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Partner euroford


Aug 2, 2005, 3:45 PM
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Dude, you couldn't be more wrong...

probobly, i'm not all that familiar with british topography, but i was under the impresion that there really isn't a whole lot of rock over there.

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For a start, the Brits pretty much invented climbing.

past history (asside from its impact on ethics) has very little to do with the modern day racks poeple carry.

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Second, aid and big routes aren't the domain of the US.

thats very true, but i don't think anywhere in the world has the quantity of easily assesable wall route that we do. i can't think of any other country where a typical weekend warrior can do a wall climb on a weekend.

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And their climbing is not limited by any stretch of the imagination.

i would have to say that the climbing is only limited by your stretch of the imagination!

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No offense intended, but they were some pretty silly and uninformed sounding statements mate.

well do inform me then!

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EDIT: They suck at Cricket though :P

lol. my uncle Andy Jalil is a commentator for cricket over there, but i still havn't gotten him to explain that crazy game to me!


nowinowski


Aug 2, 2005, 3:46 PM
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i had a feeling you wouldn't understand. Have you ever spent time in the Valley? Just because it is a splitter crack doesn't mean it is a sport climb.


jelliott


Aug 2, 2005, 3:51 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?


Partner euroford


Aug 2, 2005, 4:40 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?

well, like i said my uncle is an expert at it, and he said he couldn't!!

(at least not to a 'merican like me!)


jelliott


Aug 2, 2005, 4:43 PM
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well, like i said my uncle is an expert at it, and he said he couldn't!!

then can it be a sport or is it more of a fanciful game like cowboys and indians


tradmanclimbs


Aug 2, 2005, 6:21 PM
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Dirt in brain I prefer doubbled shoulder length runners and dislike trippled ones, that is my prefrence. I bring allong a few draws because they are less bulky than a doubbled or trippled runner and I have the experience to use them in the proper places. It depends on the climb as to what gear i bring and how I use it. Your rack looks suspiciously shiny to me by the way :roll: and you do come off as an arrogant a hole :shock: To make a blanket statement that draws are not useable for gear pitches is just a bit narrowminded and ignorant :twisted:


flipnfall


Aug 2, 2005, 6:50 PM
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I'm still wierded out by the fact that he called a biner a "crab" :shock:

GT


kimmyt


Aug 2, 2005, 6:56 PM
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I'm still wierded out by the fact that he called a biner a "crab" :shock:

GT

Why? Don't you have crabs? The majority of the climbers I know have them. My partner even gave me some once!


kachoong


Aug 2, 2005, 9:53 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?
Do you have five days? :lol:


sbaclimber


Aug 2, 2005, 10:02 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?
Do you have five days? :lol:
Come on folks, it isn't that bad! I am your typical american idiot, and it only took 20 minutes to grasp all of the basics. Sure, there are plenty of little 'special' rules and such, but those aren't important to understanding 95% of the game (plus I don't know the 'special' rules of any of the american sports either).
What IS a challange though, is actually sitting and watching the game. Its interest and excitement level is somewhere between american baseball and golf (in other words....little to none). And a test match can last 5 DAYS, weeeeee :shock:
I could only see watching a game in the same manner in which most american sports are observed, completely pissed (drunk, for all of my fellow amis)!


saxfiend


Aug 2, 2005, 10:11 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?
Sort of like baseball, with these differences (among many others):

-- you use a flat bat
-- when you hit the ball, you run back and forth between home and first, instead of rounding four bases
-- you keep hitting until somebody gets you out (games last for days)

Something like that. :?

JL


kachoong


Aug 2, 2005, 10:52 PM
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seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?
Do you have five days? :lol:
Come on folks, it isn't that bad! I am your typical american idiot, and it only took 20 minutes to grasp all of the basics. Sure, there are plenty of little 'special' rules and such, but those aren't important to understanding 95% of the game (plus I don't know the 'special' rules of any of the american sports either).
What IS a challange though, is actually sitting and watching the game. Its interest and excitement level is somewhere between american baseball and golf (in other words....little to none). And a test match can last 5 DAYS, weeeeee :shock:
I could only see watching a game in the same manner in which most american sports are observed, completely pissed (drunk, for all of my fellow amis)!
I was just kidding :P ....it doesn't take too many brain cells to learn any game.... you just have to WANT to learn it, s'all....
There are a few variations on the length of the game of cricket, which can also make it last a half or full day.... a lot more exciting :wink: :lol:


sbaclimber


Aug 2, 2005, 11:13 PM
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There are a few variations on the length of the game of cricket, which can also make it last a half or full day.... a lot more exciting :wink: :lol:
Well, yes... but I have watched a few 1 day matches on TV, and to be honest, to say they are 'more exciting' is like saying 'a 100 meter fall will kill you less than a 1000 meter fall'. Guess I am just not a proper sports fan :?


claramie


Aug 2, 2005, 11:47 PM
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I do not have any aliens/tricam/ball nuts or any other such peace of gear nor can I envisage any route that I would need such gear at the grade I climb. I donít think its just me, I very rarely see British climbers climbing with much more then the above unless they are climbing at a very high grade and need to protect a particularly tricky route.

I'm American but I learned trad in Oz from climbers who adhere the the philosophy that if you place active gear, you didn't find the passive placement that was there. That being said, I carry active gear anyways. I also seem to place a lot of hexes.

Aliens are great for finger cracks and especially horizontals. Tri-Cams, Aliens and TCUs all work well in pockets depending on the shape/size/etc.

I love heading up a trad line with a light rack, but that also landed me in a situation where I was stacking nuts at the crux of a climb (albeit an easy climb) two weeks ago. Moral: I'd rather carry the weight and have the gear when I need it

CL


ajkclay


Aug 3, 2005, 12:08 AM
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Well, yes... but I have watched a few 1 day matches on TV, and to be honest, to say they are 'more exciting' is like saying 'a 100 meter fall will kill you less than a 1000 meter fall'.

Heh heh funny

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Guess I am just not a proper sports fan :?

Is that because you are a Kiwi? :lol:

(Note to American readers; BIG sports rivalry issues between Aust and NZ, a bit like big brother vs little brother, little bro always wants to beat big bro, but just can't seem to do it very often :lol:)

Peace though, big bro is just teasing!


sbaclimber


Aug 3, 2005, 12:15 AM
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Guess I am just not a proper sports fan :?

Is that because you are a Kiwi? :lol:

(Note to American readers; BIG sports rivalry issues between Aust and NZ, a bit like big brother vs little brother, little bro always wants to beat big bro, but just can't seem to do it very often :lol:)

Peace though, big bro is just teasing!
hehe, actually I am an american living in NZ. If I were a Kiwi, I think I would be obligated to be a sports (read, rugby and cricket) fan. As it is, I can play the foreigner card when a sport doesn't interest me. I do enjoy watching rugby though (preferably in a pub w/ a pint, of course), end even won tickets to the first All Blacks vs. Lions game here in Christchurch. It was a really good game! Much better live than most of the inner-NZ games tend to be...


ajkclay


Aug 3, 2005, 12:24 AM
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In reply to:
seriously can someone explain the game of Cricket?
Sort of like baseball, with these differences (among many others):

-- you use a flat bat
-- when you hit the ball, you run back and forth between home and first, instead of rounding four bases
-- you keep hitting until somebody gets you out (games last for days)

Something like that. :?

JL

You forgot to add that the pitcher doesn't have to just stand there, he can take a run-up, and he can pretty much bowl the ball at whatever part of your anatomy he likes, and just to add some spice he generally bounces it off of a turf pitch which has cracks that can make the ball bounce off in weird and unexpected directions, reducing your chances of predicting exactly which part of your anatomy is in the firing line! Below the knees and above the chest is fair game, especially the toes and nose. :twisted:

Oh, and until the 80's you were considered a pussy if you dared to wear a helmet. :twisted:

And as for fielders, well they can stand as close as they want, a man standing at silly mid-on is literally only three to four feet away from the batsman who is trying to belt the ball as hard as he can to shift the annoying bugger. Fielders don't get to wear gloves either, you catch it with your bare hands! (except the wicket keeper)

And then in winter we play Aussie Rules!

Maybe that explains why we don't have the same issues using quickdraws. :twisted:

(hey! nice little tie-in huh? just thought of it then)

ahhhhh I love it here, why live anywhere else?


cracknut


Aug 3, 2005, 12:25 AM
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I have to agree with the dirt man. There's nothing wrong with QDs but why would you carry something with only one use when you could just as easily carry something more versatile. I would much rather find myself at the belay with a runner or two than a couple of QDs especially if the pitch was a rope stretcher. As far as easy clipping goes, I use wire gates and they clip pretty damn smooth. QDs are easier for some people to clip because they are held in place. If you can't clip a free hanging "crab" maybe you just need a little more practice. Quickdraws are fine if thats all you've got but given the choice I'll take runners.


caughtinside


Aug 3, 2005, 12:44 AM
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On a typical crack climb, I'll take 8 or 9 tripled runners, and 3 quickdraws. The draws have 7" bones, and are loose and floppy on the top end. I really like this set up. I find that the draws are just easier to operate when I'm clipping an extension on a piece at a crux, or from a tenuous stance. The bottom biner is ALWAYS right side up. Can't say the same for tripled slings. They don't get tangled with other crap on my harness like the tripled slings do. And they are easier to clip.

I almost NEVER get to the belay with a quickdraw, while I usually have a runner or two left over.

I don't worry about not having slings at the anchor, because you can always build a rope anchor if that's what's necessary. But this very seldom happens. I usually have one 48" runner, or a cordelette.

As for dirtineye, this is a favorite subject of his. I think he is under the impression that all quickdraws are very stiff. Which is simply not the case. I think he also thinks that all draws are very short. WHich is also not true.

He also alluded to the fact that he does not extend every one of his tripled slings, so I'm not sure why he is so adamant on the subject. Rather, I'd say the pitch is extremely rare where you DO extend everything, and in such situations, the QD works just as well, in addition to the other advantages I listed. So I don't believe I am sacrificing a degree of versatility worth worrying about.

But, if he wants to keep pretending that he's the only one with a clue, I'm not going to stop him. 8^)


kachoong


Aug 3, 2005, 12:57 AM
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On a typical crack climb, I'll take 8 or 9 tripled runners, and 3 quickdraws. The draws have 7" bones, and are loose and floppy on the top end. I really like this set up. I find that the draws are just easier to operate when I'm clipping an extension on a piece at a crux, or from a tenuous stance. The bottom biner is ALWAYS right side up. Can't say the same for tripled slings. They don't get tangled with other crap on my harness like the tripled slings do. And they are easier to clip.

I agree. You can never really have to many runners.... I don't usually use triples, but it depends on the style of the route. Here at Frog Buttress where the cracks are more or less vertical you can get away with carrying a double and some single slings. Some people clip straight to the cam, which I try and avoid, especially the first two placements. I'll usually use a single sling on the first piece and a long draw on the second....

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I don't worry about not having slings at the anchor, because you can always build a rope anchor if that's what's necessary. But this very seldom happens. I usually have one 48" runner, or a cordelette.
Another good point I think. Not very often do you have a situation where you need the rope out of the belay system....eg. doing all the lead pitches.... I suppose in an emergency it's good to have the rope free to use..... a cordellete serves well. I'll only really use a QD at the belay to hang stuff off it....


Partner rgold


Aug 3, 2005, 4:36 PM
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Returning to the original troll, KR's generalizations about U.K. climbing practices are just as bogus as his conclusions about U.S. practices.

For example, the following advice about racks comes from from Needlsports.com:

"...these notes are very personal and are only intended to give an idea of a suitable rack for leading long pitches at the upper end of your grade ability."

Friends 0 - 3.5.

Two sets wired stoppers (18 pieces).

One set RP's plus two micro-rocs.

Three Rockcentrics (useful for belays).

Twelve Quickdraws, four in each of three lengths.

Six slings in two lengths.

9 free biners.

Four screw-gates.

Not nearly as lean as KR would have us believe.


caughtinside


Aug 3, 2005, 4:46 PM
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Yes, but I do agree that there are some gigantic racks being carried on climbs. I don't think it's that uncommon to see someone carrying close to 20 cams, plus who knows how many nuts, tricams, etc.

But, whatever you're comfortable with. If you carry too much, I have a feeling that you'll shed some gear as you gain experience. When you keep showing up at a belay with 20 pieces left, that's a good hint!


rossgoddard


Aug 3, 2005, 5:28 PM
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Correct me if I am wrong but I thought Goran died because of a failed biner that possibly had micro cracks.
micro fractures do not exist.


jelliott


Aug 3, 2005, 5:36 PM
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then what you would you like to call them


rossgoddard


Aug 3, 2005, 5:45 PM
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thats the thing... They dont exist! You shouldnt call them anything, because they are a made up hoax.
im not kidding
-harrison

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