|
superbum
May 28, 2003, 9:27 PM
Post #1 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 19, 2002
Posts: 822
|
I just did my first real crack hand-jamming and OUCH! I didn't use tape, but I sure will next time. I also found that if my hands weren't screaming bloody murder, they were popping out.
Besides tape, what are some tips to take the hurt off and save some skin??? Also, how do you navigate your hands...thumbs up/down, shuffle/stack, etc???
Oh, yea, some intense crack jamming stories would spice up this post a lot! Maybe the blood was dripping into your eyes, or you got hopelessly stuck...tell it like it is!
|
|
|
|
|
phreakdigital
May 28, 2003, 10:07 PM
Post #2 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 24, 2002
Posts: 228
|
Well sometimes rockclimbing hurts.
|
|
|
|
|
maculated
May 28, 2003, 10:35 PM
Post #3 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 23, 2001
Posts: 6179
|
It's my opinion that as you get better at jamming, it hurts less because your jams are more solid. You also develop thicker skin back there from all the scabbies. Obviously, if you're jamming J-Tree, it's going to hurt no matter what, though.
|
|
|
|
|
dsafanda
May 28, 2003, 10:40 PM
Post #4 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 6, 2002
Posts: 1025
|
In reply to: Besides tape, what are some tips to take the hurt off and save some skin???
I think there are some aspects of crack climbing that will simply always be a bit painful. That said, you will find that as your technique improves you will not need to thrash and jam as hard. As you get better you'll gain more control and precision. You'll discover how to jam using just the right amount of pressure...nothing more, nothing less. Remember how during that first year of climbing you would always come home with cut up ankles, knees and shins? Eventually you learn foot technique and this disappears right? It's the same with crack climbing.
There are hand cracks that I used to tape for that now I don't need to. Ofcoarse the problem is that this learning curve extends beyond perfect hand crack sizes. Now I cut up my fingers trying to learn how to jam off finger cracks.
|
|
|
|
|
mikedano
May 28, 2003, 10:41 PM
Post #5 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 19, 2001
Posts: 388
|
crack rules all.
Tape is good, but not always necessary. You'll get more used to crack climbing the more you do it. It's not as intuitive as other styles of climbing. I like to do thumbs down because it's a little easier to wedge that meaty part of your thumb in the crack. And use your feet as much as possible, either in the crack or stemming on the side. Look for rests. And don't worry if your fingers go numb, just think of them as five little wired nuts on the end of your hand.
|
|
|
|
|
pbjosh
May 28, 2003, 11:36 PM
Post #6 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 22, 2002
Posts: 1518
|
In reply to: It's my opinion that as you get better at jamming, it hurts less because your jams are more solid. You also develop thicker skin back there from all the scabbies.
This is true. You generally will develop better technique and chew yourself up less as time goes on. Additionally you'll toughen your hands and deaden yourself to the pain to some degree I imagine.
In reply to: Obviously, if you're jamming J-Tree, it's going to hurt no matter what, though.
This isn't true at all. I rarely tape at Joshua Tree and I climb cracks about 80% of the time because difficult face climbs or boulder problems (especially dynamic stuff) will shred your tips WAY faster than even a lot of the very hard cracks can shred your hands. Per your own comments above, keep working on it and jtree doesn't need to hurt either (most of the time, there're still a few routes out there that I tape for).
josh
|
|
|
|
|
trad_man
May 29, 2003, 12:15 AM
Post #7 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 21, 2003
Posts: 95
|
hey, iv been around on some cracks what i find most usefull when climbing cracks is dont move your hand around alot when your hand IS in the crack. theres less movement thus less skin for the rock to take
|
|
|
|
|
deadfish
May 29, 2003, 12:27 AM
Post #8 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 4, 2003
Posts: 57
|
Karl Baba (all bow to his greatness) taught me the single most useful tip for climbing hand cracks.
Beginning crack climbers often try to jam with the back of their hand and their fingertips. But you should really be jamming the fat part at the base of your hand...most times, you should be able to relax your fingers and wiggle them around inside the crack. This was hugely helpful for me. The other thing that I see pretty often is people don't commit their feet to the crack, and as a result wind up trying to hang off their arms and hand jams. Hand jams are (generally) for balance and to hold you in to the wall...feet are for upward progress. If you are really using your feet right, I bet many of your hand jam problems will solve themselves.
Foot jamming used to make me see stars...all of a sudden, though, it just stopped hurting. Can't tell you what it was that made the difference, but if you keep doing it your body will figure it out. A lot of it, again, is about relaxing, i think.
Hope this is helpful.
|
|
|
|
|
moabbeth
May 29, 2003, 12:40 AM
Post #9 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 22, 2002
Posts: 1786
|
Don't get addicted to tape. Your hands will get less thrashed the more you crack climb and the more you get used to proper technique.
And put a ton of Burt's Bees Hand Salve (the farmer's friend :wink: ) on your hands at the end of the day. It'll help toughen them up after a day of crack climbing.
|
|
|
|
|
crackaddict
May 29, 2003, 12:53 AM
Post #10 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 24, 2000
Posts: 1279
|
In reply to: moabbeth -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Don't get addicted to tape. Your hands will get less thrashed the more you crack climb and the more you get used to proper technique.
I agree. Plus it turns you into a real wuss.
When I first started crack climbing my hands were all torn up to my elbows.
I was using everything I had to make it up the rock.
But refused to use tape gloves.
Now I rarley come back with any injuries.
Why because I learned better technique.
Now the only time I use tape is when I climb hard on sandstone or overhnaging cracks.
Crack climbing can be painful. Its supposed to be that way!
|
|
|
|
|
bvb
May 29, 2003, 1:20 AM
Post #11 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 3, 2003
Posts: 954
|
my only comment is welcome the the world of hard-core climbing. enjoy. face is good for a palate cleanser, but then it's back to cracks.
|
|
|
|
|
moabbeth
May 29, 2003, 1:31 AM
Post #12 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 22, 2002
Posts: 1786
|
ITA crackaddict!!! Tape is such a crutch. I'd rather grate my hands and wrists to the bone but be a toughass about it than slather my hands with tape any time I go near a crack. Cause the hands will adjust with experience and the scrapes will become less frequent with skill. No wussy taping for this crack girl :wink: . Crack climbing isn't supposed to be comfy anyway. If I came away from a crack climb with beautiful cut-free porcelain hands, I'd be very disappointed in myself.
|
|
|
|
|
thedesertnomad
May 29, 2003, 1:38 AM
Post #13 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2003
Posts: 216
|
Right on Beth... Chris and I were talking about that this weekend... Moab sandstone is the only place I have taped up... without it one time it almost took a day of climbing away from me... lol OUCH !!! But I agree with you and before I slap on the Salve I like to have a little peroxide party... let the bubbles fly... hehehehe
|
|
|
|
|
pt
May 29, 2003, 2:45 AM
Post #14 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 29, 2003
Posts: 400
|
you better use tape at places like Vedauwoo - for the hard stuff anyway! Try telling Bob Scarpelli or Brad Jackson that they are wusses for using tape.
|
|
|
|
|
dimeedge
May 29, 2003, 2:49 AM
Post #15 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 17, 2002
Posts: 50
|
"ITA crackaddict!!! Tape is such a crutch. I'd rather grate my hands and wrists to the bone but be a toughass about it than slather my hands with tape any time I go near a crack." moabbeth
Then maybe I am a wuss. Last weekend after two attempts at a roof crack that I ended up backing off of due to some weird nerve damage in the back of my hand (felt like fire on the back of my hand, but at the same time I couldnt feel real things touching it) I put a layer of tape on and sent the route. Shrug. I say use what works.
|
|
|
|
|
moabbeth
May 29, 2003, 2:58 AM
Post #16 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 22, 2002
Posts: 1786
|
Geez dim, don't take things so personal. I never you were a wuss for using tape....I just said I won't use it, and that I think often when people that get into crack climbing they immediately hit the tape to the point it can become a crutch. You really don't need tape on all crack climbs. I have never found tape to be useful, if anything it impedes my ability so I'd rather shred my hands and get a good climb in than use tape. That's just me. I didn't say anything about you. And no I'd never risk injuring my hands but I can handle any pain of a crack grating against my hand. That's half the fun of crack climbing. Suffering isn't necessarily a bad thing.
|
|
|
|
|
superbum
May 29, 2003, 3:33 AM
Post #17 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 19, 2002
Posts: 822
|
Hey, thanks to one and all for the great tips, personal experiance, etc. All I think about is trad and hard cracks...I am just having the hardest time with the patience it takes to really get into trad. Unfortunately I started climbing at Smith ( well depending how you look at it) and was thus conditioned for a while to think the only climbing that existed was bolted! Then I started reading many many climbing accounts and getting into the history of our fine way of life and began to salivate for more...lots more.
I am working as a ropes course director all summer to earn enough to buy a FAT rack and live in City of Rocks for a month or two to "cut my teeth" on cracks. Then on to Squamish? Yosemite? Buggaboos? Zion? Freakin Patagonia?!? Yeah baby. Yeah.
KEEP 'EM COMIN!
|
|
|
|
|
karlbaba
May 29, 2003, 3:56 AM
Post #18 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 10, 2002
Posts: 1159
|
Check out secret crack tips on this thread
http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=29853&start=0
Hope this helps.
Peace
Karl
PS tape is OK for rough cracks, 20 pitch routes, or when you are still learning basic jamming, but it can reduce your jamming ability by restricting hand expansion and flexiblity. Plus, the stone feels good once you make friends with it.
|
|
|
|
|
nimo
May 29, 2003, 4:05 AM
Post #19 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 23, 2002
Posts: 116
|
Some tricks or things to think about,,, pure hand jams use your thumb muscles ( think of squeezing down with the thumb not cupping the hand), next is to place your hand at a 90 degree angle to the crack and as you move pivot at the wrist instead of moving your hand around in the crack., as people have mentioned before use the feet, and last but not least take a trip to Indian Creek and wreck yourself. Have fun and pass your knowledge on to others as you learn.
|
|
|
|
|
brutusofwyde
May 29, 2003, 5:14 AM
Post #20 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 3, 2002
Posts: 1473
|
Hand Jam Basics, by Brutus of Wyde
Tape or not?
I used to tape all the time.
Now I tape primarily for hand crack climbs that are at or near my limit.
When climbing cracks well within my abilities, the jams are generally secure, the hands don't move around, the skin stays put.
A good discussion of jamming techniques can be found in either Basic Rockcraft or Advanced Rockcraft by Royal Robbins. I forget which. Start there, and read Dingus' essay on the subject as well (linked elsewhere in this thread.) which focuses on footwork, the foundation of good crack technique.
Thumbs up or thumbs down?
First and foremost, use the jam that fits: thumbs up, thumbs down, right hand or left hand all have different shapes, and one may be better than any of the others for any particular placement.
With that said, here are a few generalizations that everyone can feel free to take issue with:
Deeper is better:
If you can cram your hand into the crack up to the wrist, life is good. The meaty part of the hand provides a comfortable, stable cushion to allow you to stay upright as you climb the crack with your feet.
Jams requiring less strength are better:
Look for places in the crack where the hand will fit like a passive nut. These jams are sweet as honey, and allow you to save that awesome power you've developed for the crux that looms ahead, and for that last pitch at the end of the day, when you will be racing the afternoon thunderstorm for the summit.
Thumb down hand jam:
Insert hand in crack. STOP. before you do anything else, look at the position of your elbow. Depending on what level your hand is at, your elbow will either be pointed toward the sky (high placement) or pointed out to the side (face level and below). The advantage of this jam is that it can utilize camming action as well as hand-cupping to jam. Camming comes from torquing the afore-mentioned elbow down toward the ground. This action requires little in the way of hand strength, conserving that for other uses. Thumbs-down jams are the meat-and-potatoes of the upper hand.
The disadvantage of this jam is that as you move up past it, it becomes more and more difficult to keep the elbow pointed anywhere toward the floor: eventually you will lose the camming action and the jam can fail. Often beginning crack climbers use thumbs down jams for both hands exclusively because they lack either the hand strength or technique in the thumbs-up jam: The camming action of both hands allows them to progress up the crack in spite of the jam's disadvantages, but requires them to keep both hands high in relation to the rest of the body.
Thumb up hand jam
Insert hand in crack. STOP. Before you do anything else, look at the position of your elbow. Unless you are deformed, that puppy is gonna be pointed at the ground, regardless of where the hand is in the crack. You can't cam that hand. You will never be able to cam that hand. This jam depends on the cupping action of the hand. The advantage of this jam is that it stays solid throughout your entire reach, from above your head to when your hand is down near your knees. The quality of the jam does not deteriorate as you move past it, unlike the thumbs-down camjam. Thumbs-up jamming is the bread and butter of the lower hand. If the crack you are climbing required a long reach to the next good jam, all other things being equal, you are better off to be reaching off of a thumbs-up jam, having worked your feet as high as possible to extend the reach of your upper hand.
The disadvantage of this jam is that it requires more hand strength, more grip strength if you will, to stay secure, because of the lack of camming action that the thumb-down jam provides.
These are the basic concepts of hand jamming. Hope this helps.
Flame away :wink:
Brutus
|
|
|
|
|
bvb
May 29, 2003, 5:21 AM
Post #21 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 3, 2003
Posts: 954
|
My old buddy Dick Cilly said it all: Tape Is Aid. I've climbed one fucking shitload of a hell of hard cracks, and I would not have gtten up half of them wihtout tape.
|
|
|
|
|
1269topper
May 29, 2003, 5:42 AM
Post #22 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 6, 2003
Posts: 168
|
nothing like showing up @work on mondays with hugh picecs of flesh missing from the back of your hands. People always assume something rediculas.
On the tape opinion, I don't cause I feel i can bit into the rock better without it. However I do use it when I am cut to keep climbing. I think that its a matter of prefrence. If you think oyu can climb harder tape up. I just choose not to use much cause i feel it can become a crutch.
|
|
|
|
|
timstich
May 30, 2003, 4:08 AM
Post #23 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 3, 2003
Posts: 6267
|
With Dingus' footwork beta and Brutus' hand jam beta, who could go wrong? Thanks to the two a youse.
|
|
|
|
|
cologman
May 30, 2003, 4:47 AM
Post #24 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 29, 2002
Posts: 581
|
It sux to grow older! I used to climb sans tape all the time. Actually it was the sans clothes climbs that became abusive. But as I age and skin becomes less tolerant of such abuses I've resorted to gleefully and fully taping the livin shXt out of my hands. :lol:
|
|
|
|
|
stonefiend
May 30, 2003, 10:44 PM
Post #25 of 49
(7423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 28, 2002
Posts: 88
|
i prefer to tape when doing steep pitches with tight hands and or handstacks.. scabs and blood can ruin your trip if you tear really deep. on cracks at your limit, you will sometimes benefit using tape.
aid climbing my ass...
|
|
|
|
|
mreardon
May 30, 2003, 10:49 PM
Post #26 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 17, 2002
Posts: 1337
|
Better technique, less tape. My partner tapes his hands, I might have a small piece on a finger. Both of us walk away with the same scrapes. And crack climbing isn't supposed to hurt, it's no different than any other climbing. Some moves hurt, most don't. If you want to use tape, go for it, but it won't stop the scrapes or pain, only technique will.
|
|
|
|
|
climber1
May 30, 2003, 10:56 PM
Post #27 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 5, 2000
Posts: 484
|
In reply to: Tape is such a crutch.
debatable
In reply to: I'd rather grate my hands and wrists to the bone but be a toughass about it than slather my hands with tape any time I go near a crack. |
|
|
|
|
brutusofwyde
May 31, 2003, 12:29 AM
Post #28 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 3, 2002
Posts: 1473
|
In reply to: Better technique, less tape.
I use tape a LOT less now that I have two pair of Hand Jammies.
:D
|
|
|
|
|
timstich
Jun 4, 2003, 2:48 AM
Post #29 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 3, 2003
Posts: 6267
|
In reply to: In reply to: Better technique, less tape. I use tape a LOT less now that I have two pair of Hand Jammies. :D
Gotta try those hand jammies. Hey, I just remembered that a friend of mine has a pair. Might get to use them this Saturday. I think my tape gloves are still usable. Not too much mold and oily skin scum. Life is good.
-Tim
|
|
|
|
|
indigo_nite
Jun 27, 2003, 11:12 PM
Post #30 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 3, 2002
Posts: 365
|
In reply to: Beginning crack climbers often try to jam with the back of their hand and their fingertips. But you should really be jamming the fat part at the base of your hand...
I s'pose you're assuming the crack is fairly deep to wedge your hand that far in. or you're keeping your hand fairly upright and bracing the fat pad on one side and the back of your hand on the other side.
toe jams seem the most painful for me. still trying to figure out if it's my shoes or me...
I don't like tape mainly b/c it decreases sensitivity to the rock. though that's the purpose, I like to feel the rock shape directly to determine how best to work with it. but on long cracks or long days it seems to make sense to tape.
|
|
|
|
|
flagstaff_climber
Jun 28, 2003, 12:11 AM
Post #31 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 22, 2002
Posts: 310
|
Tape is not for wusses, I use tape and I am not a wus :) Plus it helps keep the hair from growing on the back of your hand. And on top of that, they (old tape gloves) make great doggie chew toys. Something about all that sweat and dirt that drives them crazy !
And if you do decide to walk erect and use tape, the cheap stuff from Wal-Mart (comes in a red two pack) is the stickiest I have found.
Rick
8)
|
|
|
|
|
studs
Nov 19, 2003, 4:09 AM
Post #32 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 10, 2003
Posts: 103
|
Its possible Dick Cilley said that about tape but I know that for most of his life he's climbed em without tape or walked away.
|
|
|
|
|
roadguy
Nov 20, 2003, 10:53 PM
Post #33 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 30, 2003
Posts: 52
|
I remember Yabo saying that the only way you get goobies from crack climbing is that when your jams are set and you move you hands..thats when the body fluids begin to ooze...good technique is what is called for. Move everything except for da jams. That being said, I do find myself taping when I have an old wound thats trying to heal or some bad rock I'm about to stuff my paws into.
|
|
|
|
|
micronut
Nov 20, 2003, 11:13 PM
Post #34 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 11, 2002
Posts: 1760
|
In reply to: difficult face climbs or boulder problems (especially dynamic stuff) will shred your tips WAY faster than even a lot of the very hard cracks can shred your hands. josh
so true, as my good friend likes to say, "bouldering in J-Tree can shread your tips in a heartbeat".
but as far as extended trips to J-Tree, I have found tape indespensible, open sore on crystal is the only other option.
|
|
|
|
|
inflight
Nov 20, 2003, 11:49 PM
Post #35 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 28, 2002
Posts: 172
|
All things have been covered.
I'll add my take on Hand Jammies. They are so thick you loose sensitivity to the rock. They don't stick to your hand like tape so your hand will slip around like a foot in a loose shoe. Not a good thing.
Tape is a preference but learn how to do it. I won't try to teach you over the web. Taping around the palm is not a good method. It will constrict your hands and too much tape will also reduce sensitivity to the rock. When taping, protect the thumb knuckle closest to the palm for fist cracks.
One application for the thumbs down hand jam is when the crack angles in either direction. If the crack angles left, left hand jam is thumbs down and vice versa for the right angle. Master this jam and decide what will stick for the given situation.
Eventually, you will end up learning how to jam various sizes other than just hand crack because most traditional routes involve various crack sizes. And when you see the acronym OW, flatter your partner and gladly turn the lead over unless you really like to suffer while making a snails pace.
Stories?
http://rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=28229&postdays=0&postorder=asc&topic_view=&start=0
8)
|
|
|
|
|
mattdog
Nov 21, 2003, 12:17 AM
Post #36 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 1, 2003
Posts: 1523
|
The original post was way back in May. Does this guy still care?
|
|
|
|
|
petsfed
Nov 21, 2003, 12:34 AM
Post #37 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 25, 2002
Posts: 8599
|
In reply to: Eventually, you will end up learning how to jam various sizes other than just hand crack because most traditional routes involve various crack sizes. And when you see the acronym OW, flatter your partner and gladly turn the lead over unless you really like to suffer while making a snails pace.
My partner and I have a joke about offwidth acronyms.
OW: Off Width
OUCH: offwidth you can handstack
OFL (read awful): offwidth foolishly liebacked
The key with off widths is to not simply pull with your arms. It gets you nowhere and is hilarious to watch. The key is leg strength to progress and ab strength to maintain it. A combination of arms and abs will keep you from sliding back down while you move your legs higher. But I'm getting ahead of myself.
The first key to offwidths is to pick which side of your body to cram in there. Some offwidths are splitter, so look for the side with the most faceholds outside of the crack. No good reason to work any harder than you have to right? Some offwidths are small enough that you don't even have to pick a side, you just go straight in, but I'll get to that later. Offwidths in corners are cantankerous beasts, but look above and if it seems like you'll have to clear a bulge or something similar, remember that you can lean farther forward than backward. (in this offwidth, I'd have my right shoulder in the crack, whereas in this one I'd go left shoulder in). If you're offwidthing behind a flake, keep your back to the larger piece of rock (There are exceptions). Also see the following photos: Middle Parallel Space (5.9), Lucille (5.12), Slut (the climb, not the girl, 5.7), Hand Jacker (5.7), Lower Slot Right (5.8+)
So now you know which side to put in, how do you start it? Put the side you picked into the crack and go. Easier said than done, I know.
First for your feet: The bain of my existence is pure offwidth. If there are little crystals, divots, ledges, hedges, or barns I can stand on outside of the crack, I'm a happy camper. Failing that, try heel & toe jams (remember to keep the heel higher than the toe), heel & knee jams, and leg scums. If you can hook your thigh over something in the crack (constrictions work well), you're golden. Suddenly, the Leaning Pillar pitch of the Durrance Route on Devil's Tower ain't so bad. If all else fails, use your outside leg to propell yourself upward by smearing on the wall behind you.
As for the arms: Certain things work, most don't. As always, don't try to pull yourself up with your arms, there's nothing to pull on. Depending on the crack, you have several options. First, stick your arm straight in and get opposition between your palm and your elbow. Second put your elbow into the crack and get opposition between your palm and your tricep. Remember, offwidth technique is a last ditch effort for when all of your other techniques fail. Look for holds inside the crack, or hand jams at the back of the crack.
There is a final technique specifically for those with rock hard abs and a sense of adventure. So called "Leavitation", its a combination of knee jams and hand stacks. Hand stacking is the jamming between a hand and the rock. Be creative and whatever sticks, holds. As for moving up, jam both knees in the crack, clench your abs and remove your hands from the crack. Sweating yet? Now replace your hand stack, then move your knee jams up. Rinse and repeat until you pump out or reach the anchors.
And remember, its bad form to puke on your belayer!
|
|
|
|
|
leinosaur
Mar 24, 2005, 10:43 PM
Post #38 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 6, 2003
Posts: 690
|
In reply to: In reply to: Eventually, you will end up learning how to jam various sizes other than just hand crack because most traditional routes involve various crack sizes. And when you see the acronym OW, flatter your partner and gladly turn the lead over unless you really like to suffer while making a snails pace. My partner and I have a joke about offwidth acronyms. OW: Off Width OUCH: offwidth you can handstack OFL (read awful): offwidth foolishly liebacked
I knew immediately I should have just tried to swim up it, or chicken wing, or something - and went on to work plenty of fisty cracks over the next two days but shying away from offwidths for a bit. There's that 8+ and another 10c fingers-to-offwidth with a wide-ass crux I really want to get.
There's even a "5.6" offwidth elsewhere in the Wichitas that had me scratching my head, at first. It'll be a good venue to practice my stacking, chickenwings, etc. before heading back to the .8 & the .10c - most of which is fingers-widening-to-fists. I'm told our Okie granite's a lot like Yosemite . . .
|
|
|
|
|
iclimbtoo
Mar 24, 2005, 10:58 PM
Post #39 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 10, 2002
Posts: 645
|
I'm with Moabbeth on this one...
Tape becomes a crutch. You aren't a wuss for using tape, but once you use it, you won't go back. then all then sudden you run out, or forget your tape and you have to climb barehanded. Well, I would rather have calloused up hands, conditioned and toughened to the climb rather than forget my tape and try to suffer the pain of non-conditioned hands.
It's all preference, but mine goes to no tape.
|
|
|
|
|
jaybro
Apr 1, 2005, 5:24 PM
Post #40 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2005
Posts: 441
|
Gott second Stud's take on that Cilly quote, I can't remember ever seeing Dick use tape. But that does sound like soemthing he would say if he did!
|
|
|
|
|
pt
Apr 20, 2005, 10:40 PM
Post #41 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 29, 2003
Posts: 400
|
The new climbing mag has an article on Vedauwoo, Seems like all the hard climbers are using tape in those photos. A while back there was also some pictures of Stephanie Davis on Free Rider and Tommy Caldwell on Dihedral Wall, both were using tape. The best crack climbers in the world are using tape - I think I will too!
|
|
|
|
|
jaybro
Apr 21, 2005, 2:05 AM
Post #42 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2005
Posts: 441
|
man, you don't want to go by what those vedadudes do.
|
|
|
|
|
takanhase
Apr 21, 2005, 6:32 AM
Post #43 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 8, 2004
Posts: 141
|
In reply to: I'll add my take on Hand Jammies. They are so thick you loose sensitivity to the rock |
|
|
|
|
tenesmus
Apr 22, 2005, 8:14 PM
Post #45 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2004
Posts: 263
|
In reply to: I'm with Moabbeth on this one... Tape becomes a crutch. You aren't a wuss for using tape, but once you use it, you won't go back. then all then sudden you run out, or forget your tape and you have to climb barehanded. Well, I would rather have calloused up hands, conditioned and toughened to the climb rather than forget my tape and try to suffer the pain of non-conditioned hands. It's all preference, but mine goes to no tape. |
|
|
|
|
112
Apr 22, 2005, 9:17 PM
Post #46 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
In reply to: Unfortunately I started climbing at Smith ( well depending how you look at it) and was thus conditioned for a while to think the only climbing that existed was bolted!
Man, then you sure missed a lot of great climbs at Smith. Zion is right there in the middle of Morning Glory Wall (not the best example of a jam crack though). :oops:
The best is at the end of the day when your whole back of your hand is numb. :D
I can climb hader with tape (more sticky/not so sweaty - sometimes the crux of the climb is keeping my hands dry), but I prefer to try it free first before I go to the aid techniques. :P
Ken
Ken
|
|
|
|
|
davidorchard
Apr 22, 2005, 10:14 PM
Post #47 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 2, 2002
Posts: 144
|
In reply to: Karl Baba (all bow to his greatness) taught me the single most useful tip for climbing hand cracks. Beginning crack climbers often try to jam with the back of their hand and their fingertips. But you should really be jamming the fat part at the base of your hand...most times, you should be able to relax your fingers and wiggle them around inside the crack.
this man speaks the gospel.
the way to make you hand fat so that is sticks in the crack is to place your hand in the crack and move the base of you thumb toward your pinky (sounds wierd, but give it a try) when done properly hand jams feel so good (unless the rock is eating you)
several other people have mentioned not to move your hand after it is in the crack. that too is very good info. try to rotate at the wrist instead of moving your hand.
as far as thumbs up or down, just play with it and you will find your own preference and it might change with each crack.
jam on brother/sister?
edit: WTF. i totally replied before i checked the date of the original post. why the hell is this back on the front page? because people like me post, right?
|
|
|
|
|
angry
Apr 24, 2005, 3:54 PM
Post #48 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 22, 2003
Posts: 8405
|
HELLO PEOPLE, BURT BRONSON HERE.
I HAVE TAKEN OVER FSHIZZLE'S COMPUTER, HE IS CURRENTLY IN THE BASEMENT WITH THE GIMP.
AS THE LAST BASTION OF SERIOUS CLIMBER, I MUST TELL YOU THAT YOU MUST CLIMB CRACKS IF YOU ARE SERIOUS. MOST OF YOU ARE WEAK, THOSE WHO ARE NOT, ARE PROBABLY STILL WEAK. IF JAMMING CRACKS HURTS, I SUGGEST YOU GO HOME AND CRY. I CANNOT MAKE THE PAIN GO AWAY FOR YOU. SOME OF YOU ARE SO TREMENDOUSLY WEAK THAT YOU PAY A MAN CALLED A "DOCTOR" TO STICK A FINGER IN YOUR ASS ON OCCASION. IF YOU TOLD THIS "DOCTOR" THAT YOUR SOFT LITTLE HANDS HURT WHEN YOU CRAM THEM INTO STONE, HE WOULD TELL YOU STOP CRAMMING THEM INTO STONE.
I AGREE WITH THIS ANALLY FIXATED WEAKLING, YOU ARE TOO WEAK TO CLIMB CRACKS. YOU SHOULD STOP BEFORE YOUR SALTY TEARS KILL ALL NEARBY VEGETATION.
IF ANY OF YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU ARE STRONG ENOUGH TO BE A REAL MAN, YOU NEED TO GET 3 THINGS TO BEGIN THIS JOURNEY.
#1 PENTHOUSE FROM THE 70'S
#2 A 12 PACK OF pbr AND MARLBORO REDS
#3 A 16 WEEK SUPPLY OF PEANUT BUTTER
NOW GO CLIMB A CRACK YOU LITTLE SISSY, WHEN THE PEANUT BUTTER RUNS OUT, YOU WILL NOT BE SO WEAK.
BURT
|
|
|
|
|
superbum
Nov 21, 2005, 1:01 AM
Post #49 of 49
(7155 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 19, 2002
Posts: 822
|
ANGRY-
I probably would have been mad at you years ago when I originally posted this thread....but since then I have done some serious time in the desert and on much high granite. I now turn my head when anyone says the word "dirt," I wear a bandana, eat my oatmeal w/ my nut tool, and often find myself responding to newbie trad posts w/ rage and sarcasm.
Well done. Wanna climb sometime?
|
|
|
|
|
|
