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alpinedude
Aug 12, 2004, 5:16 AM
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Any specific thing I should be doing while falling? Any position I should be in? Should I flap my arms like wings? What?
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musicman
Aug 12, 2004, 5:45 AM
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this question is asked quite often around here and generally people will just make fun of you or something like that and occasionally someone gives you something serious. i have never taken a "30 foot whipper" like most other people seem to have done. i have taken small lead falls on sport bolts. you really don't realize what has happened most of the time, it just happens, generally kicking out a bit is a good idea but not always if there is a possibility to swing back into the wall.
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kachoong
Aug 12, 2004, 5:56 AM
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...yeah, as musicman said, it's pretty much over before you know it.... unless it's a loooong one.... but that said, if you know you're about to fall, keep the rope between your legs, don't have the rope in your teeth, keep your legs bent a little to absorb a bit of the wall-crunching force and don't flap your arms like a bird..... try a few practise short falls on bolts on an overhanging route and get the feel for it....
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cgailey
Aug 12, 2004, 8:12 AM
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Make sure you scream really loud...that always helps...like a scream of desperation, or frustration :wink:
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overlord
Aug 12, 2004, 9:30 AM
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you should be falling :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: and SCREAMING
but, serioulsly, if you fall on a slab, try to WALK backwards. dont try to stop the fall, itll flip you over, just try to keep from scraping the rock.
on an overhang, pray that your belayer gave you enough slack and enjoy the ride, but be prepared to hit the wall with your arms and feet (better than with the head).
for vertical climbs, try to push out A LITTLE, so you dont scrap yourself, the prepare the legs to hit the wall.
think like a cat.
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jcshaggy
Aug 12, 2004, 9:57 AM
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Yup, watch where that damn rope is because it is painful when it catches your leg-and it might also flip you over.
Also brace your legs for the swing back into the rock.I hurt my right ankle when I slammed into the rock after a fall in April.
Once safely back on firm ground upon completion, drink beer and have a chuckle with your buddies!
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fanederhand
Aug 12, 2004, 10:43 AM
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In reply to: Any specific thing I should be doing while falling? Any position I should be in? Should I flap my arms like wings? What?
sounds like you and many of the posts here are not taking lead falls very seriouse. Falling is no joke, every leader takes them. I suggest you purchase Arno Ilgner's new book on "The Warriors Way"
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overlord
Aug 12, 2004, 10:54 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: Any specific thing I should be doing while falling? Any position I should be in? Should I flap my arms like wings? What? sounds like you and many of the posts here are not taking lead falls very seriouse. Falling is no joke, every leader takes them. I suggest you purchase Arno Ilgner's new book on "The Warriors Way"
in fact im taking it very seriously. but the truth is that once you fall, there really isnt much you can do. you just keep your head of the rocks and try to get messed up se little as possible.
the is (or isnt) made safe before it happens. you have to pay attention to where your rope is (that youre not "inside", meaning the rope is behind your leg, in fact a good belayer should warn you about it), look for things you might hit on the way down so you can avoid them, the proper amount of slack (again, a good belayer really helps here) and so on and so forth.
by saying that you have to look that you dont hit something, i dont mean that you should think all the time that you will fall, but if you see a dangerous feature, you better remeber where it is, especially if its right under the crux.
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jcshaggy
Aug 12, 2004, 11:03 AM
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I'm also being serious-I've seen what a rope can do to your leg if it catches it when you fall.It leaves a nice, nasty burn mark-take a shower or bath afterwards and tell me it isn't serious!
drinking a beer and sharing a laugh with your friends is just a form of celebrating that you are alright!
Others are being way too serious!!
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jt512
Aug 12, 2004, 6:23 PM
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In reply to: Also brace your legs for the swing back into the rock.I hurt my right ankle when I slammed into the rock after a fall in April.
No. You probably hurt your ankle because you "braced" your legs. You want to do just the opposite: relax, and let your knees and hips bend deeply to absorb the force when you hit the wall. Watch how a cat lands.
-Jay
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tawl
Aug 25, 2004, 5:15 PM
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If your belayer knows what he's doing you should never slam into the wall, no matter what the angle, excluding slabs and routes with bolts directly above big ledges. Learn the ways of the dynamic belay.
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tech_dog
Aug 25, 2004, 5:17 PM
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I just try to stay right side up...
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verticallaw
Aug 25, 2004, 5:32 PM
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hmmmm what to do when taking a lead fall........
1) survive.
2) survive
3) survive
aside from that...
thinking like a cat is good, try to kick off a bit, this can help you direct your fall is a healthy direction (ie. away from obstacles). When your coming towards the wall think of jumping on a trampoline and let your legs absorb the shock (your arms too if you can). The biggest concern I have when falling is a) obstacles b) gear failure and c) imapct. Falls happen pretty dang fast so preparing in advance is most helpfull. It may be good for you to practice falling in either a gym or sport climb. Climb past the bolt (usually a couple bolts up obviously) a short distance and jump, repeat this while increasing the distance you climb past the bolt gradually (ie: 1st fall 1 ft past bolt, 2nd fall 2 ft past bolt, 3rd fall 3 ft etc.) you'll get the hang of it pretty quick. Most people seem to underestimate the value of learing to lead fall properly.
hope this helps
Mike
P.s. lead falls on slab are a whole differnt beast, pray that it doesn't happen cause even controlled sucks! You may hear advice about turning and running with the fall.......... it's bad advice! I've seen it go horrably wrong.
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on_sight_man
Aug 25, 2004, 5:39 PM
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In reply to: If your belayer knows what he's doing you should never slam into the wall, no matter what the angle, excluding slabs and routes with bolts directly above big ledges. Learn the ways of the dynamic belay.
Never say "never". Even with the best belayer, if you were to hang the rope down like a plum line and it touches the wall at the end, then the faller WILL swing into the wall. I assume then that you mean anything that is not over-hanging is a slab...
On overhanging terrain, you will swing "in" to the wall at least as much as you are "out" from the last bolt. The belayer controls where this happens along the verticall by feeding slack, but that doesn't mean it's always possible to stop you from a slam. Consider a vertical climb with a roof after it. There are many instances where a slam is inevitable.
A good belayer can always minimize a slam, but just because you slam, don't blame the belayer.
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ntu_soca
Aug 25, 2004, 5:46 PM
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Another thing is not to grab the rope. I never thought of it as a problem until last weekend. I took a short fall, very short, but I grabbed the rope and when the rope came tight it smacked my hand into the wall between rope and rock. I lost a little flesh. But I can see how it could be a bigger problem on long falls. Correct me if I'm out of line on this one.
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sublimeclimb
Aug 25, 2004, 6:37 PM
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i'm with you, ntu_soca. i see lots of people grab the rope and i know that i've pinched my hands doing the same thing. another thing that seems dangerous to me is to grab the draw if you are going to fall and it is within reach. it's a natural tendency but i've gotten my hand pinched that way as well. for me, the best thing to do is relax and let it ride. just my opinion.
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climb_plastic
Aug 25, 2004, 7:05 PM
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Give it some thought before you climb a route and have a bit of a plan before you start. It won't always work out but it helps you psychologically when you get to the parts that looked tough and you've already thought the sequences and possible falls out.
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tawl
Aug 25, 2004, 7:36 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: If your belayer knows what he's doing you should never slam into the wall, no matter what the angle, excluding slabs and routes with bolts directly above big ledges. Learn the ways of the dynamic belay. Never say "never". Even with the best belayer, if you were to hang the rope down like a plum line and it touches the wall at the end, then the faller WILL swing into the wall. I assume then that you mean anything that is not over-hanging is a slab... On overhanging terrain, you will swing "in" to the wall at least as much as you are "out" from the last bolt. The belayer controls where this happens along the verticall by feeding slack, but that doesn't mean it's always possible to stop you from a slam. Consider a vertical climb with a roof after it. There are many instances where a slam is inevitable. A good belayer can always minimize a slam, but just because you slam, don't blame the belayer.
You're right, I shouldn't use the word "never."
It is possible to swing into the wall with a dynamic belay, but if its done properly you should not "slam" into the wall which to me means a hard, possibly harmful, impact. By dynamically lengthening the fall, the belayer reduces the momentum causing you to swing hard into the wall.
In a roof following vertical situation a dynamic belay should lengthen the swing enough that the impact should be relatively soft. The exception to this being if the pro is close to the back of the roof, the belayer can do nothing except decide which point you're going to hit the wall (like you said). In this case it is leaders fault for placing gear there, or possibly a poor bolt placement.
With that exception (there may be others I haven't thought of) unless you fall so suddenly that the belayer has no time to react and give a soft catch (ie hold breakage), or theres something under you that a long fall would cause you to hit thus requiring a tight catch, any impact with the wall should be minor. I have taken many falls on vertical to overhanging rock (RRG Local) and the only time i've harmfully slammed into the wall (sprained ankle) was when my belayer did the exact opposite of a dynamic belay by pulling in slack and locking off hard.
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on_sight_man
Aug 25, 2004, 8:02 PM
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In reply to: With that exception (there may be others I haven't thought of) unless you fall so suddenly that the belayer has no time to react and give a soft catch (ie hold breakage), or theres something under you that a long fall would cause you to hit thus requiring a tight catch, any impact with the wall should be minor. I have taken many falls on vertical to overhanging rock (RRG Local) and the only time i've harmfully slammed into the wall (sprained ankle) was when my belayer did the exact opposite of a dynamic belay by pulling in slack and locking off hard.
I agree. Funny thing. My girlfriend weighs slightly more than half what I do so I ALWAYS get a soft belay (unless she's tied in) much to her chagrin sometimes. On the other side, it's hard for me to give a soft belay to her because I sometimes don't even notice she fell until she yells at me :))
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dgkula
Aug 25, 2004, 8:45 PM
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Don't forget to yell:
"Aaararaaaaaaarrrggghhhhhh!!!!!!'
and stay upright.
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tawl
Aug 25, 2004, 10:34 PM
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In reply to: I agree. Funny thing. My girlfriend weighs slightly more than half what I do so I ALWAYS get a soft belay (unless she's tied in) much to her chagrin sometimes. On the other side, it's hard for me to give a soft belay to her because I sometimes don't even notice she fell until she yells at me :))
Hehe, yeah i weigh much less than most people i belay, so a soft catch is easy for me to do, the guy i usually climb with has to take a big jump as i fall to really give me a good soft catch
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ricardol
Aug 25, 2004, 10:48 PM
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In reply to: think like a cat.
umm .. sunny spot by the window ... zzzz.. zzzz.. zzzz
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tawl
Aug 26, 2004, 11:15 PM
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if you tied a cat to a rope and dropped it, i doubt it would look very graceful
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itakealot
Aug 26, 2004, 11:21 PM
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If your gear is zippering and you are 10 pitches up, stick your head between your legs and kiss your ass good-bye.
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climbingaggie03
Aug 26, 2004, 11:47 PM
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I generally try to get away from the wall just enough to keep from getting scraped, and keep your legs and arms relaxed to absorb the swing into the wall
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