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damon99
May 17, 2005, 6:19 PM
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i have 2 of 5 feet webbings, and 4 biners.. there are two bolts on the top of sport route. the bolts are located unevenly (not on the same level). how can I self-equalize 5 feet of webbing,to top rope, or should I just buy longer webbing, and how long? its a pain in the ass trying to tie each webbing numerous times so the weight is even on each bolt..
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caughtinside
May 17, 2005, 6:28 PM
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The good old sliding X.
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vegastradguy
May 17, 2005, 6:32 PM
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i'm assuming that the webbing is in a loop form.
http://www.petzl.com/...s/Conseil_35_2_4.gif
pretty much do this, except with two bolts. the knot can be overhand or a fig-8, whichever is easiest to tie.
if the webbing is not long enough, then you get to go buy more webbing or accessory cord (7mm perlon or 5mm spectra is standard)
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caughtinside
May 17, 2005, 6:36 PM
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In reply to: i'm assuming that the webbing is in a loop form. http://www.petzl.com/...s/Conseil_35_2_4.gif pretty much do this, except with two bolts. the knot can be overhand or a fig-8, whichever is easiest to tie. if the webbing is not long enough, then you get to go buy more webbing or accessory cord (7mm perlon or 5mm spectra is standard)
Good point. But, with the sliding X you don't need to buy anything.
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damon99
May 17, 2005, 6:37 PM
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donka! the topic is closed :D
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tragic_photography
May 17, 2005, 6:39 PM
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Hey there. This link should help you out a lot. I highly recommend getting a cordalette to make it super easy though. Basic Anchor Principles Also, buy locking biners, LOTS of locking biners. You can never have enough. And buy more webbing, just for top roping I usually take along 50 feet just in case you need to backup to something far away such as a tree. Hope this helps you out! Farewell, God bless! ~Tragic
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crotch
May 17, 2005, 6:40 PM
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There are many ways to accomplish your goal of equalizing uneven bolts with 2 equal length slings. Here's one way:
For the lower bolt, attach the rope-end and bolt-end biners to the webbing with clove hitches and adjust the clove hitches so that the rope-end biner is even with the one from the upper bolt.
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vegastradguy
May 17, 2005, 7:19 PM
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In reply to: Good point. But, with the sliding X you don't need to buy anything.
you dont have to buy anything with the way i've suggested, either. it works just as well with webbing.
a sliding X, though, is usually a less than ideal choice for an anchoring method.
also, you do not need to use lockers at the bolts, just at the powerpoint. unless you'd feel more comfortable using lockers at the bolts, but they are not necessary.
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tragic_photography
May 17, 2005, 9:01 PM
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[quote="vegastradguyalso, you do not need to use lockers at the bolts, just at the powerpoint. unless you'd feel more comfortable using lockers at the bolts, but they are not necessary.
You do not need to, but just think if your belayer isn't paying much attention and you have a foot of slack out and you fall. The webbing can possibly slice through.
Or, if you're not hangdogging and have you belayer do what I like to have them do, leave out about 6-10 inches of slack so it's an actual climb with no possible aid. Then if you fall on that webbing, it's more likely to slice through =\. Just my opinion, I personally only had it happen once but that was enough. Farewell, God bless. ~Tragic
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j_ung
May 17, 2005, 9:23 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: also, you do not need to use lockers at the bolts, just at the powerpoint. unless you'd feel more comfortable using lockers at the bolts, but they are not necessary. You do not need to, but just think if your belayer isn't paying much attention and you have a foot of slack out and you fall. The webbing can possibly slice through. Or, if you're not hangdogging and have you belayer do what I like to have them do, leave out about 1-2 feet of slack so it's an actualy climb with no possible aid. Then if you fall on that webbing, it's more likely to slice through =\. Just my opinion, I personally only had it happen once but that was enough. Farewell, God bless. ~Tragic
Do what!? Seriously, I don't understand this exchange. It sounds like you broke webbing because your belayer had 2 feet of slack in the system, correct?
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tragic_photography
May 17, 2005, 9:38 PM
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Hey j_ung. I'm sorry about that. I didn't mean feet lol. I was replying to several posts at one time and was confused. I normally like about 6-8 inches of slack though. It gives me that little bit of slide room (If I do start to slide.) so I can still stay on the rock without weighting the rope. That way I don't get ragged on for "aiding" as my buddies call it haha. Oh well, I made a mistake =). Farewell, God Bless. ~Tragic
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andrewph
May 17, 2005, 9:53 PM
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Whats a sliding X? I must say its a new one on me!
Cheers Andy
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andrewph
May 17, 2005, 10:50 PM
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Ah thanks. I knew the technique,
but I had never heard that term before.
Andy
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cosmiccragsman
May 17, 2005, 10:58 PM
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Vegastrads way is ok however it's more of a static equilization. good for topropes or on hanging belay. The way tragics' is set up, it is more of a dynamic equilization. It is the best IMO because it self equalizes.
cosmiccragsman
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vegastradguy
May 17, 2005, 11:27 PM
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in regards to my note about not needing lockers- you can use non-lockers instead. i didnt mean thread the webbing through the hanger, which i'm guessing is how you interpreted that- which would of course be not so good. lockers on each piece of protection is overkill when it comes to anchors and simply not necessary.
the real problem with self-equalizing anchors is the potential for shockload. should one point fail, the other point will be shockloaded when the powerpoint slides down the sling and hits the end.
static equalization, although less than ideal, is a good compromise in an anchor situation.
also, when sport climbing, the best and easiest way to set up and anchor is a pair of quickdraws- assuming you have draws in the correct lengths so that the rope weights both bolts more or less equally.
also, it should be noted that the OP is asking about setting an anchor at the top of a sport route, presumably for toproping...
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slacklinejoe
May 18, 2005, 12:25 AM
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Uh, guys, if the guy is just learning to set top ropes, you really think it's a good deal to teach him or her to forgo redundancy? On a sliding X if the sling blows your toast unless you use 2 of them or tie knots to limit extension (which suprisingly no one mentioned specifically).
I was always taught that the sliding X is more of use on marginal placements where equalization is more important than shockloading, and that if your on bolts, shockloading is more important to avoid.
To the orginal poster:
Get a good book, Freedom of the Hills, How to Rock Climb, or better yet take a class or get a mentor on rigging. It'll help out a lot more than internet advice.
Second, you can rig what you need using what you have, but it's kind of a pain if the bolts are very far apart, there are much better tools out there, but your webbing is a bit too short to make a cordolette or webolette out of unless it's fairly close so you can minimize the angle. If they are close, rig it like a sliding X and tie a knot to reduce extension as shown at:
http://www.chockstone.org/TechTips/Equalise.htm
I'd recommend a cordolette or webolette, I think Gear Express still has a cordolette special for 6.95 going on and that'd be well worth the investment for you.
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caughtinside
May 18, 2005, 12:35 AM
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In reply to: Uh, guys, if the guy is just learning to set top ropes, you really think it's a good deal to teach him or her to forgo redundancy? On a sliding X if the sling blows your toast unless you use 2 of them or tie knots to limit extension (which suprisingly no one mentioned specifically).
I don't find it necessary to anticipate all future questions/shortcomings/problems when I reply to a post. Not everyone needs constant supervision. If you can't figure a few things out on your own, well, you've got problems.
he asked how to anchor off two bolts that aren't next to each other. The sliding X is one way. Cordellete is another. Simple.
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cosmiccragsman
May 18, 2005, 2:32 AM
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Good answer caughtinside
I use both systems depending on situation. and a few others as well.
On any of my anchor systems I always have a backup as well.
cosmiccragsman
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