump only to find there are 5 kiddies on your pad playing tag. Thing I hate most is the flying gri gris, and then the thud as it hits the wall. Watch out when those things are thrown, they are at the below the equator region and can have you seeing stars. P.S. You are going at the wrong times. Week nights 8-10 is when its at. That is when all the hard plastic is pulled.
Turbo, Thank you for the advice, I don't mean to rag on SRG so much, the staff there is cool, It's just frustrating that 2 out of 3 times, you cant get anything done there. Maybe if they set aside some members only time, that could really help. Today was just the straw that broke the camels back. I didn't have a belay partner, and couldn't use the bouldering area. Kind of like, "Hey, Why did i come here again?"
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fadeux
Jun 29, 2004, 10:18 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: Christ, you can't post anything on this place without making someone mad... Aren't you the one who posted mad?
Touche...
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eyecannon
Jun 29, 2004, 10:18 PM
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You think that's bad, there were 70 YMCA kids at my gym the other day... luckily it wasn't during business hours!
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gds
Jun 29, 2004, 10:21 PM
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I think this is a problem at many gyms.
My old gym (back in CT) solved it by opening a totally separate area for birthday parties, beginners, etc. I wonder why more gyms don't do the same.
That said the kids are only being normal kids and the gyms need as many folks paying admission as they can get so there is a need to be a bit tolerant. After all climbing is supposed to be fun and gym climbing is a controlled environment in which you should not be in a life or death situation.
On the other hand I want to kill the kids when I see the 11 year olds pulling 5.11 and the 13 year olds pulling 5.13. That means I should be pulling 5. --oh forget it!
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turbo
Jun 29, 2004, 10:24 PM
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That does suck, I have been there at times when there were bday parties or scouts. You spend more time worrying about others around you than yourself.
I took a big pendulum whipper last week and nearly knocked a mom off her feet, because she was in the lead area having no clue. The parents are just as naive there too.
Again if you can get there after 8PM you won't regret it, even on Fridays. We usually go out to dinner afterwards too.
Favorite quote so far that I have heard their, from a parent to a kid "Just grap the clippy thing and hang on that, thats why it is there." I had to say something then. Also don't be afraid to speek up if someone is doing something wrong. Sometimes being an a$$ to a kid or parent will keep them away from you.
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hns
Jun 29, 2004, 10:28 PM
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In reply to: Maybe you should consider that they're just kids, and that's what kids do. They goof around and have fun and generally don't follow instructions.
Sounds like a very good argument why they shouldn't be in a climbing gym un-supervised.
Sounds like they are endangering themselves and others (by stealing bouldering cushions that are in use for one). What if they got hurt or caused someone else to get hurt? I have no simpathy for the kids. There are tons of other places that cater to children and that are more appropriate to letting them goof around and disregard instructions.
Derek
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hosh
Jun 29, 2004, 10:48 PM
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Um, go outside and climb on real rock. You avoid the members fees, it's more fun, and on top of all that, there tends to be less little kids making things hard for you...
:lol:
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fadeux
Jun 29, 2004, 10:50 PM
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In reply to: Um, go outside and climb on real rock. You avoid the members fees, it's more fun, and on top of all that, there tends to be less little kids making things hard for you... :lol:
Well, I can't afford the rope yet, and then what could i complain about?
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hns
Jun 29, 2004, 10:52 PM
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In reply to: Um, go outside and climb on real rock.
I do that too. Sometimes it is easier to go to the rock gym.
In reply to: You avoid the members fees
But have to buy and replace gear and spend more on gas.
In reply to: it's more fun
More fun is like more comfortable, it is a matter of opinion.
In reply to: on top of all that, there tends to be less little kids making things hard for you
That's true, but doesn't change the fact that un-supervised kids do not belong at a rock gym.
Derek
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kev
Jun 29, 2004, 11:07 PM
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Go boulder for 3 months. Then you will have 135$ (3*45) which will buy you a rope at rei. Then buy a tibloc, fix a line and go climb....No belayer needed
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climbsomething
Jun 29, 2004, 11:08 PM
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In reply to: Go boulder for 3 months. Then you will have 135$ (3*45) which will buy you a rope at rei. Then buy a tibloc, fix a line and go climb....No belayer needed |
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climbinginchico
Jun 29, 2004, 11:39 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: Go boulder for 3 months. Then you will have 135$ (3*45) which will buy you a rope at rei. Then buy a tibloc, fix a line and go climb....No belayer needed Uh, this is a troll, right? RIGHT?!
God I hope so. :roll:
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itakealot
Jun 29, 2004, 11:40 PM
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Alfred Hitchcock of Kids: "I like mine cooked."
Or the witch from Hansel and Gretel made Gingerbread out of kids.
Luckily at my gym the Kids are there on the weekends and not during the week. Everyone makes sense on this post especially the posts with the revenue. Put yourself in the shoes of the owners of the gym and you might realize the kids are just a bunch of $'s running around.
You are also their customer, and they are obligated to hear your gripes or you can ask for a refund, no matter what is on your contract. Some gyms take deposits and if the kids interfere with the climbing experience of the paid members, then no deposit refund.
Anyway, looks like the parents at your gym believe in the free choice hooey of child upbringing.
You could also suggest that the gym doubles the membership and ban parties.
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punkclimber52
Jun 30, 2004, 12:18 AM
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fadeux, I understand your just venting right now, we all need to do it from time to time. I was a member at SRG and i loved it there. And yes, there were a few times when i would go and it would be overrun by little kids doing back flips onto the bouldering mats, swinging on the ropes, running right under you while your climbing, its just a part of climbing in the gym.
I've also been to AZ on the Rocks, i just didn't like that place as much. Different type of environment. I don't go to any gym now, climb outdoors too much.
Anyways, i would recommend stayin at SRG, but that's just me. You gotta do what ya gotta do. Go whereever works best for you.
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bighigaz
Jun 30, 2004, 1:12 AM
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In reply to: Well I derived that you are talking about SRG, from reading your previous post. To the gym's defense, they are a business and they need to make money to exist, and it is summer, kids are out of school. I personally don't think they would survive with just member revenues, i.e. climbmax. The day pass revenue is what pays the rent. Kids go to the day camp, then they beg their parents to take them back, then the parents have their kids birthday party their. In turn its all more $$$, not to say that the owner is in it for just the money. Me being a member, I don't generate additional revenues like that model does.
Okay, I've put together 5 years worth of financials- cash flow, budget, income statments, balance sheets all for a new climbing gym... Membership revenues are MASSIVELY important. Think about it. If you want to generate $500K is cash flow, you need almost 42,000 people to pay you 12 bucks! On the other hand, you need less than 1,500 annual memberships at $350 (a steal) to hit that mark. If you market it right, memberships can add up FAST, pay your bills, and then walk-ins would just be the icing on the cake... and that is some good icing!
From what I've read, I can't really judge SRG, they might be making a fortune off those kids... but I can tell you that any gym owner knows the value of membership sales, and knows that a balance between the them and walk-ins is also important. On top of that, member DO generate additional revenues. They keep coming back, and they bring people with them! Members advertise better than any other customers, because they are the meat of the indoor climbing community... They have the bug already, and it is very contagious to their friends.
As far as the original post, LIGHTEN UP. They ARE just kids, and they have found something that could change their lives for good! At the same time, a smart business owner should be genuinely interested in your concern and feedback, and may very well make a change to accomodate you (and I'm sure many others) with the same complaint. That's basic customer service.
In the mean time, SRG is alright... but AZ on the Rocks... ROCKS! The atmosphere is far more aesthetic, and they have a pretty sweet bouldering area. It might be time for a change!
Good luck, don't land on any kids if you can help it... you might hurt your back! :shock:
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iclimbtoo
Jun 30, 2004, 1:19 AM
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Man, I'm glad the dude I learned climbing from wasn't like you...He probably would have pushed me off the top of the Bastille! Chill out man...those little tykes are going to keep carrying this sport for generations to come. And on top of that, they were probably given an opportunity to take hold of something not many people get to try anyway. Climbing (or bouldering for your sake) isn't just YOUR sport...it's all of ours. Call me a "love-everyone-tree-hugging-hippie" I don't care...but you might want to nicely step down from that little "ego-trip" pedestal you're sitting on, or someone's going to kick it right up your a$$.
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c-money
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Jun 30, 2004, 1:25 AM
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In reply to: I dont pay 45 bucks a month ...
Let's say that group paid about $10 a head. 30+ kids = say $350? For what, 2 hours of climbing?
So, who is the better customer? The school group that spends about $350 for 2 hours a year, or the member that pays $45 for unlimited monthly visits and whines about the gym on internet forums... hmmm... Something for all of us self-important gym-rats to consider...
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fadeux
Jun 30, 2004, 1:28 AM
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In reply to: Man, I'm glad the dude I learned climbing from wasn't like you...He probably would have pushed me off the top of the Bastille! Chill out man...those little tykes are going to keep carrying this sport for generations to come. And on top of that, they were probably given an opportunity to take hold of something not many people get to try anyway. Climbing (or bouldering for your sake) isn't just YOUR sport...it's all of ours. Call me a "love-everyone-tree-hugging-hippie" I don't care...but you might want to nicely step down from that little "ego-trip" pedestal you're sitting on, or someone's going to kick it right up your a$$.
Well, I've cooled off by now, but this "Ego Trip" I'm on? These arent 13 year olds learning techniques and safely belaying each other. They're eight year olds just running around like morons, endangering their saftey and everyone around them. Not only are there parents NOT there, they have like 1 adult per 10 kids. I've seen kids climb up the wall and clip themselves to the lead clips (no ropes attached. 15 feet off the ground) I'm all about kids climbing, just not about the parents using the gym as a babysitting service.
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fadeux
Jun 30, 2004, 1:35 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: I dont pay 45 bucks a month ... Let's say that group paid about $10 a head. 30+ kids = say $350? For what, 2 hours of climbing? So, who is the better customer? The school group that spends about $350 for 2 hours a year, or the member that pays $45 for unlimited monthly visits and whines about the gym on internet forums... hmmm... Something for all of us self-important gym-rats to consider...
Yeah, sounds good on the numbers side, but, you haven't had to watch a little girl take a 30 foot digger simply cause her belayer had no idea what to do... And as far as whining about it on the internet forums. This would be an INDOOR ROCK CLIMBING FORUM (or MESSAGE BOARD) If you would know a better place to post a message about INDOOR ROCK CLIMBING, you just go ahead and let me know.
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