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drector
May 19, 2011, 12:35 AM
Post #26 of 28
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Registered: Aug 27, 2002
Posts: 1037
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blueeyedclimber wrote: drector wrote: blueeyedclimber wrote: PEOPLE - As many as possible. No other source comes close to hands on learning or observation. Even the idiots, gumbies, and n00bs have something to teach (what NOT to do?) PEOPLE - No other source has the potential to kill you without your even knowing it's happening. There is no certification process so how is a noob going to know if their impromptu teacher is just an idiot about to get them killed? There is certainly no way for a noob to learn what not to do from someone who does all of the wrong things. I would substitute that "PEOPLE" with "PEOPLE WHO ARE KNOWN TO BE QUALIFIED". Maybe if a few people are around at the same time, the odds of them all failing int he same way is low enough to make total strangers fairly safe. If they disagree on something, just run away. Dave I think the "ALL n00bs are dangerous and are out to kill you and you should hire a guide so you don't die a hideous death" is WAY overblown. n00bs do silly things. It's all part of the learning process. Common sense, thirst for knowledge , observation, and lots of questions are how n00bs survive the learning years. Like I said in my first post, PEOPLE, including the one's that you learn what NOT to do from. Josh
I didn't say "hire a guide" and would never say such a thing. A n00b should be informed in this thread that relying on a single person to teach them is risky. They might hook up with the guy who wants to use a gri gri on his top rope anchor because he doesn't trust his belayer. I'd hate to have gotten stuck on my first top rope climb because someone didn't bother to understand their gear. How does the n00b recognize that guy?
I will reiterate:
"PEOPLE WHO ARE KNOWN TO BE QUALIFIED"
Then again, how would anyone know who is qualified. I was lucky enough to be born, or trained, to be mechanically inclined. Some people are not at all blessed with that ability and can't tie their shoes if they change the color of the laces. They learn by rote and can't evaluate anything new on their own. How can they tell if they are being fed crap or not from the one guy they found at the crag?
I see whole groups of people doing dumb $hit at the crag. The n00bs they teach are doomed.
Sure, let one random person teach you how to climb. Just pray he's not the runt of the litter.
Dave
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blueeyedclimber
May 19, 2011, 1:33 PM
Post #27 of 28
(610 views)
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Registered: Nov 19, 2002
Posts: 4602
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drector wrote: I didn't say "hire a guide" and would never say such a thing. A n00b should be informed in this thread that relying on a single person to teach them is risky. They might hook up with the guy who wants to use a gri gri on his top rope anchor because he doesn't trust his belayer. I'd hate to have gotten stuck on my first top rope climb because someone didn't bother to understand their gear. How does the n00b recognize that guy? I will reiterate: "PEOPLE WHO ARE KNOWN TO BE QUALIFIED" Then again, how would anyone know who is qualified. I was lucky enough to be born, or trained, to be mechanically inclined. Some people are not at all blessed with that ability and can't tie their shoes if they change the color of the laces. They learn by rote and can't evaluate anything new on their own. How can they tell if they are being fed crap or not from the one guy they found at the crag? I see whole groups of people doing dumb $hit at the crag. The n00bs they teach are doomed. Sure, let one random person teach you how to climb. Just pray he's not the runt of the litter. Dave
That's why I said PEOPLE, not PERSON. I guess I just have more faith in humanity than you do.
Second, If you're not saying to hire a guide, then what do you mean by "KNOWN TO BE QUALIFIED?"
n00bs should take info from as many sources as possible. Than they can separate the chaff from the wheat, or however that saying goes. 
Josh
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jjones16
May 21, 2011, 3:32 AM
Post #28 of 28
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Registered: Aug 2, 2010
Posts: 80
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I started climbing in a gym last August, and I just did my first multi-pitch trad lead two weeks ago. I still very much consider myself a beginner.
I have sought out every credible source of information including; books, magazines, vids, pics, professional instruction in a gym (TR belay class and a rappelling class) and advice from veteran climbers.
Also, I learned a lot from my own gear. I would buy a piece, look at the manufacturer's site, and play with it for hours on the ground at the crag before I ever thought about employing it. You'd be surprised how much you can learn from the actual "proper usage" brochure that comes with every new piece of gear.
There are also ways to learn safely, especially with regard to sport leading. To learn the difference between just "TR movement" and trying to find a stance from which to clip in, I top-roped routes, carried draws on my loop, and tied into a mock lead rope. Once I was confident that I could get to the top of a 5.6 clipping into every draw smoothly, I dropped the TR and started real leading.
I don't know that once source is better than another. All I can say is that if you're serious about climbing with good technique and safe procedures, seek out as many CREDIBLE sources for learning as possible.
(This post was edited by jjones16 on May 21, 2011, 3:36 AM)
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