I was hacking through some of the threads on new anchor techniques, and came across the so-called mooselette. Such a strange name. I wasn't able to find any pictures of it on the web so i could dissect it for myself, anybody care to share an image?

Does anyone that criticizes these simple anchors actually take the short time it takes to try one? An equallette can be a little stifling to someone the first time or two also.

Toolbox full of tools dude.

Does anyone that criticizes these simple anchors actually take the short time it takes to try one?

Isn't saying I quit carrying a cordelette a long time ago and then saying you sometimes carry an equalette kind of double talk. I mean, aren't they both just a long piece of accessory cord. You could configure either with the same piece of cord.

For what it's worth. I tie in with the rope most of the time. I've personally have used both the mooselette and the equalette and find the equalette more complex, but that's only from the experience of taking the time to learn and use both. I've also read most of the threads about the equalette and it's main criticism from many others was its complication. It's simply a matter of what one gets used to by using it or not.

If mooselette = reciprocating saw to cut fingernails,

Then equalette = table saw to make a toothpick out of a telephone pole.

I understand that. I fixed the link above. I had intended to link directly to the equalette configuration that my friends and I use. I specifically use a 48" dyneema sling from Mammut for my equalette anchors, and this is much lighter and less bulky than perlon. Most people use perlon or something similar for their cordelettes, like in the picture of the mooselette above. Still, a 4' sling is shorter than an 8' sling, and the 4' equalette is adequate for most uses I've needed it for.

I've been curious about the strength of the equalette configuration on the dyneema and I've contacted Adatesman multiple times to see if he would be willing to pull test some used equalettes but he has always ignored my inquiries. Does anyone know someone capable of doing such a test?

Josh

That's a sliding X with limiter knots, not an equalette.

I've got John Long's book sitting by my bed. I'll try to remember to check, but I believe that what I have linked is EXACTLY what the equalette is. I think I even got the idea of using a 48" dyneema sling because that's what he had in the book. There was a more complex clusterfuck called the quadrelette or "quad" or something, but something else I've written off as just way too much overkill.

Does anyone know if Fish publishes results like that, or should I just e-mail him and ask?

Josh

I've got John Long's book sitting by my bed. I'll try to remember to check, but I believe that what I have linked is EXACTLY what the equalette is. I think I even got the idea of using a 48" dyneema sling because that's what he had in the book. There was a more complex clusterfuck called the quadrelette or "quad" or something, but something else I've written off as just way too much overkill.

Does anyone know if Fish publishes results like that, or should I just e-mail him and ask?

Josh

Edit: I want to know the breaking strength at the knots in 2+ year old abused dyneema.

I've got John Long's book sitting by my bed. I'll try to remember to check, but I believe that what I have linked is EXACTLY what the equalette is.

You can most definately use an equalette to anchor to two pieces. Your memory of Long's book serves you well in this case at least.

If you took the time to search you would discover that this subject has been repeatedly discussed in various forums (and blogs). There have been many thousands of posts.

Josh, it isn't an equalette. You can call it that but the fact remains that it is a sliding X. If you read Long's book you would remember that he clearly distinguishes between the two both in form and performance.

Your method was already discussed previously in at least one of those threads. Whether or not it is the way to go is a matter of opinion. For what it's worth I don't like your approach.

It's been a while since I read it and I thought there were examples in the book where he equalizes two pieces. Maybe there aren't?

The limiter knots are so far apart that it doesn't seem to me worth even tying them. I know that they have to be seperated like that because if they were closer like in an equalette they'd have to be adjusted frequently. The equalette, as you recall, is usually adjusted at the far end via clove hitches to the pro.

We could go into an exhaustive discussion about limiter knots, the tradeoffs between equalization and potential loading in a gear failure, whether or not shock loading even exists, the merits and disadvantages of nylon versus spectra, etc, etc, ad nauseum... but that's already been done and then done again and again.

Two other people that come to mind would be Fish and Rschap (who just got himself a dynamometer and may be able to be talked into doing the test).

-a.

Unless your partner falls on the anchor and all of your pieces suck it's all just fun and games.

What's so strange about the name.

[image][url=http://www.mysmiley.net/free-animal-smileys.php][img]http://www.mysmiley.net/imgs/smile/animals/animal0024.gif[/img]

[image]http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s46/jct54/moosellette.jpg?t=1267602650[/image]

I think when building {a mooselette} youd probably get the "Hey (insert name) are you ok?" one minute later. "Hey! Are you there?" one minute later. "AM I ON BELAY" one minute later. "What The F Are You Doing. I'm Freezing down here!"

Does anyone that criticizes these simple anchors actually take the short time it takes to try one? An equallette can be a little stifling to someone the first time or two also.

Toolbox full of tools dude.

I don't like these anchors because they have significant extension. Extension is BAD as it can result in a significantly increases in load at the worst possible time. The conclusions by John Long that extension isn't a problem have been shown to be wrong.

So remind me why we should universally accept anchors that have extension?

Citation please?

Just use the rope.

Please take a look at the first pic I posted in this thread. While there is some extension, it is very small. No one is asking you to except an anchor with extension, but I hope you never need an anchor that can adjust to different directions of pull. You can't have both and this is nothing new to anyone.

Hey Moose, in the pic you posted there are no biners, so the extension would be pretty big.

The version of the mooselette I use is posted upthread a post or two. It has minimal extension. The CharlesJMM anchor has even less, and while it doesn't equalize as well as the moose, it's a hell of a lot better job of or equalizing than the equalette, or quad, or whatever the hell JL calls it.

GO

Good God,

20ft of 7mm cord

20 wasted minutes

Way too much gear needed.

Honestly though, how often do you run out of rope on an established route?

What do you use if you've already used up all the rope and all your slings just to get where you are? Tic toc tic toc tic toc.

You seem to keep running out of rope. You're probably belaying in the wrong spots.

Josh, it isn't an equalette. You can call it that but the fact remains that it is a sliding X. If you read Long's book you would remember that he clearly distinguishes between the two both in form and performance.

Your method was already discussed previously in at least one of those threads. Whether or not it is the way to go is a matter of opinion. For what it's worth I don't like your approach.

Sliding X: ................... If you are worried about extension in your Sliding X, then you can simply add overhand limiting knots to each leg of the Sliding X............

Equalette: ........To tie an equalette with a sling, simply tie two overhand limiting knots in the sling, one on each side of the center of the sling. The limiting knots should be several inches from the center to allow equalization. Clip each end of the sling to your pro, and clip yourself into the master point of the anchor with 2 locking carabiners, one ‘biner on each strand of the master point (as shown above). If you only have one locking ‘biner to attach yourself to the master point, then put a twist into one of the strands of the master point, and connect yourself as you would to a Sliding X........

isnt an Equallete basically a sliding X with limiter knots?? from the link someone posted before, i got this:

{snip}

so what i understand is that a 2 piece sliding X with limmiting knots is the same as a 2 piece equalette/ with 3 or 4 pieces, its not the same, but for 2, it is. o am i wrong??

Yes, the middle is basically a sliding X with limiter knots, but the part you're missing is the Equalette has clove hitches on the individual pieces.

To tie an equalette with a sling, simply tie two overhand limiting knots in the sling, one on each side of the center of the sling. The limiting knots should be several inches from the center to allow equalization. Clip each end of the sling to your pro, and clip yourself into the master point of the anchor with 2 locking carabiners,