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climbnkate
Jun 28, 2005, 2:41 PM
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I just started indoor climbing about a week and a half ago; been 3 times already and love it. Really want to get into it (get a membership and my own gear etc) but I have so many questions.
In terms of shoes, I heard that La Sportiva makes really good ones, but I see that they have different fits. It seems like the performance fit would really curl up my toes, which I wouldn't like. The tech and the comfort fit both seem fine; is one fit better than the other? Any recommendations?
For Harnesses, I want something that is padded and comfortable. I like the Petzl Charlet Aquila but then again I really don't know what to look for. Honestly I like it because of the color :) . Any recommendations out there and what are things that I should look for in a Harness?
Last question I promise! I have used both an ATC (I think that is what its called...) and a super 8. Can anyone tell me what the pros and cons are to both of these? With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC?
Sorry this post is so long! I would really appreciate any feedback I could get! Thank You!
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brolloks
Jun 28, 2005, 2:50 PM
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Hallo Kate
Most important is safety and comfort. That means that for the shoes, you will probably want the comfortable fit - the pointy toes on the other shoes are speciality shoes for certain difficult climbs. Can't tell you more about your specific question, as I'm not familiar with all the shoes you're talking about.
Harness - anything safe (i.e. recognized brand that complies with safety standards) that's the right size and comfy. The price is not as important, so you can go with something cheaper. Go for the color you like, as long as the harness fits well.
For belaying I'd recommend the ATC above the figure 8 - ATCs feed easier and don't twist the rope on rappel like an 8. And the same rules apply to an ATC and figure 8 (and all other belay devices, for that matter) - NEVER let go with your brake hand, and be alert not to get anything caught/jammed in the device.
Be safe.
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kimmyt
Jun 28, 2005, 2:51 PM
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In reply to: The tech and the comfort fit both seem fine; is one fit better than the other? Any recommendations?
At this point I would go with comfort. Any pair of climbing shoes is going to be better than none. Get a pair that are tight without being uncomfortable. You won't necessarily need a very technical shoe this early on, and you can always use a pair of 'all day shoes' as I call them. My first pair of shoes were 5.10 Spires, and I still love them for all day trad.
In reply to: Any recommendations out there and what are things that I should look for in a Harness?
Again, look for comfort. For gym climbing you won't need alot of bells and whistles, and you really can't go wrong with a Petzl (although they are a bit more pricey than, say, a Black Diamond which will serve just as well). My first harness was a Petzl Corax, and I'm beginning to find that it doesn't meet my needs anymore. That doesn't mean it wasn't damn useful for the first 2 years, and I do really enjoy the padding on the leg loops and waist.
In reply to: With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC?
As you said, PAY ATTENTION. I've never once pinched myself on an ATC and hopefully never will, because when I'm belaying I'm focusing utterly on my task. An ATC relies purely on the skill and attention of the belayer. YOU are the only thing that is keeping your partner from splatting. Make sure you take that responsibility seriously and you'll be fine.
I've never used a Super 8, though I know some people like them for rapelling and for rescue work, etc. Honestly, an ATC is cheap and will get several jobs done for you with ease. Plus it will foster good belay habits in you, unlike many self-locking belay devices when used by new climbers.
Most of all, have fun climbing, be safe and GET OUTSIDE! :)
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bigjonnyc
Jun 28, 2005, 2:52 PM
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Shoes: Got to a shop and try on a whole bunch. Ask the people who work there what they reccomend.
Harness: Go to a shop and try some on. If you can, hang in one for 5-10 min. and see how comfortable it still feels.
Belay device: Do not use a Figure-of-Eight style device. Get an ATC. If you are a small person and will be belaying people much heavier than you, try something like the Black Diamond ATC-XP, or the Trango Jaws, as they provide much more friction than others.
Hope this helps, and welcome to the world of rock climbing. :wink:
-Jonny
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tisar
Jun 28, 2005, 2:54 PM
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In reply to: I just started indoor climbing about a week and a half ago; been 3 times already and love it. Really want to get into it (get a membership and my own gear etc) but I have so many questions.
Welcome to climbing! Most of your questions are already covered in hundreds of threads. Try the search function... Nonetheless... I try to be nice :D
In reply to: In terms of shoes, I heard that La Sportiva makes really good ones, but I see that they have different fits. It seems like the performance fit would really curl up my toes, which I wouldn't like. The tech and the comfort fit both seem fine; is one fit better than the other? Any recommendations?
La Sportive Miura/Katana are high end shoes. They curl up the toes to give you the best support on small ledges. I wouldn't recommend them for a total beginner as in moderate routes you'll be fine with less uncomfi shoes. Also the Miuras hinder you from "feeling" the rock by being that stiff.
I'd go (that's just my opinion!) for some more comfi shoes you later might use for longer routes. It's also no fault to go cheap on shoes in the beginning as you'll trash them quite fast...
If you're going for the hard stuff later you can still buy some Miuras or such.
In reply to: For Harnesses, I want something that is padded and comfortable. I like the Petzl Charlet Aquila but then again I really don't know what to look for. Honestly I like it because of the color :) . Any recommendations out there and what are things that I should look for in a Harness?
A harness should fit. Period. Petzl is a good brand but they're also quite expensive...
In reply to: Last question I promise! I have used both an ATC (I think that is what its called...) and a super 8. Can anyone tell me what the pros and cons are to both of these? With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC?
Not really. There's no substitute for being attentive... Still I'd go for the ATC over the Figure-of-Eight, as the provided friction is better and it has a better over-all handling .
In reply to: Sorry this post is so long! I would really appreciate any feedback I could get! Thank You!
You're welcome! And try the search functon...
- Daniel
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johnathon78
Jun 28, 2005, 2:57 PM
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Shoes : As far as shoes go, whatever feels best, wear it! You want them more snug than a street shoe but not so tight as to cut off circulation! Try other brands too, such as Mad Rock, Boreal, 5.10.
Harness : One that fits and is comfy. I doubt you'll be climbing big walls anytime soon, which means your not going to hang around in your harness all day! If the Petzl feels comfy and fits well, then buy it! Always helps to try 3 or 4 harnesses and pick out the best.
I prefer the ATC, which is what alot of people use now. I only use my super 8 for the occasional rappel. As far as your finger getting pinched in the ATC.......I have never pinched mine and my hands have been all over that thing on belays!
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tisar
Jun 28, 2005, 2:59 PM
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:shock: Five answers, no bullshit and everybody gives almost the same advice... rc.com is DOOMED!
- Daniel
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outdoorsie
Jun 28, 2005, 3:00 PM
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(Hooray for procrastinating work with internet posts!)
Um, let's start with the obligatory - "You can find all this info and much much more just by searching the threads in the Beginner's Forum!"
For shoes... I would try on as many as you can. Ignor the different "fits" and just find something that fits tight enough that you can stand on tiny little ledges and that does not cause you to cry every time you weight your feet. Because everybody's feet are shaped differently, (obviously) each shoe will fit and perform differently for different people. I know men who prefer the women's Mythos, and plenty of women who prefer the men's. Also, remember that the shoes will stretch quite a bit after you wear them, so a little on the ouch-snug side is ok.
When your a beginer, comfort is key in a harness. You really don't have weight to worry about, you won't be hauling gear on gear loops, and likely you won't be living in the thing for days on end. So, try on some harnesses, and hopefully where you're buying will have a rope that you can hang on for a while. Hang in a harness, and if it's not up around your armpits or cutting off circulation to vital body parts, it should be fine.
As for belay devises... Figure 8s are mostly used only for rappelling. I've belayed with them before, but I didn't feel it was as safe as an ATC. The best thing (and some would say worse thing) about an ATC is that it makes you pay attention as a belayer, because it doesn't do anything for you. You have to make sure you are attentive enough to keep long hair, hands and clothes out of the device and be ready to catch your climber at any moment. ATCs are cheep and great for a beginner that's been trained on how to use them. You might look at the ATC-XPs from Black Diamond, I've been using one for years and I love it. If you are looking for alternatives, lots of people use Petzl Gri-gri's too. These are heavier and very expensive, but they should automatically lock off if your climber weights the rope.
Have fun!
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outdoorsie
Jun 28, 2005, 3:04 PM
Post #9 of 23
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In reply to: :shock: Five answers, no s--- and everybody gives almost the same advice... rc.com is DOOMED! - Daniel
Yeah... I was bored and thought I'd be helpful. While I was screwing around writing my long answer, a ton of other people were doing the same thing!! I am shocked to see it too!
I think she may have hit the peak hours for people who would rather be doing anything but working...
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kubi
Jun 28, 2005, 3:12 PM
Post #10 of 23
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one thing nobody has mentioned: shoes wear out and belay devices are cheap, but harnesses last forever, I'd recomend getting something nice from the very beginning.
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climbnkate
Jun 28, 2005, 3:17 PM
Post #11 of 23
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Alright alright! Use the search feature! I get it! Geeze!
Just thought some people might be wanting something to do instead of work so I figured I could get some personal attention :). Won't happen again :)
I do have another question though, while i'm at it...
I do like the idea of having the added friction with the Trango Jaws, but has anyone used the Omega Pacific SBG?
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renohandjams
Jun 28, 2005, 4:06 PM
Post #12 of 23
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Registered: May 24, 2005
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In reply to: Last question I promise! I have used both an ATC (I think that is what its called...) and a super 8. Can anyone tell me what the pros and cons are to both of these? With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC?
ATC's are great because they are very smooth, I've never been woried about getting my hand caught, it's always 2-3 feet away on the right while I keep a hand on the left that feeds the rope.
In reply to: Options: If you are worried: 1. You can get an autolocker like the GriGri or the Trango Cinch, that way you almost don't have to pay attention becauset they auto lock, BUT you can still drop someone because the triggers are very sensitive when you are bring someone down. (also more expensive $70ish for Gri Gri, $50ish for cinch). 2. You can attach a runner from your harness to the ATC, that way the belay device floats chest level and that will give you more lock off control. Make sure your runner is bomber because that's the only thing keeping your friend from falling.
-Kenny
------------------------
TradRack.com SuperStore
Free Email Accounts, yourname@TradRack.com, only 100 to give
Click here to see if your name is available
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climbnkate
Jun 28, 2005, 7:55 PM
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Could you tell me what a runner and bomber mean? I'm new so i'm not familiar with terms :)
Thanks Kenny!
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aikibujin
Jun 28, 2005, 8:10 PM
Post #14 of 23
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In reply to: Options: If you are worried: 1. You can get an autolocker like the GriGri or the Trango Cinch, that way you almost don't have to pay attention becauset they auto lock, BUT you can still drop someone because the triggers are very sensitive when you are bring someone down. (also more expensive $70ish for Gri Gri, $50ish for cinch). 2. You can attach a runner from your harness to the ATC, that way the belay device floats chest level and that will give you more lock off control. Make sure your runner is bomber because that's the only thing keeping your friend from falling.
In my opinion, both of these are bad advice.
1. Autolocking belay device should not replace attentiveness from belayer.
2. Extending the belay device is useful on rappel, but it makes it more strenuous to take up slack fast. If you need more lock off control, use a high friction device such as ATC-XP or Trango Jaw.
By the way, if you live close to DC, there is a group of climbers in DC that take outdoor trip frequently. You should be able to find lots of people to climb with if you so inclined.
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musicman
Jun 28, 2005, 8:13 PM
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do you notice how some words are underlined? cool huh, just hover your mouse over words that are underlined/dashed/dotted/whatever is under it and a little thing will pop up and tell you a definition. check it out! trad alien passive!
bomber, basically solid enough that you'd park a school bus full of cute little orphans on it and not worry.
runner, in a nutshell, it's a long piece of webbing, decreases rope drag, extends something in this case.
also, definetly agree with the above poster, if you want more lock of strength get something with higher friction like an ATC-XP or Jaws
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mcgivney_nh
Jun 28, 2005, 8:18 PM
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as far as shoes and harness goes- choose based on comfort, fit and safety (as im sure you've already heard). for belaying, I would recommend an ATC XP from black diamond. It is my favorite device to use, I hope this helped.
happy climbing
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jt512
Jun 28, 2005, 8:28 PM
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In reply to: In terms of shoes, I heard that La Sportiva makes really good ones, but I see that they have different fits. It seems like the performance fit would really curl up my toes, which I wouldn't like. The tech and the comfort fit both seem fine; is one fit better than the other? Any recommendations?
The most important aspect of a climbing shoe is that it fits you well. Sportivas are narrow for their length. If your feet aren't, look for another brand. I'm not familiar with the La Sportiva's different "fits," but you really do want your toes to curl somewhat. We basically climb on our toes, and if the toes aren't curled, you cannot effectively use footholds. Experiment with different shoes that curl your toes until you find a pair that you can wear with minimal discomfort for 15 minutes. You should take your shoes off between routes anyway, in order to prolong the life of the shoe as well as to minimize discomfort.
In reply to: For Harnesses, I want something that is padded and comfortable. I like the Petzl Charlet Aquila but then again I really don't know what to look for.
Your first harness should: fit you well, be comfortble when you weight it, and have four gear loops and a belay loop. A nice feature of the Petzl harnesses is that you never unbuckle them; you just loosen the waist belt to take the harness off. Thus, you have the added safety and convenience of never having to double back the buckle. If you find a harness with non-adjustable leg loops that fits you well, then don't pay extra for the added weight and bulk of adjustable leg loops; otherwise, do.
In reply to: Last question I promise! I have used both an ATC (I think that is what its called...) and a super 8. Can anyone tell me what the pros and cons are to both of these?
Rappelling on a figure-8-style device will twist up your rope; a figure-8 is heavier than an ATC-style device; and has the unique characteristic of being able to break your belay/rappel carabiner if inadvertantly loaded improperly, which is usually fatal. Other than for specialized uses, the figure-8 is essentially an outdated piece of gear. Get an ATC-style device. The ATC-XP and B-52 seem to be popular these days.
In reply to: With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC?
No. You have to learn safe belay habits from the start.
Regarding auto-locking belay devices (Grigri, Cinch, etc.), save these for when you have more experience. Learn to belay with a simple device, like an ATC. So-called autolocking devices are, paradoxically enough, more difficult to operate safely, and are best used in the hands of an expert, which one day you will no doubt become.
-Jay
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jt512
Jun 28, 2005, 8:42 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In terms of shoes, I heard that La Sportiva makes really good ones, but I see that they have different fits. It seems like the performance fit would really curl up my toes, which I wouldn't like. The tech and the comfort fit both seem fine; is one fit better than the other? Any recommendations? The most important aspect of a climbing shoe is that it fits you well. Sportivas are narrow for their length. If your feet aren't, look for another brand. I'm not familiar with the La Sportiva's different "fits," but you really do want your toes to curl somewhat. We basically climb on our toes, and if the toes aren't curled, you cannot effectively use footholds. Experiment with different shoes that curl your toes until you find a pair that you can wear with minimal discomfort for 15 minutes. You should take your shoes off between routes anyway, in order to prolong the life of the shoe as well as to minimize discomfort. In reply to: For Harnesses, I want something that is padded and comfortable. I like the Petzl Charlet Aquila but then again I really don't know what to look for. Your first harness should: fit you well, be comfortble when you weight it, and have four gear loops and a belay loop. A nice feature of the Petzl harnesses is that you never unbuckle them; you just loosen the waist belt to take the harness off. Thus, you have the added safety and convenience of never having to double back the buckle. If you find a harness with non-adjustable leg loops that fits you well, then don't pay extra for the added weight and bulk of adjustable leg loops; otherwise, do. In reply to: Last question I promise! I have used both an ATC (I think that is what its called...) and a super 8. Can anyone tell me what the pros and cons are to both of these? Rappelling on a figure-8-style device will twist up your rope; a figure-8 is heavier than an ATC-style device; and has the unique characteristic of being able to break your belay/rappel carabiner if inadvertantly loaded improperly, which is usually fatal. Other than for specialized uses, the figure-8 is essentially an outdated piece of gear. Get an ATC-style device. The ATC-XP and B-52 seem to be popular these days. In reply to: With the ATC, the instructor told me to not let my hand get to close to it because it could be pinched. Is there any way to avoid that (other than paying attn. and being careful) with an ATC? No. You have to learn safe belay habits from the start. Regarding auto-locking belay devices (Grigri, Cinch, etc.), save these for when you have more experience. Learn to belay with a simple device, like an ATC. So-called autolocking devices are, paradoxically enough, more difficult to operate safely, and are best used in the hands of an expert, which one day you will no doubt become. -Jay |
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climbnkate
Jun 28, 2005, 8:54 PM
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Oh I hadn't noticed the "definition" feature, that is pretty cool!
Thanks for the advice!
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capcom1701
Jun 28, 2005, 9:03 PM
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If you want personal attention, post a pic of yourself in the "women of RC.com" thread
Glad to have been of service!
:wink:
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climbnkate
Jun 28, 2005, 9:15 PM
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Haha, duly noted, but I was mostly joking about the personal attention thing :)
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tweek
Jun 28, 2005, 9:35 PM
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In reply to: 2. You can attach a runner from your harness to the ATC, that way the belay device floats chest level and that will give you more lock off control. Make sure your runner is bomber because that's the only thing keeping your friend from falling.
I cannot imagine doing this. Poor advice and would just be a plain pain in the pants. Sure it would provide more lock off control but would also allow the belay device to slap you in the chest when you catch a good fall (ooowww!) not to mention feeding slack to a leader with the thing would be a real pain (Kate - you can ignore this last comment, it will make more sence in a few months/ years.)
The ATC has plenty of friction with it and I have never got my hand caught in it. The ATC-XP, as others have mentioned, is a great selection. I have not used the omega pacific but would personally choose the XP- it's just plain less high tech and simple. Simplicity is good.
I am glad that someone mentioned get a harness that you really like. It is a real pain if you buy one that is a mediocre and then you need to replace it in a year because you still enjoy climbing and it doesn't fulfill your needs anymore. But again comfort, comfort, comfort.
Happy climbing.
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tradrenn
Jun 29, 2005, 1:33 AM
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In reply to: do you notice how some words are underlined? cool huh, just hover your mouse over words that are underlined/dashed/dotted/whatever is under it and a little thing will pop up and tell you a definition. check it out! trad alien passive!
On the other hand did you notice what happends when you move your cursor to the hands and rope marks that are under your name.
Give it a try and enjoy.
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