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Fusion-3 or Vibram XSV ?
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shervo


Aug 2, 2002, 2:13 AM
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Fusion-3 or Vibram XSV ?
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Which´s better? And what about the time of life?


karlbaba


Aug 2, 2002, 2:24 AM
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In my opinion (I'm a granite climber) Stealth C4 absolutely kicks butt on both of them. I have a new pair of Aces with Fusion 3. THey are better than the old Fusion 2 but I still had them resoled before they were anywhere near needing it. For a cheap dirtbag like me, it means something when I spent $182 getting 6 pair of shoes resoled when 5 of them didn't need resoling!

Can't say about vibram, but steath rules

Peace

Karl


daisuke


Aug 2, 2002, 2:43 AM
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fusion 3 sucks major ass, I climbed in a pair of new stingers once and I hated them because my feet slipped off everything.

I have sportiva mythos with the vibram XSV and I must say that the rubber is very good, never tried climbing in 5.10s so I can't compare them with stealth rubber

but to answer your question? vibram all the way

D


pir8penguin


Aug 2, 2002, 2:49 AM
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vibram. used it on scarpas, tried it on tenayas. much better than fusion (rental aces, slick).

still no match for stealth, but it lasts longer.


igcuesta


Aug 2, 2002, 11:04 AM
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I use to climb sticky routes (granite slopy flat slabs). There, the only possibility for climbing hard routes is with a good sole: no hands, just your feet. In my opinion the best sole for this kind of routes in which you demands the best of a rubber is, for cold weather, C4Stealth, followed by Fusion3, and Vibram (I've tried the three of them). Of course the performance of a rubber depends a lot on the temperature. In very hot weather Vibram beats, from my experience, the others; C4 just melts. Anayway I know a guy climbing 5.13d on sticky routes, which is the hardest grade on this sort of routes, who says that ,in cold weather, Fusion3 is as good as C4.


cedk


Aug 2, 2002, 1:23 PM
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Am I the only guy who thinks the whole question is just marketing hype?

My question is which kind works best with the glue they use to resole? Which is least likely to delam?


daisuke


Aug 2, 2002, 2:01 PM
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I don't know how much hype there is in this whole topic, but I do know that rubber can make quite a difference at times.

A lot of how good a resole is comes with the skill of the resoler, I've seen great jobs of resoles done with fusion 3 (altho I can't imagine why anyone would want that crap on their shoes) but I've never been able to check out resole jobs done with stealth rubber. doubt the glue makes it all that different if the resoler is good

D


karlbaba


Aug 2, 2002, 2:21 PM
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A mag (Climbing?) did a study once on rubber friction and decided that they were pretty much all the same. I thought "Maybe rubber preference is a placebo!" Then some other wingwag published a study that said rock had friction coefficiect whether it was wet or dry!

That's when I stopped listening. I do a lot of slab climbing on Granite. I found that I was overgripping when climbing with Fusion Rubber since my shoes "skated" from time to time. (Boreal are good for us flat, wide footed folk) So everything got resoled with Stealth C$. (I have more shoes than Imelda Marcos too, the ones that didn't get resoled are for sale!)

I don't know about limestone, sandstone or ultra cold, but, after looking as objectively as possible Stealth C4 makes a noticable difference for me (two letter grades probably on friction routes)

Peace

Karl


tyraidbp


Aug 2, 2002, 2:56 PM
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My last post seemed to vanish so I will try again. In my short professional opinion as a resoler, I would much rather work with the Vibram XSV over Stealth C4. Personally I think that the Vibram is better for most climbers who are either just starting out and have kinda sloppy foot work or people who climb in the gym with texured walls more than outside. It tends to put up with way more abuse than the C4 does. The main thing you have to remember about all the different rubbers are that the prime temps for them to work their best are in the 40s. And from what I gather from most people is they are inside when the temps get down that low. One other thing as a side note. You will NOT be able to get Stealth HF(High Friction)for your shoes unless you buy a shoe with it already on there. As it would turn out, Stealth does not even keep any around the office out of fear that some one from the inside will steal it and either sell it off or put it on their own shoes. So no resoler will have it for quite some time if ever. I hope this helps some, and since my last post got lost in never never land, this one will be shorter. Take care all.


crackwhore


Aug 2, 2002, 3:45 PM
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there IS a difference in shoe rubber...

the same way there is a difference in tire rubber.

rubber manufacturers/recyclers use different compositions to make rubber harder(longer lasting) or softer (more grippy).

anyone who has owned Boreal should testify that Fusion rubber lasts longer, but since it is harder there may be a tendancy to skate on friction.

5.10 (c4) rubber is probably a bit softer and i have definitely noticed a shorter lifespan on my resoles, but nothing grips the edge of a steep sandstone finger crack like stealth.



deafclimber


Aug 2, 2002, 4:24 PM
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sealth works very well on everything. it is soft. i have old 5.10 "summit" shoes with sealth. it is very good. i have other shoes, boreal ace w/ fusion3. it is great on rock, but it is not great to hold me on walls in the gym. i havent tried on other rubbers...


shervo


Aug 4, 2002, 7:26 PM
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Please don´t talk about the stealth C4. I know this is the best.
But i need to compare only the vibram XSV with the fusion-3


twinrocks


Aug 5, 2002, 7:27 AM
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I absolutely adore my stingers I can stand on anything(normaly) but a couple of days ago I did an 8 pitch limestone route in 40 degrees celsius(at Arco) and my feet where slipping eeeerverywhere so I would say that fusion s-3 is not to good in the heat:( .

[ This Message was edited by: twinrocks on 2002-08-05 00:28 ]


aarong


Aug 5, 2002, 4:45 PM
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Vibram XSV is better, much stickier.
I've never had much success with the Fusion rubber.


shervo


Aug 6, 2002, 12:20 AM
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up!


leadingedge


Aug 6, 2002, 3:24 AM
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High Friction, is the best (well I think)
Its 20% stickier than C4.


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