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foxtrotuniform
Oct 24, 2005, 3:24 AM
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Check it out:
http://www.dewalt.com/us/products/tool_detail.asp?productID=8300
I'm lusting for one of these drills, mostly because the 18V battery provides added utility. (They make circular and reciprocating saws using the same batteries.) I've needed a cordless drill forever, and it's primary use would be typical around the home drill/driver applications.
However, I am curious how well it will perform drilling in rock. I know it's more designed for masonry, and a full on rotary hammer would be ideal for climbing/slacklining anchor placement in stone. Regardless, does anyone have any experience drilling rock with a cordless hammer drill like this?
What kind of drill time can I expect for...say... a 3/8th by 4 inch hole in hard sandstone?
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tnmountainman
Oct 24, 2005, 3:42 AM
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I have the drill that you mentioned. You would probably be dissapointed trying to drill into hard sandstone. The power is just not there and the batteries will not last for an intense drilling session.
If you are just going to use it for the common household drilling needs, (screws, drilling small holes, etc.) you will love it. It has 2 speed selector on the top of the drill, adjustable clutch settings right behind the chuck (this is for putting screws into something that is soft or brittle, the clutch will disengage the drill after the desired tension is reached.) the only problems that I have had: 1. The Recriprocating saw laid down on me! (This story is too long and detailed to post, lol) 2. After time the batteries began to lose their ability to hold a charge for very long (just had to buy a new batt. they are $80 a piece!!).
hope this helps :D
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philfell
Oct 24, 2005, 3:48 AM
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You'll probably go through a few drills before you get a 4 inch deep hole in rock with on of these drills.
I work construction and am not very impressed with the dewalt cordless tools. Thier batteries loose thier ability to hold a charge really fast. If your getting one to do around the house type of stuff save yourself two hundred dollars and get a 18v Ryobi. My Ryobi holds a better charge than my Dewalt, actually has more power at full chrage and is less than half the price. I burn up a Dewalt drill with about two weeks of use.
Back to your original question, these drills are NOT meant to drill a 3/8 bolt in solid rock. You need a roto-hammer, not a hammer drill. There is a big differance.
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salamanizer
Oct 24, 2005, 5:47 AM
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In reply to: You'll probably go through a few drills before you get a 4 inch deep hole in rock with on of these drills. I work construction and am not very impressed with the dewalt cordless tools. Thier batteries loose thier ability to hold a charge really fast. If your getting one to do around the house type of stuff save yourself two hundred dollars and get a 18v Ryobi. My Ryobi holds a better charge than my Dewalt, actually has more power at full chrage and is less than half the price. I burn up a Dewalt drill with about two weeks of use. Back to your original question, these drills are NOT meant to drill a 3/8 bolt in solid rock. You need a roto-hammer, not a hammer drill. There is a big differance.
AH hahahahah...a Ryobi is better than DeWalt, that is the beggest misguided load of BS I have ever heard. I work construction and know for a fact Ryobi's dont last a week with heavy use. I have had a DeWalt last 5 years, Ridged is crap and cuts out around 6mo, Makita lasts for ever and Millwakee is generally a good choice as well. 8 guys using different brands for the last 10 years cant be all wrong. As for drilling hard stone (desert sandstone or worse yet Granite) it wont get very far. If drilling soft limestone or sandstone, they do alright. Better have a few extra batterys on hand and not expect the drill to last for years though.
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woodse
Oct 24, 2005, 6:46 AM
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I own a DeWalt Heavy-Duty 7/8" (24mm) 18V Cordless SDS Rotary Hammer drill. Not the same as you are looking at but just for reference I get about 8-10 holes per battery in hard granite. Haven't drilled in sandstone with it though.
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wrbill
Oct 24, 2005, 8:30 AM
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I have a Ryobi hammer drill and have drilled about 50 plus bolts in basalt. I can get any were from four to eight bolts pre battery. The nice thing about the Ryobi is that they sell a one hour car charger, a plus in my book. I'm not saying that it is the best out there, but I think it is a good buy for using around the house and fair for placing bolts in rock. Just my two cents on the topic.
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tradmanclimbs
Oct 24, 2005, 1:47 PM
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I have the dewalt 18v hammer drill. It is great for normal construction use but no good for drilling hard stone. I drilled about 4 holes with it and it started to wear out t6he clutch. the SDS bits don't really fit perfectly in the drill so the bit can wobble a bit and that results in a sloppy hole. there is not enough hammer action for hard stone so the bits heat up and lose their temper. generaly it takes forever to drill a hole. I was drilling in shist and granit. I gave up on the power drill and started drilling by hand which was faster than the brand new worn out dewalt. I would love to have a real SDS rotary hammer.
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foxtrotuniform
Oct 24, 2005, 7:45 PM
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Hey, thanks for the good info everyone. Brand loyalty in the construction industry is as rampant as college football loyalty in the south...so I understand some of the conflicting opinions.
In responce to the above post: Yeah, I'd love to have a rotary hammer as well, but I just can't justify it. I'm not going to be equiping any routes anytime soon (living in Florida), and rotary hammers are no good as drills/drivers around the home (nevermind the exceptional prices).
It would be nice to be able to have the ability to place a couple anchors if the need arose, however, and I think that this drill will be able to do that. (although it may take some encouragement)
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philfell
Oct 25, 2005, 12:08 AM
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salamanizer, on the job I'm working on now, my $90 Ryobi, has outlasted my NEW Dewalt. I burnt up my Dewalt moter in two weeks.
I got the Ryobi at the start of last winter, becuase all my Dewalt batteries were shot. In the winter I work as a snowboard coach and use my drill to set race courses. I wanted to get new batteries for my Dewalt, but I decided to get the Ryobi instead to check it out (it was only $10 more than ONE Dewalt battery and came with two batteries a light and a charger.) Well after using it all winter it's still going strong. I can set more gates per battery with the Ryobi than with my Dewalt when it was new. As far as durability goes, the Ryobi has more plastic parts so I would deffinatly think it would be less durable and wouldn't hold up to a fall as well as a Dewalt, but for AROUND THE HOUSE work there is no way I'd spend the money on a Dewalt. Like I said I got a deal on one through the local sales rep., and the moter died in two weeks, replacement is on the way so we'll see. Oh yeah, my Ryobi was able to power a 4 inch hole saw through framing stock when my Dewalt couldn't.
I use cordless tools daily, we biscut joint and screw ALL our exterior trip (facia, window trim, belly bands, etc.) Dewalt cordless tools aren't all that great, Ryobi is by far the best either, but at the price they go for I consider them disposible (haven't had to do it yet, though.)
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jacobg
Oct 25, 2005, 2:08 AM
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back away from that drill! my dad has one and uses it daily at work (electrical) and has for about 3 years now but its a waist of money... the batteries are over priced! i tried to drill into a rock in my yard with it and ive had better luck with a hand drill....
buy something cheeper..
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grovehunter
Oct 25, 2005, 4:17 AM
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Philfell, ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND. DE WALT IS THE INDUSTRY STANDARD FOR CORDLESS DRILLS. I am a commercial and residential Glazier and I ought to know. My apprentice showed up with one and I made him sh*#can it. He came back the next day with a Milwaukee and I approved. He dropped my De Walt from a swing stage 23 stories up and all it did was break the battery. I've had the 1/2" metal chuck 18v De Walt hammer/drill for six years, and mine is still going strong. If you ever show up to a union/commercial job site with a Ryobi plan on a bad day. Personally I would send you home and tell you to come back when you can hang with the big boys!! Let's not mistake anything here, and this is for the record; RYOBI IS RAIN FOREST MADE GARBAGE - PERIOD. Anyone who works construction will agree if they are not cheap!
Now That I've regained my composure I'll answer the original question. The De Walt will drill through granite, but it will take you a while and a lot of money in drill bits. The proper tool for this is a Hilti combi-hammer. Hilti is the Cadillac of hammer drills. They are also expensive, (plan on spending about six bills+ for the 24v cordless) and worth every penny if you use it to make a living. Diamond coated bits work best in hard stone in my experience, and they don't come cheap. The advice you have received from most of the other posts is pretty accurate. The De Walt is a fine cordless hammer drill when used properly. I've used mine in a pinch to drill holes that required a rotary hammer, but this puts excessive wear on the clutch. The batteries are expensive as reported in an earlier post. I got lucky and had to buy new ones after six years when there was a great deal on them. Used properly and charged properly they will last and retain a charge a long time.
Do your home work before you spend the cash; you'll be glad you did! And do yourself a favor and walk right on past that Ryobi, They're a joke!!!
Peace,
GH
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philfell
Oct 25, 2005, 11:36 PM
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Grovehunter, I own both and use both on a daily basis. Look at what his intentions are for. Drilling hard rock is one, neither drill is going to cut it. The second reason for buying a drill is for simple around the house projects, the Ryobi will do just fine for this. Next time you need to replace one of your Dewalt batteries pick-up a Ryobi for the same price as you would pay for one battery and perform your own test.
Yes I don't work for a Union crew, I'm too busy working, instead of looking at what tools the cool guys use, and negotiating more break time with more pay.
Think what you want, like I said I use both on a daily basis.
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salamanizer
Oct 26, 2005, 12:46 AM
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In reply to: Yes I don't work for a Union crew, I'm too busy working, instead of looking at what tools the cool guys use, and negotiating more break time with more pay.
Who are you to make that statement? You are entitled to your opinion, but makeing baseless (personal) accusations to belittle someone shows flaws in your character. This is exactly the sort of trash this website could do without, along with useless comments. The better thing to do would be to apologize and agree to disagree. Who really cares enough to get in a pissing match over it?
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philfell
Oct 26, 2005, 1:09 AM
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You're accusing me of making personal accusations to belittle people. I have worked on Union jobs before and know about how things work locally.
You said I was giving "misguided BS", and grove said I was out of my mind. My statement wasn't a personal attack, meant more as a trade joke. Read grove's post he said if I show up on the job with a Ryobi he would send me home till I could keep up with the "big boys". Not even giving me a chance to judge me by my work, simply by the tool I was carrying. He actually did this to someone that works for him.
I can see how you could get upset by me belittling people.
Again I use both tools daily, for around the house use the Ryobi is fine, neither is worth a damn for drilling bolts in hard rock, save the two hundred dollars and buy three aliens and some carabines, or a nice rope.
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grovehunter
Oct 26, 2005, 1:35 AM
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Philfell, my apologies about the harsh reply. After giving thought to the matter today I realize that freedom of choice is what this country is all about. However, I know there is no comparison between the two screwguns. It is a fact, the De Walt is a better and more durable product. It is true that the price for Ryobi merchandise is favorable. The craftsmanship of the Ryobi pales in comparison to the De Walt; No question about it. And for the price and basic home improvement tasks the Ryobi will do the job. The Ryobi will wear out faster and that's what rattled my nerves. When you suggested that the Ryobi is comparable to the De Walt I nearly had a heart attack laughing. We put the two to a test today and my six year old Dewalt screwgun out shined another guys brand new Ryobi. You mentioned battery problems with De Walt screwguns. Is it possible that you are not charging them properly? Every twelve charges it should be refreshed with a full four hour charge. The Ryobi chargers don't have this feature. I refreshed mine Sunday. I used mine all day today and still haven't changed the battery. The Ryobi didn't fair so well today and used 2 1/2 charges doing the same work right next to my screwgun.
As far as work goes it's all A-holes & Elbows everyday around here and that's why we're paid the prevailing wage. I am a skilled craftsman and I won't accept less in exchange for a quality job! The same goes for my tools! As far as breaks are concerned, we don't waste time Bargaining for more pay, Rather we are just trying to keep what we have. We stand tall together against the guys who buy the Ryobis and work for peanuts and the employer's that support them. Let's not make any mistake this fact. Whether an employer is willing or unwilling to pay the wages of a union craftsman doesn't change the fact that he would certainly prefer our professional services over a a non union worker any day of the year!!
I'm gonna go spend some of that money I've been paid too much of on some new gear, and maybe, Buy myself a fine tool in reward for another day of busting my ass.....
Peace,
Gh
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grovehunter
Oct 26, 2005, 5:19 AM
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Right on Sandbagged, Way to give him hell! So Phillfell, do you still think we union guys just sit around taking breaks, negotiating higher wages and comparing cool tools all day long? Like the pipefitter said he'll work and climb circles around you. That was a cheap shot against guys who paid their dues thru the apprenticeship and pay their dues every month. Whoever gave you the misguided notion that Union tradesmen are lazy is probably paying what you're worth! And I might add, getting an inferior quality job. Like I said earlier; I busted my ass today and am proud of it and it sounds like the pipefitter feels the same as I do about it!
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tweeker
Oct 26, 2005, 7:28 AM
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Get the 24v De Walt- it will melt any stone! I have drilled hundreds upon hundreds of holes in quartzite and limestone, only get a drill like this if really are serious about developing. Best of luck :D
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philfell
Oct 26, 2005, 11:40 PM
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Enjoy my weekend and my eight hour day...... I wish. I'll be working most of this weekend just like I did the last two, because I have a time frame I must stick to, regardless of what the time clock says. I'm not anti-union, nothing has been sold to me by the GOP, keep you conspiracy theory's in check. I work on a high end siding crew, when you say the people I'm working for aren't getting quality work that simply couldn't be further from the truth. Trust me, we aren't the least expensive in the Park City area, but we always have more than enough work. It must be because of our lack of quality like you suggested.
A few years ago a Union outfitter was behind on a development at a high end golf course community just outside of Park City. We were brought on to side a few of their houses. It took us twice as long as is would have normally because of all the unnecessary hoops we had to do (put handrails on any scaffolding over 6 ft., had to wear steel toed boots when my shoes get way better traction when walking on the roof, etc.) When the big guys came around they weren't concerned in the least about quality, they just wanted to make sure we had our hardhats on and we were taking the proper amount of daily breaks.
As far as charging Dewalt batteries I do make sure I "refresh" them, and make sure that when they are charging they are sitting on concrete, the sales rep told me that putting them on concrete while charging them would wear them out longer. I don't know whether to believe him or not, but I still do what he says. If you don't mind me asking, where do you live? When I really have problems with Dewalt batteries is when it gets cold out, they loose their charge really fast regardless if you are even using the tool or not, and eventually won't recharge either. Maybe you live where is doesn't get that cold in the winter, so you haven't had the same problems I've had. Like I said when I coach in the winter I can set more gates per battery with my Ryobi than my Dewalt.
Funny I make, what I thought was, an innocent joke. No harm intended and you guys are so sensitive you attack my work ethic and climbing ethic without even knowing me. All the while complaining how I don't know anything about your job and how hard you truly work. Do you see the irony, or is it just me.
Sorry to take part in a thread jacking. You probably have enough info on drills know.
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foxtrotuniform
Oct 27, 2005, 10:46 PM
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No apologies necessary. This is an awesome argument!
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michaellane
Oct 27, 2005, 11:43 PM
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>>>
Yeah, I'd love to have a rotary hammer as well, but I just can't justify it
<<<
Keep your eyes on the pawn shops! I found an old Bosch Bulldog a while back for $140. The batteries were crap, but I was keen on modifying it with an external, supercharged battery pack anyhow. I spent less than fifty bucks on a pair of sealed lead batteries and a charger.
For less than two hundred bucks, I've got a great system that bores dozens of deep holes in hard rock on a single charge.
--ML
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ding5
Dec 1, 2005, 7:17 PM
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I found the Bosch 24V 7/8" SDS-plusŪ Cordless Rotary Hammer for $399 reconditioned or $513 new. Check these guys out:
http://bosch.cpotools.com/cordless/cordless_hammer_drills_and_rotary_hammers/11524.html/?ref=rkc01
http://bosch.cpotools.com/reconditioned/hammers_and_hammer_drills/rotary_and_combination_hammers/11524-rt.html/?ref=rkc01
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