I'm sure I can. You'll note it was I who offered the olive branch above.

I don't actually dislike Jay. I agree with the majority of what he writes on these forums. He's a smart guy.

Except it's simply not the case that doctors recommend medicine and surgeons recommend surgery. Very often, doctors refer people to surgeons and vice versa.

Sometimes doctors and surgeons even work together to solve problems!

I'm trying to see how I miscommunicated (to some) on this thread.

When I said, "medical doctors prescribe medicine, and surgeons prescribe surgery", that was not intended to mean, "every medical doctor always prescribes medicine every time without regard to the actual needs of the patient", or "every surgeon always cuts every patient open regardless of whether the patient needs surgery or not".

I thought the generality was obvious, but perhaps not.

I'm trying to see how I miscommunicated (to some) on this thread.

When I said, "medical doctors prescribe medicine, and surgeons prescribe surgery", that was not intended to mean, "every medical doctor always prescribes medicine every time without regard to the actual needs of the patient", or "every surgeon always cuts every patient open regardless of whether the patient needs surgery or not".

I thought the generality was obvious, but perhaps not.

If you think, however, that surgeons make a living giving out cheap advice, or referring a patient for PT to avoid surgery, or to a GP or pain management specialist, you are wrong. Surgery pays the bills.

If you call up a busy GP practice, and get the prompt, "touch 1 for if this is an emergency, touch 2 if you are a hospital or health care provider" (etc), there will usually be a prompt along the lines of, "press 5 if you need to renew a prescription". This indicates that the doctor supplies a sizable population of patients on medication. It is what they do, and it pays the bills.

Of course they sometimes give advice, or refer out. But usually, they do what they do best.

You're digging yourself in deeper.
If your "press 5" story is the type of evidence you have to support your "general" defaming of doctors and surgeons, it's just childish and disrespectful to people who have, for the most part, put in a great deal of time studying and working to help other people.

It was not even remotely obvious, especially in light of your follow-up comments: "Surgeons make a living cutting people open, not giving advice. Your surgeon made little or no money advising you, but would have made thousands doing surgery. That is what surgeons do." and "Perhaps you think the reason surgeons get board certified in orthopedics is so they can give out cheap advice."

Jay