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Yondergrass


Feb 16, 2012, 2:18 AM
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Anthropology student doing project on climbing
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Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the culture rock climbing has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other subcultures/countercultures I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.


donwanadi


Feb 16, 2012, 2:29 AM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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What!? No survey you want everyone to take? That would be original....

Welcome to the forum. Posting in one section will generally suffice.


wonderwoman


Feb 16, 2012, 2:52 AM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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Welcome! And please only post 1 post per topic. Your other 2 were recycled.


JAB


Feb 16, 2012, 2:16 PM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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Yondergrass wrote:
Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the culture rock climbing has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other subcultures/countercultures I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.

Subculture? Rock climbing is going full steam towards mainstream, when even regular newspapers write about offwidth climbing! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/...h-national-park.html


(This post was edited by JAB on Feb 16, 2012, 2:16 PM)


Partner camhead


Feb 16, 2012, 3:01 PM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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Hey, for a more accurate view of climbers' culture, I shudder at you trying to use this website as data. As far as climbing websites go, rockclimbing.com has the most beginners, the worst management, and in my opinion is the least representative of any sort of culture, other than general anonymous internet board culture.

For a general feel of climbing culture, http://mountainproject.com is a way better place to hang out. For southern climbing, check out http://redriverclimbing.com. For anachronistic has-beens/never-weres in reliving their glory days in California, check out http://supertopo.com.


USnavy


Feb 16, 2012, 3:33 PM
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Re: [camhead] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
Hey, for a more accurate view of climbers' culture, I shudder at you trying to use this website as data. .
I agree, and anyway, no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.


(This post was edited by USnavy on Feb 16, 2012, 3:35 PM)


Partner camhead


Feb 16, 2012, 3:43 PM
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Re: [USnavy] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.


marc801


Feb 16, 2012, 3:48 PM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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Yondergrass wrote:
Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the culture rock climbing has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other subcultures/countercultures I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.
For a historical background perspective, please read Ken Wilson's "The Games Climbers Play"
[ http://www.amazon.com/...Wilson/dp/0897321987 ]

You'll find that what you're calling a sub/counterculture is hardly new and that in the past two decades, climbing has decidedly moved away from a subculture to something much more mainstream.

Also, since this is your first experience in online fora (seriously? and you're older than 13?), you should also read some of the work done by Jenny Preece of the University of Maryland. Start with:
http://jcmc.indiana.edu/...0/issue4/preece.html and its included references.
Preece's book on the subject: http://www.amazon.com/...bility/dp/0471805998

If you don't have a good understanding of online communities as a basis, you risk attributing observations and behaviors to climbing which are actually indicative of online community discussions and have nothing to do with climbing.

Also, when doing ethnographic studies, it's usually a good idea to be a bit lower key and a little more invisible. A grand announcement of who you are and what you're doing may not have been the best opening move. Actually, you've already biased your observations. I suggest discussing your approach with your professor.


USnavy


Feb 16, 2012, 4:10 PM
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Re: [camhead] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.
The school I attend has a mandatory requirement of at least one research paper per week for all classes in the 1xx - 6xx levels so I get to have all kinds of fun writing countless papers and looking up references. Okay, so maybe they allow it in anthropology, I am an IT major, so that's not my field. But in my major, I am only authorized to use known accurate sources as a primary reference. Some professors only authorize peer reviewed sources. I can list a forum on an annotated bib, but not an APA or MLA formatted reference page and I could never use in-text citations for paraphrased or direct quote material from a forum. The only exception would be if the topic I am writing is so completely esoteric that rc.knob was the only place I could possibly get the info from, then it may be authorized, but I suspect the professor would just tell me to choose a different topic. I wish I could use forums and Wikipedia and other crap .com sites in my references, it would cut my research time by 500%...


(This post was edited by USnavy on Feb 16, 2012, 4:20 PM)


Partner j_ung


Feb 16, 2012, 6:46 PM
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Re: [USnavy] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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USnavy wrote:
camhead wrote:
Hey, for a more accurate view of climbers' culture, I shudder at you trying to use this website as data. .
I agree, and anyway, no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous.

Unless you're specifically researching Internet climbing communities.

OP, I don't think you're going to get an accurate feel for the climbing culture on any website. The best you're going to get is a sense of the lingo... and the impression that we're all a bunch of assholes.


(This post was edited by j_ung on Feb 16, 2012, 6:47 PM)


walkonyourhands


Feb 16, 2012, 6:58 PM
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Re: [USnavy] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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USnavy wrote:
camhead wrote:
USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.
The school I attend has a mandatory requirement of at least one research paper per week for all classes in the 1xx - 6xx levels so I get to have all kinds of fun writing countless papers and looking up references. Okay, so maybe they allow it in anthropology, I am an IT major, so that's not my field. But in my major, I am only authorized to use known accurate sources as a primary reference. Some professors only authorize peer reviewed sources. I can list a forum on an annotated bib, but not an APA or MLA formatted reference page and I could never use in-text citations for paraphrased or direct quote material from a forum. The only exception would be if the topic I am writing is so completely esoteric that rc.knob was the only place I could possibly get the info from, then it may be authorized, but I suspect the professor would just tell me to choose a different topic. I wish I could use forums and Wikipedia and other crap .com sites in my references, it would cut my research time by 500%...

Dude, he's using the forums as a primary SOURCE. He wants to study YOU! And me too, that is.


carabiner96


Feb 17, 2012, 1:07 AM
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Re: [camhead] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.
Fixt.


shockabuku


Feb 17, 2012, 7:45 AM
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USnavy wrote:
The school I attend has a mandatory requirement of at least one research paper per week

What constitutes a "research paper" at your school?


Partner j_ung


Feb 17, 2012, 11:21 AM
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Re: [camhead] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.

Well, you certainly know more about it than I do, but I'm still skeptical. What sort of information do anthropologists glean from forums?


Partner j_ung


Feb 17, 2012, 11:29 AM
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Re: [Yondergrass] Anthropology student doing project on climbing [In reply to]
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Yondergrass wrote:
Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the culture rock climbing has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other subcultures/countercultures I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.

Wait. What? Yondergrass, my friend, the rabbit hole is considerably deeper than that. Laugh


Toast_in_the_Machine


Feb 17, 2012, 2:38 PM
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j_ung wrote:
and the impression that we're all a bunch of assholes.

STFU. You needed to tell the OP to STFU.


bill413


Feb 17, 2012, 5:39 PM
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j_ung wrote:
OP, I don't think you're going to get an accurate feel for the climbing culture on any website. The best you're going to get is a sense of the lingo... and the impression that we're all a bunch of assholes.

Don't the two underlined portions contradict?


Partner j_ung


Feb 17, 2012, 5:40 PM
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bill413 wrote:
j_ung wrote:
OP, I don't think you're going to get an accurate feel for the climbing culture on any website. The best you're going to get is a sense of the lingo... and the impression that we're all a bunch of assholes.

Don't the two underlined portions contradict?

Laugh


styndall


Feb 17, 2012, 8:45 PM
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j_ung wrote:
camhead wrote:
USnavy wrote:
...no reputable college would ever allow someone to use a forum as a reference for a research paper, that's ludicrous. Most colleges don't even want you to use the Internet for a research paper unless your reference comes from a .mil, .gov, or .edu site or something like Google Scholar or a digital library. Most colleges want their students to use peer reviewed published documents and books in research papers.

Uhh... you don't know what you're talking about in terms of primary or secondary sources. For anthropological research on cultures and subcultures, message boards can be an excellent primary source.

Well, you certainly know more about it than I do, but I'm still skeptical. What sort of information do anthropologists glean from forums?

Anthropologists study the ways people behave in specific situations, and forums are definitely specific situations. There are lots of good ethnographic works out there on online communities of various kinds. My favorite is Boellerstorff's Coming of Age in Second Life, which you can read a little about here:

http://press.princeton.edu/titles/8647.html


matterunomama


Feb 18, 2012, 9:47 PM
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Yondergrass wrote:
Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the culture rock climbing has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other subcultures/countercultures I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.
Here is all your research:

Rock Climbing Subworlds: A Segmentation Study

http://repository.tamu.edu/...lje-2.pdf?sequence=1
You're welcome.


Rmsyll2


Feb 25, 2012, 4:19 PM
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'matter' offered: http://repository.tamu.edu/... and anticipated "You're welcome."

Thank you indeed. Tiresome wading through, but interesting for specific comments made and suppositions confirmed. IMO simple exercise was under-represented; and non-college-based participation was more countered with a limited control group than balanced. I was surprised by the income level, and had doubted the level of education. The founding notion that land managers/planners would use such studies seems ridiculous to me, based in a state park.

.


irregularpanda


Feb 25, 2012, 7:31 PM
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Yondergrass wrote:
Hey guys. I am an Anthropology student at UNT conducting research on the rock climbing culture. I am planning on observing and participating in the general, bouldering, and US-South forums for the next 2 weeks or so. I've been climbing for about 3 years now and really feel like the group of anti-social fuck ups has developed over the past two decades or so stands out from all other monkeys that like to hump doorknobs I have encoutered. This is my first exdperience in online forums and am psyched to get this going.

I fixed that for you.


Toast_in_the_Machine


Feb 25, 2012, 9:23 PM
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Rmsyll2 wrote:
'matter' offered: http://repository.tamu.edu/... and anticipated "You're welcome."

Thank you indeed. Tiresome wading through, but interesting for specific comments made and suppositions confirmed. IMO simple exercise was under-represented; and non-college-based participation was more countered with a limited control group than balanced. I was surprised by the income level, and had doubted the level of education. The founding notion that land managers/planners would use such studies seems ridiculous to me, based in a state park.

.

I personally found that link not so helpful.


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