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maculated
Feb 8, 2009, 8:57 PM
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So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What?
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irregularpanda
Feb 8, 2009, 9:04 PM
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maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What?
Money. Did you want to give it to me?
People always hate on the max-cam, but I love that shit. It's easy to get stuck, but not if you have a calm head and know how to place it.
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maculated
Feb 8, 2009, 9:06 PM
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Exactly. But if there are people dropping bucks just because the C4s are the thing (I still have the previous generation of Camalots), they should be checking out the Max Cams. It drives me nuts.
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sungam
Feb 8, 2009, 9:25 PM
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I've had a number 2 maxcam for around 2 or 3 years now, wait, when did they come out? NThe xmas right after that.
Anyways, I've heard a lot of talk about how they could walk and then flop and pull. I've used mine a lot, in a lot of different rock, and have never had this happen. I've never even heard of it happening, but "they" say it could happen, right?
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coolcat83
Feb 8, 2009, 9:48 PM
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sungam wrote: I've heard a lot of talk about how they could walk and then flop and pull. I've used mine a lot, in a lot of different rock, and have never had this happen. I've never even heard of it happening, but "they" say it could happen, right?
I've played with one in a store it seems like if properly placed that wouldn't be a problem. Any cam without stops can have that happen, I think it just looks scary when its such a different design than what people are used to. I like trango stuff and would gladly use them if I had the money to get some.
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sungam
Feb 8, 2009, 9:52 PM
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I think the worry comes from if they are tipped out or something, but while I haven't seen my maxcam flop (as I call it) it seems to be normal operating procedure for my HB cams to flop.
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adatesman
Feb 8, 2009, 10:56 PM
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maculated
Feb 8, 2009, 11:05 PM
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Weird? No no no.
You're AWESOME. YOu respect the Max Cam.
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angry
Feb 8, 2009, 11:09 PM
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I don't have any of them but I'd be willing to drop yours into a chasm if you'd like.
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adatesman
Feb 8, 2009, 11:23 PM
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ryanb
Feb 8, 2009, 11:49 PM
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I was all excited about the max cams when they first came out because they use the power of MATH. Then I heard they walked and flipped and were a specialized tool for people who knew how to use them.
My rack is a mix of recent vintage bd, metolius, forged friends and pre-recall aliens. All simple proven designs. The only one of the modern extended range cams that meets that criteria is the super cam and it comes in 3 sizes and has a dual stem...I'll be interested when they make a really big or a really small one.
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maculated
Feb 8, 2009, 11:55 PM
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You, Angry, will never touch the Max Cam.
You know, I still get vaguely annoyed when my second #1 is missing. The alien is cool, but it ain't red. :)
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angry
Feb 8, 2009, 11:58 PM
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Did I get you a hybrid? I can't really remember.
I've got a few (like 9) pieces in the #1 size and I've got to say that I like the 1 better than everything but the purple alien.
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tradrenn
Feb 9, 2009, 12:00 AM
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maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What?
Maybe because stem is too soft/wobbly.
That's my reason for not wanting them.
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sungam
Feb 9, 2009, 12:10 AM
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Specialist item? Not sure about that, but then I've heard mastercams called specialist.
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Lazlo
Feb 9, 2009, 12:28 AM
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sungam
Feb 9, 2009, 12:36 AM
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tradrenn wrote: maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What? Maybe because stem is too soft/wobbly. That's my reason for not wanting them.
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irregularpanda
Feb 9, 2009, 1:31 AM
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adatesman wrote: Anyway, I've seen the flop happen and can do it at will when fiddling with a Maxcam in a parallel placement, but have never seen it happen in actual use.
I've seen that happen. Luckily didn't fall on it. Basically what I do when dealing with those Indian Creek type cracks, is I use the max-cam at the smaller end of it's range. That's it, it's simple.
Contrariwise---when using it in granite with some bump or divot in the crack, they tend to get stuck when placed in a hasty fashion.
Bottom line, use your brain when you climb with them.
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angry
Feb 9, 2009, 1:44 AM
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I have used Max Cams and don't like them. Too bad, when I first heard about them I was really looking forward to them.
Basically my problem is that to keep them in a safe range, you can't really use their expanded range. There's no range advantage at all when you talk "usable" range.
Not scared, I just don't see them as progress.
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maldaly
Feb 9, 2009, 2:58 AM
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Hey gang,
Thx for the props on the MaxCams. I think you have it right... you need to use your head when you place them. They'll definitely open up some placement options for you but if you're a "plug and go" kind of climber, you're probably better off with a symmetrical cam. BTW, Indian Creek is NOT the place where they shine. Regular cams work great there. The weirder the rock gets, the better the MaxCams work.
We're working on a very cool triggering concept that should allow anyone to "plug and go" with them. Might be next year before you see them though.
Aric... I love you. sure, you're weird, but you're the only other climber I've met who uses a # 5 TriCam. That thing RULES!!!! I find a way ccol placement for it nearly every pitch I climb. It weighs nothing and is indispensible for huecos and stacked blocks. My partners hate me for it. Dude, we've got to go climbing together. When are you coming back to Boulder?
Maculated... you coming out to RRR or ar you making so much money now that you can't take any time off?
Mal
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maculated
Feb 9, 2009, 3:09 AM
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Hey Mal . . .
Yishai was thinking he wanted to go since he's doing the Pine Mountain Pulldown AND the Climber Carnival this year. I keep going, "You don't need to go - I've been."
Maybe I will. Dunno.
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maldaly
Feb 9, 2009, 3:12 AM
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Please come...
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Valarc
Feb 9, 2009, 3:14 AM
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I'm not much of a gear climbing guy, but I am a total geek for the physics and engineering of how the things work. I have seen the "flop" described but never actually seen it in action - could someone post a picture or drawing of what's going on, to satisfy my curiosity without me having to buy a cam just to fiddle with?
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adatesman
Feb 9, 2009, 3:20 AM
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maldaly
Feb 9, 2009, 3:26 AM
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Sweet!!! When you here?
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maculated
Feb 9, 2009, 3:33 AM
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I'll think about it. Thanks for asking. :) It would be great to see you and many others again now that I'm fixed! It's a tough timing thing - I'll have been in Texas for a week for a meeting for this board I'm on.
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caughtinside
Feb 9, 2009, 3:34 AM
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what angry and malcolm said.
I´m a plug and go guy.
Wham bam thank you cam!
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adatesman
Feb 9, 2009, 3:42 AM
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maldaly
Feb 9, 2009, 4:06 AM
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it was 65° and sunny here last thursday so come on out!
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tradrenn
Feb 9, 2009, 9:00 AM
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sungam wrote: tradrenn wrote: maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What? Maybe because stem is too soft/wobbly. That's my reason for not wanting them. Wait, the mastercams or the maxcams?
Max Cams.
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Lazlo
Feb 9, 2009, 3:19 PM
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tradrenn wrote: sungam wrote: tradrenn wrote: maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What? Maybe because stem is too soft/wobbly. That's my reason for not wanting them. Wait, the mastercams or the maxcams? Max Cams.
I agree.
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climbinginchico
Feb 9, 2009, 3:29 PM
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I have a full set and like them. They are definitely a specialty piece however. I don't take them up all that often because I carry my C4's and then the link cams as doubles. If the rock is really funky and irregular I will take them as they really shine in funky placements where other cams can be loaded strangely. But due to the offset stem they load properly and are bomber.
I've never had a problem using them, and found them rather useful in jtree. I always extend the double sling on the cam and normally extend the runner I clip to the cam if the route wanders at all. They are also a very solid piece for anchoring, which is what I use them for most often. I also don't find the stem too floppy. Yes it's softer than a C4 or link cam but definitely not nearly as floppy as my aliens.
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adatesman
Feb 9, 2009, 3:51 PM
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sungam
Feb 9, 2009, 7:40 PM
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tradrenn wrote: sungam wrote: tradrenn wrote: maculated wrote: So why is it that everyone loves my Max Cam, but no one wants to get them? Marketing? Fear? What? Maybe because stem is too soft/wobbly. That's my reason for not wanting them. Wait, the mastercams or the maxcams? Max Cams.
I'll have to chuck that out.
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mtnkid85
Feb 9, 2009, 7:43 PM
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Ive climbed on the .5,1,2,3 for ~1.5 years now and have used them as my workhorse cams. I wouldnt call them a specialty piece either. Ive always slung them fairly long, and prefer them in there smaller side of there range. Ive seen them do the one sided tip out before, but only on pieces where the rope has pushed them around going up a bulge when your higher on the route. Ive also recently found myself reaching for a different piece if I know Im going to have to make a scary pumped blind placement.
All in all im starting to have mixed emotions about them, they are as bomber as anything in the smaller side of there range, but can be a little scarry out towards the upper end of there sizing. I love the thumb loops, extendable slings and the general build of them. I dont know that Ill buy any more but Ill keep the ones I have.
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maculated
Feb 9, 2009, 7:44 PM
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They are a touch floppier, but not any more than the Aliens. I used to hate those until I got used to them.
Max cam is FABULOUS in J Tree. Absolutely.
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adatesman
Feb 9, 2009, 8:11 PM
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Valarc
Feb 9, 2009, 8:37 PM
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Thanks for the video - that makes perfect sense now, and is not at all what I was picturing in my head. Very interesting.
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billcoe_
Feb 9, 2009, 8:40 PM
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I think if I predominantly climbed at JTree or someplace that had sick huecos or horizontals, the Maxcams would be the go to #1 choice for me. For parallel sided cracks not so much although they'll work fine if you use them on the lower end range as Angry and Malcom say. Comparing notes with my partner in Red Rocks when I first got the MaxCams, both of us would reach for the #2 MaxCam over the Camalot in that size.
It's a well built piece that has a place in my world for sure.
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mtnkid85
Feb 10, 2009, 8:48 PM
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Alright this is a little off topic and some of you may have seen this too. But the second page of this thread over in the trad section is one of the larger reasons I prefer my Trango gear to many other manufacturers.
Linky:http://www.rockclimbing.com/...d;page=unread#unread
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