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JoeHamilton
Aug 7, 2011, 3:21 AM
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HI, My daughter used to love going to the gym, and out to the crags with me. We had an outdoor home wall for a little bit and she loved it. We have had like a 4 year break from climbing, she bugged and bugged me to bring her climbing again. Her mom found my old shoes and harness, And I have been bringing the little one with me. I am hooked all over again, the little one on the other hand, seems to be haveing fear or strenth or pre teen lazyness issues. HELP HELP HELP . I am not sure what a dad is to do here. Any suggestions, as to how to encourge her.
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gblauer
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Aug 7, 2011, 2:17 PM
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How old is she?
My kids were very involved at our local gym. They loved being on the team and climbing with other kids their own age. I am sure your daughter loves you, but, during those pre teen/teen years kids are trying to separate themselves from you. Encourage her to make a climbing friend then take both of them out.
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lena_chita
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Aug 7, 2011, 3:20 PM
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I agree with Gail, having peer group of other climbing kids makes a huge difference for pre-teens/teens.
If she used to climb when she was 6-8yo, and now she is 10-12yo, and started puberty/prepuberty, it is likely that the ease of climbing she remembers from years back, when she was carrying a total of 40 lb while scampering up the wall, is no longer there. It would be all too natural to get discouraged if something she remembers as being easy and fun before is now more difficult.
Having a climbing team, with other girls her age, and a qualified coach, might be what she needs. Or, at the very least, finding another family or two with kids the same age would help to keep her motivated.
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JoeHamilton
Aug 7, 2011, 3:53 PM
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Thanx, she is 12,
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wonderwoman
Aug 8, 2011, 8:04 PM
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Have you tried asking climbing dads, too? Also, this is around the age that our daughter showed a total lack of interest in climbing. You can't force interest, unfortunately. But maybe you can couple a short day of climbing with some outdoor activity that she enjoys. For instance, spend the morning top roping, then go swimming, biking or hiking with her. But don't be disappointed if she just isn't interested. Celebrate her interests, too.
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JoeHamilton
Aug 9, 2011, 1:25 PM
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Thanx, I asked the moms for a more sensitive approach. She kept bugging me to get back into it. After talking, she addimitted fear has crept in.
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wonderwoman
Aug 9, 2011, 1:44 PM
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Again - I think men are equally qualified to give you a sensitive approach.
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clee03m
Aug 9, 2011, 3:36 PM
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I fail to see why you have to get her to climb if she is not interested or scared or whatever. Unless she is asking you to help her.
I also fail to see why this is a question for moms, but whatever.
I guess I post in Ladie's Room sometimes to just avoid all the BS from a less moderated forum.
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JoeHamilton
Aug 9, 2011, 3:47 PM
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clee03m wrote: I fail to see why you have to get her to climb if she is not interested or scared or whatever. Unless she is asking you to help her. I also fail to see why this is a question for moms, but whatever. I guess I post in Ladie's Room sometimes to just avoid all the BS from a less moderated forum.
I get the impression you failed to read. Thank you all for some advice. Dads might give some good advice as well, if I had a son.
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lena_chita
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Aug 9, 2011, 5:09 PM
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clee03m wrote: I fail to see why you have to get her to climb if she is not interested or scared or whatever. Unless she is asking you to help her.
I don't know if this is applicable to the OP's situation, but kids are not always straightforward little buggers.
A 12 yo would rarely, if ever, come up to you and say:"Mom, I really want to enjoy climbing again, but I seem to be afraid of heights for some reason. Can you help me come up with some practice drills to overcome it?"
LOL, if only! No, what you are likely to hear is:"I HATE IT! It is STUPID!" And then you have to decode the meaning of it, and there could be layers upon layers of stuff behind it...
Sometimes when they say that they don't want to do something what they actually mean is they don't want to do it because they don't like failing, not because they don't want to actually do it. The fact that the girl really wanted to go back to the gym, and now, after getting a taste of it, she doesn't seem to be into it, COULD easily be just because this is the activity that she remembers being easy and fun, and now it is hard and scary. Of course, it could be legitimately true that she is not into climbing anymore, just doesn't care for it, end of story.
So what's the parent to do? Give up the first time she says she doesn't want to climb? Encourage her to try for a set period of time and then if she still doesn't want to do it, then quit?
What if you, as a parent who knows your child, really KNOW that the child will enjoy the activity once they get past a certain hurdle, that it is the fear of failure, or just plain fear of water/heights/speed, or lack of desire to work hard that is stopping the child? Just give up because he/she said that they don't want to do it?
It is very hard to find the right balance, and I can say that, as a parent, I have gone both too far, and not far enough at various things like that. Things are more clear in retrospect, but not always when you are in the thick of it. So much depends on the child, the parent, the situation and the motives...
An example: I have a boy who is not athletic at all, and a girl who is pretty good at anything that involves moving her body through space. The girl learned to dive last year, from a low diving board. The boy couldn't do it, and declared that he just doesn't like it, and cannonball is way more fun, anyway.
O.K., fine, Forcing your child to dive doesn't seem to be listed as a requirement in parening manuals. I didn't say a single word about it.
Fast forward a year. A girl and her cousin are now diving from the diving board in all sorts of configurations -- back flips, front flips, handstands, you name it. I catch the boy looking longingly at the board. All the kids his age seem to be there, and his sister is getting a lot of admiring comments because she happens to be the best at it.
Mind you, he still says that diving is stupid and he doesn't want anything to do with it... but I *KNOW* that he really wants to be able to do it. So I grab the opportunity when it comes my way: the boy asks for ice cream after the pool. I tell him that I would treat everyone to ice cream if he tries diving.
He walks over to the board. The first 10 attempts go really badly. Some people laugh, though thankfully he doesn't hear it. The second 20 attempts go just as badly... he is in tears. I tell him that he doesn't have to do it if he hates it, but my ice cream offer stands.
His sister and cousin have heard about the ice cream promise-- and they are fullheartedly behind it. They encourage him. He accepts their advice, though he wouldn't have accepted mine. I sit back and watch. He finally manages to go into the water head first, sort-of. I tell him that he is well on his way towards ice cream and I see definite progress, but that isn't really a dive yet. Twenty more attempts produce a passable dive. I tell him that the ice cream has been earned. Cheers all around.
Of course, he doesn't stop diving after that. He keeps going, even though nothing further would be gained from it. Diving isn't stupid anymore... Because, you see, he really WANTED to learn to dive -- but in his case the difficulty of learning a complex move was enough of a hurdle for him to declare that he DIDN'T want to do it.
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JoeHamilton
Aug 9, 2011, 5:26 PM
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Thank you Lena, makes a world of sense.
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clee03m
Aug 9, 2011, 9:35 PM
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JoeHamilton wrote: I get the impression you failed to read. Thank you all for some advice. Dads might give some good advice as well, if I had a son.
So dads can give advise for sons and moms give advise for daughters? I guess single parents with kids of opposite sex are shit out of luck? Sorry your logic (or lack of it) still fails me.
Lena, I guess there is some difference is style of parenting here. My parents were really never pushy about interests. That would explain why my brother tried every instrument imaginable and never stuck with any of them. They were always supportive of his interest, and when he would exclaim this or that is stupid, they would back off and let him decide. They always made it clear with me as well that if I decide to quit whatever (piano, soccer, etc.), they would support my choice. This helped me not to complain or threaten to quit since I knew they would take that seriously and support me in my decision. I guess because this is how I was brought up, I think this is a good way to raise children. I think your point about diving actually demonstrate this. You kept you mouth shut and let the boy have the space to decide this is something he wants to pursue. You are right that every child is different, and I may have to change what I say now.
But I guess I can't really imagine pushing a child into climbing because I do think that there are inherent dangers involved. But like I said, whatever.
I still maintain making this mom specific is gender biased. *shrug*
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JoeHamilton
Aug 10, 2011, 3:27 AM
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cleeo3m, please , let me explain. First, she , my daughter got me back on rock, and is having some trouble, FEAR is the bigy upon talking with my daughter not talking at her. I have explained that if its just not for her, she doesn't have to pursue it. She stills enjoys the time outside together. I was raised with a single mom, and was aloud to go from interest to interest as well, I would get as good as I good and then find something new.
With a son I could take what I learned from many DADS in my life and push him or just let it go. My intention was not to be sexist, but to ask other MOMS for some suggestions on this issue about a PRE TEEN GIRL. WHY? since you are having trouble understanding WHY, her mom is actually not as sensitive or patient as I am has left her locked off instead of letting her come down from a top rope route. I guess from my upbringing it stands to reason when a girl starts to mature into a young woman, its best to sometimes ask other woman. Also if you look at some of my other post I have been talking about my daughter as well, not just in here. If my asking a question about a girl , to woman offends you or causes you to think ill of me, or you are thinking my intentions are more then what they are. I can understand that , yet you might want to look at that yourself.
Thank you all again, the sign say all can post, and I do apologize if anyone felt I was intrudeing
(This post was edited by JoeHamilton on Aug 10, 2011, 3:54 AM)
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macherry
Aug 10, 2011, 4:46 AM
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No you have very right to ask your question in here. You got some good feedback
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clee03m
Aug 11, 2011, 4:08 PM
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No, I didn't fee you were intruding. You have the right to ask whatever you want. Like I have the right to feel that the question doesn't apply specifically to moms. And feel like pushing a child into climbing is wrong. We can agree to disagree.
Personally, I would be relieved if my future teenage son declared climbing is stupid. I see too many people die or get seriously hurt climbing.
Sorry if I came off too annoyed. I really hate gender stereotyping...
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ClimbClimb
Aug 11, 2011, 5:56 PM
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clee03m wrote: Lena, I guess there is some difference is style of parenting here. My parents were really never pushy about interests. That would explain why my brother tried every instrument imaginable and never stuck with any of them.
Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior
http://online.wsj.com/...059713528698754.html
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JoeHamilton
Aug 11, 2011, 6:26 PM
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That was a very intresting read. Very on point too.
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KestrelLowing
Aug 11, 2011, 6:32 PM
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ClimbClimb wrote: clee03m wrote: Lena, I guess there is some difference is style of parenting here. My parents were really never pushy about interests. That would explain why my brother tried every instrument imaginable and never stuck with any of them. Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior http://online.wsj.com/...059713528698754.html
As far as I've seen, that only works for one generation. The kids end up resenting their parents so much they vow that they will never treat their children than way - especially when they see alternatives that make people happier.
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clee03m
Aug 11, 2011, 11:08 PM
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ClimbClimb wrote: clee03m wrote: Lena, I guess there is some difference is style of parenting here. My parents were really never pushy about interests. That would explain why my brother tried every instrument imaginable and never stuck with any of them. Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior http://online.wsj.com/...059713528698754.html
My parents are first generation Korean immigrants.
Gender stereotype to racial/cultural stereotype. Yay. *sigh*
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JoeHamilton
Aug 12, 2011, 3:49 AM
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I do have to thank you all again. Putting it out to the dads is actually getting a great response.
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Toast_in_the_Machine
Aug 12, 2011, 11:49 AM
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JoeHamilton wrote: That was a very intresting read. Very on point too.
The book is crap: http://www.newyorker.com/...bert?currentPage=all
I could go on and explain why even the numbers behind the fear behind the book are crap, but that is a soap box topic. The topic here (and in general) is "how do I motivate my kid to do something I want them to do and they don't want to do".
The answer is, as has been pointed out in both threads: You can't. It is the parent/child relationship parallel to "how do I get someone to love me?"
As a parent you have certain things working in your favor: You are more socially sophisticated than they are and you have a better ability to see consequences of actions. The child has one thing working in their favor: They don't have other issues to worry about.
The real question is: what is the minimum that I expect my child to be as an adult. Focus on that (i.e. I expect my child to be very well read and very physically fit) and let everything else go (i.e. I don't know much about the history of baseball).
If you expect that your daughter as an adult can see and overcome her fears, then great. At 12 it is late, but not too late (heck even 40 isn't too late) to learn this life lesson. If the fear is fear of looking stupid or falling or whatever, she needs to be the one to see the fear and want to eliminate the fear.
So use your more socially sophisticated toolset: talk with her about her fears (climbing and otherwise) talk about the good part that fears have (http://www.amazon.com/...Becker/dp/0440226198 - I highly recommend this book) and the bad parts. Use your more improved social sophistication to persuade her to want to remove the fear. It might not happen the first time you talk about it, but use your other skill (understanding consequences) to see other examples where she can beneifit from overcoming her fears.
You can't make someone love something or someone. To think you can is, at best, a folly.
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