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madrock
Aug 18, 2005, 1:27 AM
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areyoumydude
Honemaster
Location: In my head
676 posts added
since 28 Dec 2003
Offline Posted: 17 Aug 2005 15:47
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climbsomething wrote:
madrock wrote:
]Hey On Belay 5.10 / Flash Guru, It will last longer when you start climbing harder than 5.10
Do you really think insulting your customers, who have a valid criticism about the durability of your product, is an effective marketing strategy?
Joe's point is valid. If you are only climbing 5.10 your footwork is not very good. My Flashes are on their second resole and are still in good shape.
_________________
Whateva...I do what I want.
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climbsomething
Aug 18, 2005, 1:31 AM
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What are you trying to prove?
Just because you're not the only asshole doesn't mean you're above reproach. Consider your title, how you represent your company, and that maybe, just MAYBE, a few of us consumers are intelligent.
I will never purchase another MadRock product again, and obviously, a few other people agree with me.
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climbsomething
Aug 18, 2005, 1:42 AM
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Changing the thread name to divert attention away from your faux-pas, eh, madrock?
You just keep digging that hole.
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squish
Aug 18, 2005, 2:19 AM
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In reply to: I will never purchase another MadRock product again, and obviously, a few other people agree with me.
I was considering MadRock shoes for my next pair, but now I'm kind of put off, too. I wouldn't turn it into a boycott-vendetta, personally, but I do find their spokesman's behaviour dishonest and rude.
Since this is my one and only acquaintance with someone from MadRock, I'll be sure to tell my friends about this whenever the topic of Mad Rock comes up!
It's not out of spite or anything, but just because the whole episode of Mr. MadRock insulting 5.10 climbers, hiding threads, and calling us all smart asses (which we are!) was so... weird.
What it also shows me is that they don't want to see open discussion about their product, and that leads me to believe they're hiding something about their product's quality... A few people have said the same thing about rands blowing out, and the thread got renamed so "MadRock" would no longer be in the title. Yes, we do notice these things.
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squierbypetzl
Moderator
Aug 18, 2005, 2:35 AM
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WHAT THE HECK HAPPENED TO THIS THREAD!?!?!!
It started off by madrock trying to get some names for their new (shoe) rubber, he puts someone down pretty bad (I like MadRock -heart:MadPad- but ouch, not cool man...), he gets called on his mistake and moves the thread.
But alas, despite his efforts people donīt forget this original thread and find it again, and now madrock has posted something rather ironic/hypocritical as the 1st post.
In reply to: I have noticed that many people on Rockclimbing.com who are asking legitimate question are oftem bombarded by Jokes, Smart ass remarks and generally useless information. Perhaps they could start a specific forum for this activity. I enjoy it as much as anyone and would certainly join in whenever possible. Let the games begin. Joe Garland
Sorry to tear into you like this, I realize it was just a dumb mistake, that you probably spaced out and wrote something you shouldnīt have, and that your (probably) just human like the rest of us...
But the truth needs to be told!!
And even if I didnīt do it, someone else would have.
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squierbypetzl
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Aug 18, 2005, 2:43 AM
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Climbsomething said:
In reply to: (...)My opinions about MadRock shoes come strictly from a consumer. They're gimmicky, ugly, cheaply-constructed trash. I wasn't planning on buying another pair anyway, but especially not now after seeing what grade A asshats their fearless leaders are (anybody else gotten an illuminating private message?). With as many pairs as they've sold to clueless cheap noobs you'd think they could hire a real marketing agency to help them name their shit products, not to mention clean up those amateur print ads. "Don't dish it out if you can't take it" boys.
In reply to: What are you trying to prove? Just because you're not the only asshole doesn't mean you're above reproach. Consider your title, how you represent your company, and that maybe, just MAYBE, a few of us consumers are intelligent. I will never purchase another MadRock product again, and obviously, a few other people agree with me.
In reply to: Climbsomething Not as Evil as Maculated
I personally donīt know Mac, but I find your claim rather hard to believe... :D
After seeing what your doing to madrock, pleez donīt get mad at me!! :wink:
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climbsomething
Aug 18, 2005, 2:47 AM
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Mac is a lovely girl. We all know I crush her in evilness. I just can't change the title just yet ;)
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philfell
Aug 18, 2005, 3:08 AM
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Some of us find your evilness quite endearing though, keep it up.
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atg200
Aug 18, 2005, 3:23 AM
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atg200 crosses Madrock off the list of shoe companies to consider next...
Nice job insulting your customers asshole. I bite back and don't post insulting responses on boards that my clients frequent - perhaps you should too.
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freeskicolorado
Aug 18, 2005, 3:36 AM
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I think climbsomething has pretty much got things under control here, but I'll add my thoughts.
I've never owned Mad Rock shoes, so I can't personally judge their quality. Many of my friends have them; most have held up fine. One of my friends did have trouble with his self-destructing (well before I thought they should have, given comparisons with other climbers and that his footwork, while far from wonderful, is not bad). Mad Rock basically wasn't willing to do anything about it. Whatever, I thought it was a little poor, but as it didn't directly affect me, so I didn't really let it tarnish my view of the company much.
While I've never bought shoes from them, I have recommended their shoes many times, as I felt they appeared to offer the best value to a new climber. This was before I was aware that the durability issues were as commonplace as they seem they may be. I know for certain that Mad Rock sold at least one pair of shoes, possibly more, directly from my recommendations.
I am one of those people who absolutely demands good customer service. My expectations are not unreasonable. If a company wants my money, I expect them to treat me in a respectful, courteous, and professional manner. And I expect them to stand behind their product, to a reasonable degree. That's it.
I've been around manufacturing for the majority of my (admittedly short) life. There is no such thing as a perfect manufacturing process. Some are better than others, but there always are and always will be defects. That said, when I pay for a product, I pay for a non-defective product. If I happen to, by chance, recieve a defective product, I expect the company to replace it. It's pretty simple, and many, many companies do it this way, and these are the companies which get my business on a regular basis.
So, what's my point? Joe's smartass comment showed a lack of respect, concern, and professionalism towards the customer. It matters very little whether the concern was valid or not. There are other, better ways to deal with an unjustified complaint that aren't rude and disrespectful. What's worse is rather than take responsibility and apologize, Joe is making every effort to hide or justify his comments by changing the title of the thread, attempting to shift hostility away from himself towards others, etc. WTF? Why the shenanigans? A simple, sincere apology could have repaired 95% of the damage.
Now, it's not as if I'm against smartass comments. I'm as big a smart ass as you'll ever meet. In fact, I think that his original comment towards onbelay510 would have been kinda funny, except for the fact that he was acting as a company representative at the time. So instead of being humorous, he basically told everyone that they aren't interested in selling shoes to anyone who can't climb at least 5.11. Hmmm, that eliminates probably 2/3 of the available market.
What's funny is Joe could have posted that comment if he wanted and have gotten away with it just fine. All he had to do was post from a personal username rather than a company one. Essentially, seperate the comment from the company.
I can assure you that Mad Rock will no longer get any recommendations on my part, and I definitely won't be buying anything from them.
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tedwarski
Aug 18, 2005, 3:38 AM
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I'd say this was good timing for me. I was just considering getting other shoes to try beyond my typical Boreals.
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anykineclimb
Aug 18, 2005, 3:46 AM
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Whats up with trying to sweep this under the rug?
Now, I was almost expecting you to say that you knew the guy you insulted and it was an inside joke or something. Instead, you change the title and the original post and act like it never happened. You're a fucking coward.
You need to sack up and appologize for that statement. Hell, you don't even have your name at the bottom of your posts anymore! Whats up with that??
What you've done is throw mud on the face of the very company you represent here. You must not be familiar with the addage "If you're happy with a company, you tell a friend. If you're unhappy, you tell TEN friends."
This is very true, in fact, you'll be seeing the results of it.
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veganboyjosh
Aug 18, 2005, 3:46 AM
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ditto the "my current pair is the last pair of mad rocks i'll ever buy."
i was happy with them, until asshat made fun of his customer(s). i don't climb higher than 5.10 either. perhaps another company will want my 5.8 dollars.
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squierbypetzl
Moderator
Aug 18, 2005, 4:14 AM
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Well, my onsight level is/was (literally) 1 move away from 5..11a, but I donīt care if you climb 5.6īs or 5.13īs.
ITīS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO MAKE FUN OF A COSTUMER!!!
ESPECIALLY ON AN INTERNET COMMUNITY SITE WITH TENS OF THOUSANDS OF MEMBERS, AND ESPECIALLY ON THIS PARTICULAR SITE WHERE THINGS ARENīT EASILY FORGOTTEN AND WORD TRAVELS FAST
I really want(ed) a MadPad, so ítīs a damn shame Iīll have to factor in this unfortunate occurence wen deciding between your pad and one from Metolius.
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curt
Aug 18, 2005, 4:27 AM
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In reply to: Well, my onsight level is/was (literally) 1 move away from 5..11a, but I donīt care if you climb 5.6īs or 5.13īs.
ITīS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO MAKE FUN OF A COSTUMER!!!
Exactly. Anybody dressed-up funny may go off--if you offend him. :lol:
Curt
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squish
Aug 18, 2005, 4:39 AM
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In reply to: Well, my onsight level is/was (literally) 1 move away from 5..11a, but I donīt care if you climb 5.6īs or 5.13īs.
ITīS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO MAKE FUN OF A COSTUMER!!!
Well, it can make good public relations to be candid with the customers... but tactfully: "If your shoes are wearing out too fast, maybe you should focus on your footwork? wink, wink" or something like that...
The fact that madrock's comment may have been a foot in mouth moment would be fine by me. It wouldn't bug me too much, especially if he followed through and tried to resolve or address the concern.
I think what's worse, and far more insulting, is sweeping everything under the rug and blaming all us smart asses for the direction of the thread. There are three separate threads now, not for lack of madrock trying to hide them:
Here, here, and here. It's obvious to me they don't care about anyone's opinion, they just want free marketing info.
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philbox
Moderator
Aug 18, 2005, 5:01 AM
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Notice from the management of rockclimbing.com.
We would like it known that no staff have edited the original topic title. The only reason that any topic would have its title edited would be if the title were grossly inapropriate. For instance if a title contained cuss words we would definitely not like that showing up on the front page in fact if a thread showed up anywhere on the site with an inflammatory title it may well simply be sent to the archives.
Our policy is to mod less and allow the members to self moderate as they are doing in this thread, it is not our policy to overly moderate any thread here on this site.
I would ask that people exhibit civil behaviour, that is merely a general comment that applies to all threads, posts and forums even to a degree that still applies in community.
We are currently discussing in the mods forum whether a user should be allowed to edit an original topic title. This thread is very much a case in point. We would like a little input from the users on this given the demonstration here in the title to this thread.
Over to you, what say ye?
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veganboyjosh
Aug 18, 2005, 5:14 AM
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philbox...
thanks for the post. i think it's clear from the posts that no one thought the thread title was changed by anyone from the site.
i think it would be good to leave the title open to change by the o.p., simply cos of typos, or as thread drift occurs, another title may become more appropriate. also, how many "please help" type titles have there been, and without the ability and the suggestion to change them, they'd still be out there.
if dude wants to post as a company rep, he needs to step up. along with the benefit of getting your name out there to all those potential customers in rockclimbing.com land, is the risk that you'll say something that comes back to bite you in the ass.
as you know, there are other company reps and owners that post regularly, and step up when they make mistakes, or they take care not to step on toes in the first place when they do post. and they are the ones whose posts are respected, and listened to, and looked forward to.
i think it's safe to say that the o.p. of this thread does not belong in that camp. other than looking forward to what goofy antics will arise in the newest thread, and the silly online drama that it's sure to bring, i think this guy won't be posting much, if he knows what's good for him, his job, and/or the company he says he represents.
let users have the power to hang themselves. it's obvious with this thread that he's been trying his darnedest.
how would locking the thread titles from being changed once they've posted change this dude's shooting himself in the foot?
sorry to ramble, it's late, and i just ate a bunch of watermelon...
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squish
Aug 18, 2005, 5:15 AM
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In reply to: Our policy is to mod less and allow the members to self moderate as they are doing in this thread, it is not our policy to overly moderate any thread here on this site.
Notice from one user: Your policy rocks! Woo!
In reply to: We are currently discussing in the mods forum whether a user should be allowed to edit an original topic title. This thread is very much a case in point. We would like a little input from the users on this given the demonstration here in the title to this thread. Over to you, what say ye?
I agree that it shouldn't be editable, except by the mods, or by request to the mods. Once you start a topic, why should its title change?
It becomes confusing when searching for a topic if its title has changed.
It can allow shady behaviour.
I've seen in the past that some topics have had posts split off into a new thread if the focus takes a hard 90 degrees off the rails, and that's fine. I would prefer that to chasing user-renamed threads.
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curt
Aug 18, 2005, 5:16 AM
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Phil,
Allowing the OP to edit the title of a thread is problematic.
1) It causes people to think that site moderators may have intervened, when they did not.
and
2) It allows the OP to essentially "hide" a thread for their own benefit, as in this case.
Curt
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veganboyjosh
Aug 18, 2005, 5:18 AM
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i didn't think about the "where the hell did that thread go" factor in my above post.
good point. hmmm.
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march
Aug 18, 2005, 5:45 AM
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In reply to: What's funny is Joe could have posted that comment if he wanted and have gotten away with it just fine. All he had to do was post from a personal username rather than a company one. Essentially, seperate the comment from the company.
Agreed. We can be smart asses because we're just people. When you're representing your company you've gotta play by different rules.
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march
Aug 18, 2005, 5:47 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: Well, my onsight level is/was (literally) 1 move away from 5..11a, but I donīt care if you climb 5.6īs or 5.13īs.
ITīS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO MAKE FUN OF A COSTUMER!!!Exactly. Anybody dressed-up funny may go off--if you offend him. :lol: Curt
That was epic. Good one Curt.
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philbox
Moderator
Aug 18, 2005, 5:48 AM
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All good discussion, I`m very keen to hear more input. If there is going to be change then I very much want it to come from you guys. Of course it doesn`t have to change either. Just putting it out there for discussion to see where things end up is all.
I know that the thread has virtually been hijacked but due to the thread title change it is definitely worth discussing the whys and wherefores here in this thread as a result of said title change.
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crotch
Aug 18, 2005, 7:05 AM
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Titles should be open for editing by the OP, but the new title should be followed by the old title in parentheses (was:Old Title) so that you know what it used to be.
Following that, the title of this thread would be Smart Ass Comments (was: Mad Rock. Name the new Rubber contest.)
In any case, noone was fooled by this title change.
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