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Skidemon27
Jun 11, 2009, 2:42 PM
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birthday is comin up and im getting a new rope.
i wanna stay within the 150-220 dollar price range....i neew to trad climbing,, but not new to the climbing world..... i want a 9.8mm size rope so it works well with a gri-gri.(even though i know its meant for 10mm and up).....but i got a 9.8 petzl zypher GREEN!!! and it seems to work well with the gri-gri...jut wondering with all the new ropes out if anyone reckomends any model or type.
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shimanilami
Jun 11, 2009, 2:47 PM
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Sterling Marathon Pro, 10.1. It doesn't get any better than this.
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chilli
Jun 11, 2009, 3:04 PM
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shimanilami wrote: Sterling Marathon BiAthlon Pro, 10.1. It doesn't get any better than this.
NOW, it doesn't get any better 
nice perk for about $14 extra
edit: after reading OP, i quickly realized we're both out of your size range AND price range, unless you find a better deal than the norm. sorry
(This post was edited by chilli on Jun 11, 2009, 3:06 PM)
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Skidemon27
Jun 11, 2009, 3:11 PM
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nah i forgot to mention i have a 20% coupon at EMS that im gonna use for the rope. as for thickness. i dont care to much just dont wanna go any thinnner then 9.8mm...........i will be usin it for trad
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shimanilami
Jun 11, 2009, 3:17 PM
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chilli wrote: shimanilami wrote: Sterling Marathon BiAthlon Pro, 10.1. It doesn't get any better than this. NOW, it doesn't get any better
Thread drift ...
I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark. I prefer to thread my rope's midpoint with dental floss, which can be easily replaced.
Regarding price, they are ... pricey. But you only need one 20% off coupon to bring it into range.
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chilli
Jun 11, 2009, 3:27 PM
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shimanilami wrote: chilli wrote: shimanilami wrote: Sterling Marathon BiAthlon Pro, 10.1. It doesn't get any better than this. NOW, it doesn't get any better Thread drift ... I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark. I prefer to thread my rope's midpoint with dental floss, which can be easily replaced.
i used to do the floss mark too. i still love the bicolor, b/c i haven't had to trim before 'retirement' to TR rope, so it's been a non-issue (full disclosure: weekend warrior climbing use only). good point though.
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livinonasandbar
Jun 11, 2009, 3:54 PM
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Skidemon, compare the specs of the Mammut 10.2 Supersafe rope with any other. For trad, it's hard to beat. And, it handles beautifully...
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petsfed
Jun 11, 2009, 3:55 PM
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shimanilami wrote: chilli wrote: shimanilami wrote: Sterling Marathon BiAthlon Pro, 10.1. It doesn't get any better than this. NOW, it doesn't get any better Thread drift ... I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark. I prefer to thread my rope's midpoint with dental floss, which can be easily replaced. Regarding price, they are ... pricey. But you only need one 20% off coupon to bring it into range.
I just use a burly enough rope that I don't have to trim it. That also means never getting it stuck, which has become an object of pride for me.
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marc801
Jun 11, 2009, 4:07 PM
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shimanilami wrote: I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark.
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Skidemon27
Jun 11, 2009, 4:52 PM
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i did on my 10.3 petzl zypher. fraid apart like 2 dollar whore working overtime
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petsfed
Jun 11, 2009, 5:16 PM
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tigerlilly wrote: petsfed wrote: I just use a burly enough rope that I don't have to trim it. That also means never getting it stuck, which has become an object of pride for me. You know you are doomed, now that you have said that, right? Kathy
Actually, while everybody else was getting their ropes stuck whilst rappelling from Devils Tower (a notorious rope eater), we never had a problem. Its that 14 years of experience thing. I don't expect I'll keep this streak forever, but I recognize that it was only in the first few years that I was getting by on luck.
Also, I have had to chop 15 feet off of a rope once. Coreshot on a too-delicate line. Lesson learned. For where I climb, you need a burly cord, and you don't want to pay too much, since it'll get thrashed anyway.
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vegastradguy
Jun 11, 2009, 5:23 PM
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sterling velocity- 9.8mm, works great with a grigri. i use the bi-pattern one, but the regular is priced right and is a great line.
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shimanilami
Jun 11, 2009, 5:30 PM
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marc801 wrote: shimanilami wrote: I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark. In 35 years of trad climbing anywhere from 60 to 150 days per year, I've never once had to trim an end of a rope before it was retired. Nor have any of my partners.
Perhaps I've just got bad luck. I've had rock fall severe my rope nearly in half. I've also had a rope get so fried ~10ft from the tie-in point due to falls (sport climbing, admittedly), that it was too stiff to continue use.
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shoo
Jun 11, 2009, 6:08 PM
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Skidemon27 wrote: i did on my 10.3 petzl zypher. fraid apart like 2 dollar whore working overtime
If I were your rope, I'd probably kill myself too*
And to help out any others who may wander by this thread later:
I generally prefer thinner lines for trad. Durability is less of an issue when I climb trad, since I'm less likely to be hang-dogging, taking a ton of falls, or TRing. Thinner lines reduce rope drag and are marginally easier to clip. They also feed really nicely through belay devices. This makes it easier to add just a little slip when catching a fall to soften it, and makes belaying directly off an anchor from above a little more pleasant.
I use a Sterling Ion (9.5) for most single pitch trad and a pair of Mammut Genesis half ropes (8.5mm) for ice and multi-pitch.
As for the Marathon, it's a fantastic, unbelievably durable cord, but is pretty much the opposite of what I look for in a trad rope. It's a bit stiff and feels just a bit thicker than 10.1. That being said, if I could only have one rope to use for everything (TR, sport, trad, ice), you can bet that the marathon would be high on my list of potential purchases.
* Hoo boy, I feel a banzing coming. I love mods?
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markcarlson
Jun 11, 2009, 6:49 PM
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marc801 wrote: shimanilami wrote: I disagree. If you ever need to trim your rope, which is not unusual with trad ropes, then you've got a bi-pattern rope with an inaccurate mid-point mark. In 35 years of trad climbing anywhere from 60 to 150 days per year, I've never once had to trim an end of a rope before it was retired. Nor have any of my partners.
Hmmm, that makes me wonder if I should retire my rope instead of just putting it into light duty work...
My rope is a 70m 10mm Mammut Galaxy Duodess, and due to a shortage of ropes that day, got put into use as a lead rope on a trad multi-pitch climb. My buddy fell 6 or 7 meters on less than vertical terrain when he was over 40 meters out on the third pitch (did not hit a ledge.) When we were bailing (he broke his ankle,) I checked the rope and noticed a core shot 3 meters from the end of the rope. I also noticed the sheath was pretty abraded on one side for about 2cm, but couldn't see the core. It was almost new at the time, with no fuzzing at all.
After I got home, I checked the rope, and saw that two of the sheath strands had been cut through all the way. The cuts were very straight, almost like it had been cut with a knife. I could see the core if I moved the underlying strands away, but the core felt OK if I pinched and rolled the rope with my fingers. This was really far into the rope, but the sheath damage was worrying. After consulting with someone more experienced than me, I decided to chop the rope and just use it for light-duty use (down to 48m, from the original 70+m.)
After chopping, I dissected the rope and was glad I chopped it. Small parts of the under part of the sheath had fused to the core, and there was one additional sheath strand that had been cut all the way through.
As for how the damage occurred, I don't really know. The route went straight up for 5m, then the leader was out of sight the rest of the time. The route itself zig-zags quite a bit after that, but I'm unsure of which way the leader went. There was lots of sharp rocks and cracks for the rope to get stuck in / loaded over, and not much force on the belayer when the fall took place. The leader skidded down on his hand and feet (breaking one ankle, and the other wasn't in great shape after as well.) Perhaps he hit the rope with a foot while falling and pinched it against the rough limestone?
Sorry about the rambling, I should find a better place to put all of that...
Anyway, to keep things semi-on-topic, now I'm left with a few-weeks-old bi-patterned rope that has a middle mark that's way off. Maybe I should just retire it...
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marc801
Jun 11, 2009, 7:22 PM
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markcarlson wrote: As for how the damage occurred, I don't really know.....There was lots of sharp rocks and cracks for the rope to get stuck in / loaded over,
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steple
Jun 11, 2009, 7:32 PM
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I'm a big fan of Mammut ropes. I own an Infinity (9,5mm, but works fine with Gri Gri), a friend owns an old Supersafe that still handles very smooth (I think it is the coating finish feature that makes it so nice).
Another friend is on his second Petzl rope (forgot the name, but it is acid green), and he says he won't buy another Petzl because they wear too fast.
Also for trad climbing I would try to stay below 10mm, to reduce rope drag.
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Skidemon27
Jun 11, 2009, 7:36 PM
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well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt)
and occasionally i will be using it for top rope set ups.rare but once an awhile, my back up rope will is a petzl 9.8
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Skidemon27
Jun 11, 2009, 7:39 PM
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yea no doubt i have owned 2 petzl rope( got them both at the same time) and ill ever buy another petzl
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ryanb
Jun 11, 2009, 7:47 PM
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Metolius 9.8
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vegastradguy
Jun 11, 2009, 11:49 PM
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Skidemon27 wrote: well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt)
if they're bitching about their fingers hurting belaying with an ATC...they're doing it wrong.
its also highly likely that they are belaying incorrectly with a grigri as well- as the amount of strength and rope contact really doesnt vary all that much from device to device, its mostly technique.
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marc801
Jun 12, 2009, 12:18 AM
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Skidemon27 wrote: well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt)
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marc801
Jun 12, 2009, 12:19 AM
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steple wrote: Also for trad climbing I would try to stay below 10mm, to reduce rope drag.
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angry
Jun 12, 2009, 12:28 AM
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marc801 wrote: steple wrote: Also for trad climbing I would try to stay below 10mm, to reduce rope drag. You're joking, right?
You're a n00b right?
As I stated before, my rope that gets used primarily for trad is a 9.2.
Sure I try to prevent rope drag and use runners but when you're 220ft into a pitch, no amount of runners (or DMM rollers) is going to make a heavy rope light.
For the shorter stuff, I do use the thick rope but who are we kidding here, single pitch trad = sport.
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mikebee
Jun 12, 2009, 12:28 AM
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In reply to: Skidemon, compare the specs of the Mammut 10.2 Supersafe rope with any other. For trad, it's hard to beat.
From the Mammut website:
impact force in kN 8,8
I go with the school of thought that the lower the impact force of the rope, the more chance you have of a marginal placement holding your fall. To this end, Beal have the lowest impact forces pretty much across the whole market.
Check out the Beal Booster III 9.7mm. It's very nice rope, and it handles very well too.
From the Beal website:
• Impact force Laboratory 7.00-7.20 kN
• Impact force BEAL Guaranty 7.30 kN
That means for the first UIAA fall on each of these ropes, there's a difference between the Supersafe and the Booster of 1.5kN, which is the equivalent of about 150kg of weight at the peak load period of a 1.77 fall factor fall. That a pretty distinct difference, and if you're climbing on gear, that extra force might be the difference between your gear popping, or not.
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coastal_climber
Jun 12, 2009, 12:58 AM
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9.8mm Sterling Velocity
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nhgill
Jun 12, 2009, 11:15 AM
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Well for what it is worth (and I have a sinking feeling that others here are going to tell me exactly why the shop was trying to get rid of it so cheaply) I just picked up a new Petzl Nomad from EMS. I figured its a 9.8mm dry coated rope and it was $70 off. Now I am not sure whether or not all EMS's have this deal or if it was the one in my area specifically but I figured it was worth it for the money. The Nomad is replacing a Mammut 10mm something (can't remember exactly what they called it) which I have to say I liked a lot but have beat to hell over the last couple of years.
just my .02
-HTG
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Skidemon27
Jun 12, 2009, 12:33 PM
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vegastradguy wrote: Skidemon27 wrote: well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt) if they're bitching about their fingers hurting belaying with an ATC...they're doing it wrong. its also highly likely that they are belaying incorrectly with a grigri as well- as the amount of strength and rope contact really doesnt vary all that much from device to device, its mostly technique.
well my main bleay partner is my girlfriend.....she does it very well....only thing is is she is a massage thearpist...so her hands are covered in massage oils all day which make her hands super soft....she she cant build up her hands for belayin.....
let the jokes begin
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livinonasandbar
Jun 12, 2009, 12:38 PM
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2 additional comments...
Skid, mentioning that you'll want your belayer to use a gri-gri (re)opens the issue of static vs dynamic belay devices. You should research the pros and cons of leading trad routes above a gri-gri.
Mikeb, when you consider a rope's impact force you also need to consider elongation. Generally a softer catch means more rope stretch. On vertical or less-than-vertical routes, more stretch could mean hitting a ledge or a block, etc. It's all about compromise...
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Skidemon27
Jun 12, 2009, 12:38 PM
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BIATHLON PRO-10.1 MM, sterling
VELOCITY+BI-COLOR-9.8MM, sterling
Infinity 9,5 mm -, mammut
which one should i get
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marc801
Jun 12, 2009, 3:07 PM
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Skidemon27 wrote: well my main bleay partner is my girlfriend.....she does it very well....she cant build up her hands for belayin....
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marc801
Jun 12, 2009, 3:09 PM
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angry wrote: Sure I try to prevent rope drag and use runners but when you're 220ft into a pitch, no amount of runners (or DMM rollers) is going to make a heavy rope light.
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petsfed
Jun 12, 2009, 3:26 PM
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marc801 wrote: angry wrote: Sure I try to prevent rope drag and use runners but when you're 220ft into a pitch, no amount of runners (or DMM rollers) is going to make a heavy rope light. Agreed. But rope drag and the weight of the rope are two different things, and diameter really only affects the latter.
How do you figure? Rope drag is correlated directly with the surface area of the rope contacting rock, carabiners, trees, etc. A skinnier rope will obviously have much less surface area to contact whatever and thus generate rope drag.
There are a lot of things that affect rope drag, but ALL else being equal (eg same amount of friction due to the weave of the sheath, same weight, same deflection from straight, etc), a skinnier rope will give you less drag.
The difference is noticeable between an 11mm and a 9.5, even on a 30 foot pitch.
When I travel, my 9.5 gets a ton of use, but at my local rope-eater crag, 9.9 is about as skinny as I dare go.
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vegastradguy
Jun 12, 2009, 4:16 PM
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Skidemon27 wrote: vegastradguy wrote: Skidemon27 wrote: well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt) if they're bitching about their fingers hurting belaying with an ATC...they're doing it wrong. its also highly likely that they are belaying incorrectly with a grigri as well- as the amount of strength and rope contact really doesnt vary all that much from device to device, its mostly technique. well my main bleay partner is my girlfriend.....she does it very well....only thing is is she is a massage thearpist...so her hands are covered in massage oils all day which make her hands super soft....she she cant build up her hands for belayin..... let the jokes begin
they're called gloves. invest in a pair.
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Skidemon27
Jun 12, 2009, 5:21 PM
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vegastradguy wrote: Skidemon27 wrote: vegastradguy wrote: Skidemon27 wrote: well i am fairly new to trad. i want it to work well with a gri-gri casue my belay partners cant seem to belay unless they use a gri-gri... (well they can but then i gotta hear about them bitching that their fingers hurt) if they're bitching about their fingers hurting belaying with an ATC...they're doing it wrong. its also highly likely that they are belaying incorrectly with a grigri as well- as the amount of strength and rope contact really doesnt vary all that much from device to device, its mostly technique. well my main bleay partner is my girlfriend.....she does it very well....only thing is is she is a massage thearpist...so her hands are covered in massage oils all day which make her hands super soft....she she cant build up her hands for belayin..... let the jokes begin they're called gloves. invest in a pair.
really? i have never heard of those.... i mean them seem kinda weird....i would have never of thought of that.....seriously u are the fu*king genious of RC.com
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knudenoggin
Jun 16, 2009, 5:27 AM
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mikebee wrote: From the Mammut website: impact force in kN 8,8 I go with the school of thought that the lower the impact force of the rope, the more chance you have of a marginal placement holding your fall. To this end, Beal have the lowest impact forces pretty much across the whole market.
this test data implication is not really manifest in practice -- citing
all of the factors such as belay & lesser FF that come into play.
One might ask, What is the impact force on the Nth usual fall?
*kN*
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