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climbs2much
Sep 6, 2002, 9:12 PM
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Does it matter which direction you put the tri-cam in to the crack, ie webbing up or webing down, if the crack has no features which create a preference for one or the other?
Jason
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arlen
Sep 7, 2002, 12:43 AM
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I've never heard about a particular benefit of up or down. If you can keep the sling off the bottom lip of the crack by placing it point down, that would help. But I'd say the most important thing is making it easy to clean.
Earlier this summer I encountered 2 red tri-cams welded into horizontal cracks (both on Saber at Leavenworth WA), apparently by means of pushing the unit directly into place (rather than sliding it sideways into a placement). I doubt they're going anywhere, because there's no space to disengage them without carving them out. That sux, especially because there are about a dozen other placements within an arm's reach of each tri-cam. FWIW, they were both point down.
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slcliffdiver
Sep 7, 2002, 12:57 AM
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It'd be fantastic to have some real data on what holds best but I'll give my impressions for what it's worth.
I usually use whatever is most stable and/or catches the nose best. If it's close to the edge relative to the size of the piece on unfeatured rock and a big if, if I think it's stable nose down I prefer it that way.
Reason: For it to work the nose has to stay put while the rails slide a little relative to the nose. If you have the nose down relatively close (not too close) to the edge of the crack the webbing is going to provide somewhat of a downward force on the nose hopefully making it more likely to stick (some crude probably unreliable unscientific experiments by me and conjecture by others). The other way around you rely on the nose catching enough initially so the outward force and the shape will cause it to cam instead of just pull out.
Mostly I'd like a flexible Cam if it's hard to find a good spot for the nose to set but you have to make due with what you have at the moment.
So what do I do? Slightly more often (maybe my imagination) I think I've put them nose up. Mostly I've climbed featured rock and all other things being equal I think I've been more concerned about it being pulled out of position while I climb past it or fall above it than it failing if it stayed oriented. I'm not sure if the rock I've used them the most in horizontal positions has been more featured on top and I don't remember or there has been some other reason it's seemed stable more often with the rails down.
Hope this helps.
Peace
David
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paintinhaler
Sep 7, 2002, 1:05 AM
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Welded in? Explain this to me?
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joemor
Sep 7, 2002, 1:15 AM
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im guessing he means "hard to get out if not impossible"
joe
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dantman
Sep 7, 2002, 2:38 AM
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Webbing side up. This creates a better camming action if a fall were to occur.
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slcliffdiver
Sep 8, 2002, 6:10 PM
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I've heard people say "better" or "stronger" camming action before. It's going to be a weaker camming action in many cases. I'll provide a demo people can do for themselves if anyone wants. I agree it might be less likely to pull out on lightly featured rock so if you mean what I stated before about it possibly setting the pivot point (nose) better in relaition to the rails obviously I agree.
Here's why I'm picking knits. A weeker camming action may be what you want. Easier to clean or if there is a possibility of the crack expanding especially the top part nose down might be beneficial "because of weaker camming action". The difference is going to less significant the farther back the piece is and the more expandend it is. There'll probably be circumstances where the change in the bend over the edge will be more of a factor in terms of how tight the piece gets cammed in there.
It also means that to set the Tri-Cam with nose down you'll need to tug out on the sling somewhat sometimes instead of down like you can do most of the time with the nose up.
Of all the pro I think Tri-cams are the one of the pieces that need to be played around with most to get a feel for how they work in different situations.
Peace
David
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mountainmonkey
Sep 9, 2002, 3:48 PM
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If I remember correctly, Mountaineering: Freedom of the Hills suggests to put tricams with the point up for horizontal placements. I have done this and there is plenty of camming action and the tricam is not balanced on the little point so it seems more stable. For hexes you are supposed to have the cord on the top side for more camming action.
casey
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pbcowboy77
Sep 10, 2002, 3:18 AM
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The monkey is right. In Freedom of the Hills on page 225 it reads "Tri-Cams, however, are more stable if the sling is on the floor of the crack, with the "stinger" pointingup.
-Zac
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bshaftoe
Sep 10, 2002, 3:36 AM
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Sometimes it depends how the unit fits in the crack. Especially if there is a opportune divot or depression.
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jhump
Sep 10, 2002, 5:28 PM
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Point up for two reasons: more stable this way (not balanced on a single point which the rope could work free easier), and less leverage on the piece during a fall.
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climbincajun
Sep 11, 2002, 11:40 PM
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yes, stinger up, sling down. I have seen this illustrated in more than one place...
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