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goodwholesomeboy
Feb 18, 2005, 2:41 AM
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i'm going to be getting a new pair of shoes soon and i'm starting to get big into cracks and i was wondering what would be some good kicks.
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unrooted
Feb 18, 2005, 3:05 AM
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My crack head friends use fiveten mocasyms, with seam seal on the front half of the for-foot. They buy them in their street size or whatever makes their feet lay flat. Laced shoes fail apart too fat, and these shoes have a more rounded toebox than most others.
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climbinginchico
Feb 18, 2005, 3:20 AM
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I have enjoyed three of my four pairs of shoes for trad.
My Evolv Kaos- not the best for thin cracks, because my toes are curled. I got the SR toe rand, and it does come in handy on the wider cracks that they will fit into.
My Mad Rock Hooker Lace- Not bad- the toe ribbing really helps it cushion and grip the rock if the crack is the right size. Good shoes, they just blew out fast, and the laces shredded themselves. Gotta send them in for a replacement one of these days.
My LaSportiva Mythos- Great thin crack shoes if sized for feet flat. It's comfortable (relatively speaking of course) for jamming, and the padded tongue comes in handy at times. Haven't had much of a problem with laces shredding- they look just fine.
My Evolv Bandits with SR toe rand- My favorites for thin cracks, medium cracks, crack climbing in general. Heck, general trad climbing. Awesome shoes. They are comfortable, perform super well, and the toe rand helps pad for those thin cracks where you wedge them in there. Haven't had them too long, but the laces are burly round ones- no wear yet. They also edge and smear like a dream. Perfect fit for me too. Being relatively comfortable with flat toes is key for "comfortable" crack climbing. Snug enough to perform, but not too tight to curl the toes, which kills for longer routes and cracks.
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thegreytradster
Feb 18, 2005, 3:26 AM
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Hands and up, Kaulculators
Thinner, Mythos
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organic
Feb 18, 2005, 3:40 AM
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mocassyms are such a great shoe and the mythos would definitely be my second choice. I paid $60 for my mocassyms though and bought them 2 sizes smaller than my street shoe and they feel so comfy! They work great for everything but edging.
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enjoimx
Feb 18, 2005, 3:46 AM
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Evolv bandits have been good for me so far.
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petsfed
Feb 18, 2005, 3:52 AM
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If you get moccassyms, buy them as small as you can cram your foot into, then let them stretch as much as possible before you start jamming your foot in stuff. They stretch a ton, so initially they are not going to be good crack shoes. Mine are almost floppy at this point.
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goodwholesomeboy
Feb 19, 2005, 12:23 AM
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if i did get some mocassyms how many sizes smaller than my regular size should i get them?
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iamthewallress
Feb 19, 2005, 12:54 AM
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In reply to: if i did get some mocassyms how many sizes smaller than my regular size should i get them?
I would never size crack shoes tightly. If your toes curl under, they'll be fatter for the thin cracks and excruciatingly painful in the heel-toe foot bar stuff.
If I'm cragging and pick my shoes for size, I use Mocassyms for thin hands and finger cracks. FWIW, I have 7.5's and I wear a woman's 9 street shoe. This basically has my toes pushing on the end of the shoe but not curled under. There is next to no support in this shoe anyway.
For wider than hands and anything that will involve much face climbing too, I wear Mythos. If you wear Moccassyms in wide cracks, you will probably pry them off your feet, if the pain doesn't stop you first!
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urbanfood
Feb 19, 2005, 3:26 AM
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i love my boreal aces. they are a board lasted shoe (opposed to slip last) and the sole is nice and stiff so you can jam your foot in the crack and stand up without your foot getting squished (that's the beauty of board lasted). i've tried to crack climb a couple of times in my 5.10's (can't remeber the name) but they are basically like a pair of soft rubber slippers and my foot gets all squished up in the crack, there good for slab and some face climbing.
i would also get maybe 1/2 size smaller than your street shoe but no more. if you plan on doing multi pitch trad you're going to be wearing these puppies all day. i have a friend who's a good crack climber and he wears the mythos in his same street shoe size, he climbs well and wears them all day no problem. it all comes down to personal preference.
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greenmachineman7
Feb 19, 2005, 3:36 AM
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Mythos are a GREAT all-around shoe. Good for crack, good enough for most edging, comfortable, long-lasting.
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camhead
Feb 19, 2005, 4:25 AM
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moccs stretch so much that the issue of sizing them too tight is almost irrelevant. I take size 10 street shoes, wear size nine sport/bouldering shoes, and take a size 8.5 mocc for cracks. they stretch to just the right size. yay!
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slacklinejoe
Feb 19, 2005, 5:40 AM
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I can vouch that Mythos are good for a variety of cracks, however in my case the laces didn't hold up with a flip. Gym and trad cracks chewed up the laces and even ate into the leather a lot so the laces pulled through the leather. I wasn't real happy about that.
I'm going the Evolv Bandit with the super rand route for my future crack endevors. I just have to convince myself that sizing will be ok, since they can't be returned w/ customizations.
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johnhennings
Feb 19, 2005, 5:43 AM
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I really like my mocs for crack climbing, but I would not reccomend them to a person who is just learing to foot jam. To a beginner, this shoe would seem very unprotective and downright painful. I would advise a beginning crack climber to purchase sturdier shoes like the sportiva focus, 5.10 newton or boreal ace.
When you have learned the basics of foot jamming, mocs make a great thin crack shoe.
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joshy8200
Feb 19, 2005, 5:46 AM
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I haven't ever had a pair, but the 5.10 Newtons are their high end crack climbing shoe.
The Moccasyms are going to stretch a lot. I had mine a size and a half down. Once stretched they fit perfectly. They were great in the gym and on over hanging stuff. They work well in cracks too (even though they aren't board lasted) because of their slim profile you can get toes into small cracks.
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kalcario
Feb 19, 2005, 6:08 AM
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Back in the pre-sport climbing era of the mid-80's, all they made was high-top shoes that had a leather patch where your ankle bone sticks out, because otherwise it (the bone) would get all chewed up in cracks in the 4" to 8" range. I would never recommend low top shoes, like moccasyms or mythos, for crack climbing because once you start getting into wider cracks, you need that ankle-bone covered up. But do they even make high-top climbing shoes anymore?
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climbinginchico
Feb 19, 2005, 6:12 AM
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slacklinejoe, email Brian @ Evolv. You can fax them an outline of your foot to get accurate sizing. Haven't had a problem with my Bandits with SR rand. Great shoes.
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camhead
Feb 19, 2005, 5:03 PM
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In reply to: Back in the pre-sport climbing era of the mid-80's, all they made was high-top shoes that had a leather patch where your ankle bone sticks out, because otherwise it (the bone) would get all chewed up in cracks in the 4" to 8" range. I would never recommend low top shoes, like moccasyms or mythos, for crack climbing because once you start getting into wider cracks, you need that ankle-bone covered up. But do they even make high-top climbing shoes anymore?
An older guy that I climb with says that exact same thing... "dude, how can you climb cracks in moccs?"
He wears Sportiva Megas with socks, and says that it is incredibly difficult to find any type of high-topped shoe these days.
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petsfed
Feb 19, 2005, 8:09 PM
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In reply to: I really like my mocs for crack climbing, but I would not reccomend them to a person who is just learing to foot jam. To a beginner, this shoe would seem very unprotective and downright painful. I would advise a beginning crack climber to purchase sturdier shoes like the sportiva focus, 5.10 newton or boreal ace. When you have learned the basics of foot jamming, mocs make a great thin crack shoe.
John's right. It took a while before my mocc's seemed perfect. He does, however, own several dozen pairs of shoes, so he can be picky. The keys to a good crack shoe are : tight enough that your feet don't move, but not so tight that your toes are curled (at all); semi stiff. I liked my katanas until they died, sized up they could foot jam forever.
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climbinginchico
Feb 20, 2005, 1:43 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: slacklinejoe, email Brian @ Evolv. You can fax them an outline of your foot to get accurate sizing. Haven't had a problem with my Bandits with SR rand. Great shoes. Thanks - that was already the plan, but it's nice to hear that they do good sizing that way. I'm actually considering buying a pair of Kaos without the SR just to ensure I get the exact size first, then getting the bandits. Ok, so I'm really picky about sizing my shoes - but who isn't?
I got my Kaos in 8.5 and my Bandits in 9. They run slightly differently- the Kaos, my feet are curled up in them, very tightly. Awesome for sport and shorter stuff. The Bandits in 9 (both pairs have SR rand) are snug on the tip of my feet, but not uncomfortable, with my toes flat. Remember that the shoes do NOT stretch at all because they are synthetic.
Once again, Brian was an awesome help in sizing accurately.
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hello_heino
Feb 20, 2005, 2:08 AM
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In reply to: Back in the pre-sport climbing era of the mid-80's, all they made was high-top shoes that had a leather patch where your ankle bone sticks out, because otherwise it (the bone) would get all chewed up in cracks in the 4" to 8" range. I would never recommend low top shoes, like moccasyms or mythos, for crack climbing because once you start getting into wider cracks, you need that ankle-bone covered up. But do they even make high-top climbing shoes anymore?
I suspect that most of today's "self proclaimed" crack climbers do not venture into cracks wider than 3 or 4 inches. It is no longer fashionable to do so. Nor does one have to. One can just pick a particluar crack size, say finger, and just go round ticking as many possible, all while promulgating that they are indeed, a "crack climber".
O.W. has come to be interpreted from the topo as meaning: Other Way.
Now before people like brutusofwyde get panties bunched, just remember that I said "most".....not all. I personally, do not go near cracks that need pieces large than a #3 camalot. Why bother with all that grunting when there is no sex?
And to answrr the original questuion, I use Kaukulators when I do climb cracks at places like Devils Tower.
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smearhound
Feb 20, 2005, 2:17 PM
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In reply to: (both pairs have SR rand)
I seem to recall from the Evolv site that the toe rand option makes the shoe a wee bit stiffer. Do you notice any difficulty smearing? Have you tried the Bandits or Kaos without the SR rand?
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adamtd
Feb 20, 2005, 4:40 PM
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Sportiva Mythos for thin cracks. For hand cracks like my Kaukulators because they protect my ankles. You'll hard pressed to find those. I have recently found that my Sportiva Katanas work alright now that they're old and really stretched out so my toes are bunched up and lay flat. They key is finding shoes that allow your feet to lie flat with a thin toe profile. The Boreal Aces are also greta crack shoes as well as face climbing shoes.
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climbinginchico
Feb 20, 2005, 9:23 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: (both pairs have SR rand) I seem to recall from the Evolv site that the toe rand option makes the shoe a wee bit stiffer. Do you notice any difficulty smearing? Have you tried the Bandits or Kaos without the SR rand?
Haven't worn them without the SR rand. They both smear well. I find the bandits to smear a little better. They out-smear my mythos. Out edge them too. Comfort- same. Winner- Bandits, tho they aren't that kick ass purple color.
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smearhound
Feb 20, 2005, 9:43 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: (both pairs have SR rand) I seem to recall from the Evolv site that the toe rand option makes the shoe a wee bit stiffer. Do you notice any difficulty smearing? Have you tried the Bandits or Kaos without the SR rand? Haven't worn them without the SR rand. They both smear well. I find the bandits to smear a little better. They out-smear my mythos. Out edge them too. Comfort- same. Winner- Bandits, tho they aren't that kick ass purple color.
Great -- this is very helpful. Maybe Evolv will dye a pair of Bandits for me so that I won't feel so helpless on the next runout! Thanks.
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angelaa
Feb 23, 2005, 8:38 PM
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has anyone asked What kind of cracks are you climbing?
I LOVE my anasazi's in sandstone! didn't think I would like something that soft when I first got them, but they slide right in nicely and hold well too!
not sure I would want to use them in granite cracks - probably stick with my (OLD) hightops for that - - - what happened to all the hightops!?!?!
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tenesmus
Feb 23, 2005, 8:58 PM
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Its interesting to hear that Bandits do so well in cracks. I fit mine tight and they are killer for granite bouldering. Makes me want to get a bigger pair for cracks.
Here's the question: Should I get them a whole size bigger or a half? Will they stretch a little? What is this option of toe rand?
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urbanfood
Feb 23, 2005, 9:09 PM
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i'd get them so they fit comfortably. i think the jamming your foot into the shoe till it bleeds is overated. in my opinion, it's better to have a comfy pair of shoes that you enjoy wearing and then you can climb cracks all day long. i wish my aces were a 1/2 size bigger.
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climbinginchico
Feb 23, 2005, 9:59 PM
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In reply to: Its interesting to hear that Bandits do so well in cracks. I fit mine tight and they are killer for granite bouldering. Makes me want to get a bigger pair for cracks. Here's the question: Should I get them a whole size bigger or a half? Will they stretch a little? What is this option of toe rand?
Mine are sized so they are snug with my toes still flat. Snug enough for performance, yet comfortable enough to wear all day without taking them off.
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leinosaur
Feb 23, 2005, 10:01 PM
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In reply to: Back in the pre-sport climbing era of the mid-80's, all they made was high-top shoes that had a leather patch where your ankle bone sticks out, because otherwise it (the bone) would get all chewed up in cracks in the 4" to 8" range. I would never recommend low top shoes, like moccasyms or mythos, for crack climbing because once you start getting into wider cracks, you need that ankle-bone covered up. But do they even make high-top climbing shoes anymore?
from K-mac's Salt Lake OR TR:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/...p.cgi?Detailed=48018
high-top huecos, basically; sounds good. my other huecos are super comfy all day, cracks or whatnot, but the boxy toe didn't do much for me on the little finger-crack I was flailing around on, last sunday.
Also, my first pair were La Sportiva Enduros - high-tops, they were, but already discontinued when I got 'em - that's why they were $40! Good all-day shoe though, board-lasted, a beginner shoe if that means built to last.
edit a few weeks later - I put the Enduros back into service for a bunch of hands-to-offwidth widening splitters, and they're great. Board-lasted, etc. and good ankle protection. I still need plenty of work on my offwidth techniques, but it ain't the shoes that are the problem!
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angry
Apr 3, 2005, 2:46 PM
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OK I don't disagree with the people here saying that Evolve Bandits are a good crack shoe, they are. Especially if you have to edge a lot outside the crack.
Evolve does make a shoe that for pure foot/toe/or a little teeny part of the rand in the crack climbing is better. It's more comfortable, softer, cheaper, and you can crank in it. It's the Quest. It doesn't look as bling as the Bandit but it's fabulous. I've used mine on hard single pitch lines, multi-pitch lines in Yosemite (as hard as 11c), offwidth, and in a pinch bouldering. I've never found these shoes lacking in any aspect.
My beta is to own 2 pairs of identical Quests and one pair of Bandits.
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karlbaba
Apr 3, 2005, 3:17 PM
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In reply to: Back in the pre-sport climbing era of the mid-80's, all they made was high-top shoes that had a leather patch where your ankle bone sticks out, because otherwise it (the bone) would get all chewed up in cracks in the 4" to 8" range. I would never recommend low top shoes, like moccasyms or mythos, for crack climbing because once you start getting into wider cracks, you need that ankle-bone covered up. But do they even make high-top climbing shoes anymore?
High top shoes are, in my opinion, unnecessary. If someone is just starting as a crack climber, stiff shoes and high top shoes can be a helpful crutch.
If you need ankle protection, wear neoprene or elastic ankle braces under your shoes for the wicked pitch.
Otherwise, stiff shoes are a serious liability in cracks smaller than hands. You can't fit the toes in. When Potter soloed astroman, he brought two pairs of shoes, slippers for the cracks, and stiff ones for the face climbing. You need some stiffness to stand on tiny edges.
Peace
karl
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gunksgoer
Apr 3, 2005, 3:52 PM
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i use my sportiva mythos for cracks. theyre sized so my feet lie basically flat, and they slot into thinner cracks well. the one problem ive had with them is the weird leather overlap thing that the laces go thru (like an eyelet) is starting to come unsewn. i figure ill find a resoler who can sew it back and cover it with an extra big rand. The laces are starting to look frayed in one spot as well, and im hoping a i will be able to replace them, but the weird lacing system will probably make it hard.
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jaybro
Apr 4, 2005, 3:41 AM
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Karl, you're the man, and mostly I agree with you, most of us will never need high top shoes;
However
What about when you put your foot over your head? espeacially in a heel toe? slippers were not made for: the Owl, Trench warfare, Comfortably Numb, Squat and many others.
There is a time for (almost) everything; Unecessary is not the same as rarely needed; kids, use tools as appropriate.
Most of us don't need to own bat hooks, either.
There only a few climbs I use high tops or bat hooks on.
All in fun, but for real
Jay
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boymeetsrock
Apr 7, 2005, 7:11 PM
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the lasportiva focus is an excelent crack shoe. It takes some practice to edge well with them, but in a corner or a crack, they're like portable stairs.
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dirtme
Apr 7, 2005, 10:16 PM
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Moccs here too. I size them the same as my street shoe. I wear them pretty dang loose but they're nice and comfy for the gym and can do thin crack. I also have a pair of Mythos and Megas. I like the Mythos but for some strange reason I like them better in the creek then in the valley. The megas are only good for hand and above cracks. Everything else face and thin, I feel really sketchy.
Mythos stretch quite a bit too so size them appropriately.
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