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mhix13
Nov 5, 2008, 4:54 PM
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Registered: May 12, 2008
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So I've tried to search for this on here and I can't seem to find an answer.
I'm getting some pro and biners to start my trad rack. My question is does the shape of a particular carabiner influence it's likelihood to crossload in a fall?
Ie: An oval carabiner (a BD Oval Wire for instance) seems like it would be more stable because it's symetrical, but the gate may be longer than in a smaller differently shaped carabiner (a CAMP Nano 23) and therefore provide more surface area for a potential cross load.
Also have you ever had a carabiner crossload in a fall when you did not girth hitched, clove hitched, or wrapped the biner with a sling?
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colatownkid
Nov 5, 2008, 5:07 PM
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i can't recall any fall i've taken on gear where the sling didn't end up running along the major axis of the biner, right along the spine.
as for shape influencing the likelihood of crossloading, i'm not sure. i climbed on D's until recently; now i use asymmetrical wiregate D's (BD neutrinos to be exact). in both cases, i've yet to notice crossloading (like the sling loading directly on the gate or something to that effect).
in general, D's are stronger than ovals because the biner is designed with the basket closer to the spine-side of the carabiner, thus putting more of the major axis load on the spine of the biner and less on the gate of the biner. D's typically come to a more defined "point" as well; as long as the rope/sling is sitting in this point, i see it as being rather unlikely to slip out and load anywhere but the spine.
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shimanilami
Nov 5, 2008, 5:27 PM
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The DMM Shield design is virtually impossible to cross load.
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fancyclaps
Nov 5, 2008, 5:38 PM
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Registered: Nov 23, 2005
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You could always get some of these:
http://en.petzl.com/petzl/SportProduits?Produit=345
I have been climbing on Petzl Spirit Express draws for a while now and I have never had any problems with my carabiners rotating.
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alleyehave
Nov 5, 2008, 6:57 PM
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mhix13 wrote: Also have you ever had a carabiner crossload in a fall when you did not girth hitched, clove hitched, or wrapped the biner with a sling?
No, no, and no. And I wouldn't worry about it anywho or you're gonna have a lot of worries about a lot of different things when climbing.
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maldaly
Nov 5, 2008, 7:43 PM
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You can totally cross load that shape. From the basket side of the bend in the spine, draw a line to the nose and you'll see how easy it is to do. Is this shape better or worse than any other? It depends. Just don't go out climbing assuming that you can't cross load this biner-you can. It just cross loads differently that you may expect. It may be less likely to cross load than with a symmetrical oval or a D, with their spines parallel to the gates but please don't be under the illusion that they can't cross load.
Climb safe,
Mal
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meahtots
Nov 5, 2008, 11:50 PM
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Registered: Jun 16, 2008
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maldaly wrote: You can totally cross load that shape. From the basket side of the bend in the spine, draw a line to the nose and you'll see how easy it is to do. Is this shape better or worse than any other? It depends. Just don't go out climbing assuming that you can't cross load this biner-you can. It just cross loads differently that you may expect. It may be less likely to cross load than with a symmetrical oval or a D, with their spines parallel to the gates but please don't be under the illusion that they can't cross load. Climb safe, Mal
from the DMM website:
"We can not get a crossloading/minor axis strength using the standard UIAA/CE tests because the biner always falls into the major axis position once the load starts to be applied."
true, you shouldn't assume that you can't cross load it, but it is (dare i say) impossible to do it in any climbing application.
http://www.dmmclimbing.com/...s.asp?id=&id2=39
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