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caughtinside
Sep 16, 2010, 9:37 PM
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If a trad climb has some bolts and mostly gear, do I have to take the draws down between burns? You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, seems silly to take them down here. I'm pulling the rest of the gear.
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boadman
Sep 16, 2010, 10:10 PM
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I ran into this same question on a few routes in Index. My response is twofold:
a. Does it really matter? Am I going to send details of my sickedy-ill pinkpoint into the climbing mags?
b. Will I get more personal satisfaction if I pull the draws before the send?
I decided to compromise and pulled the draws on the bolts that were hard to clip and not the easy to clip ones. That way I felt, personally, as though I'd gotten the send. If the clips are cruxy, I feel like they're part of the climb and should be included for a "real" send, whatever that means.
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hafilax
Sep 16, 2010, 10:31 PM
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If you're going to pull all the gear you might as well pull the draws. Otherwise feel free to split the hairs as finely as you feel fit.
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bill413
Sep 16, 2010, 11:52 PM
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boadman wrote: b. Will I get more personal satisfaction if I pull the draws before the send?
+1
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redlude97
Sep 17, 2010, 12:20 AM
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If you can't pull the draws during the lower and are that worried about the redpoint, just unclip and reclip them to the bolts as you reach them.
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bradley3297
Sep 17, 2010, 1:44 AM
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man shutup. answer the mans question.
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caughtinside
Sep 17, 2010, 1:56 AM
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devkrev wrote: caughtinside wrote: If a trad climb has some bolts and mostly gear, do I have to take the draws down between burns? You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, seems silly to take them down here. I'm pulling the rest of the gear. You obviously need a lesson in your vocabulary. You would pull the gear between "redpoint attempts" If you are still running "burns" on the route you are obviously still in the "working" stage. or at least thats what I've gleaned from the climbing movies....
I didn't know the term 'burn' implied a heavy dogging run. I think a redpoint burn is the same as a redpoint attempt.
I don't think burn means what you think it means.
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notapplicable
Sep 17, 2010, 4:43 AM
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caughtinside wrote: If a trad climb has some bolts and mostly gear, do I have to take the draws down between burns? You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, seems silly to take them down here. I'm pulling the rest of the gear.
Silly rabbit, clipping bolts are for kids.
Just run that shit out.
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bennydh
Sep 17, 2010, 7:12 AM
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Wait a minute. If we are going to get crazy on the word 'burn' like it has an exclusive meaning, and we are going to be word Nazis, then lets get shit straight and call them pinkpoint burns...
Bwahahaha, I went there...
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USnavy
Sep 17, 2010, 9:05 AM
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caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint,
(This post was edited by USnavy on Sep 17, 2010, 9:07 AM)
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spikeddem
Sep 17, 2010, 12:30 PM
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USnavy wrote: caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, Yes you do. Climbing a line with preplaced draws is called a pinkpoint. If there is any preplaced gear, its a pinkpoint. So yes to get the redpoint you have to take the draws down. But who cares, redpoint or pinkpoint, its still a send.
And you best be chopping and re-placing bolts if you want that red point, too. Until then, it's just a pink point.
Get with the times.
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USnavy
Sep 17, 2010, 2:03 PM
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spikeddem wrote: USnavy wrote: caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, Yes you do. Climbing a line with preplaced draws is called a pinkpoint. If there is any preplaced gear, its a pinkpoint. So yes to get the redpoint you have to take the draws down. But who cares, redpoint or pinkpoint, its still a send. And you best be chopping and re-placing bolts if you want that red point, too. Until then, it's just a pink point. Get with the times.
I am with the times but the definition of redpoint and pinkpoint has not changed because some have gotten lazy and decided to just call pinkpoints redpoints. Personally I dont give a shit, preplaced gear or not if you get it clean on lead its a send.
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lucaskrajnik
Sep 17, 2010, 3:24 PM
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So does that mean- Sharma, Graham- have only pink pointed routes?..... never actually sent them?
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caughtinside
Sep 17, 2010, 3:26 PM
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USnavy wrote: caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, Yes you do. Climbing a line with preplaced draws is called a pinkpoint. If there is any preplaced gear, its a pinkpoint. So yes to get the redpoint you have to take the draws down. But who cares, redpoint or pinkpoint, its still a send.
You don't know anything.
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csproul
Sep 17, 2010, 3:31 PM
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lucaskrajnik wrote: So does that mean- Sharma, Graham- have only pink pointed routes?..... never actually sent them?
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healyje
Sep 17, 2010, 4:27 PM
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You must be trolling as there is no x-pointing in trad climbing. You either did it clean (no dogging) onsight or you didn't - anything after that means you just got up it.
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I_do
Sep 18, 2010, 4:18 PM
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USnavy wrote: spikeddem wrote: USnavy wrote: caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, Yes you do. Climbing a line with preplaced draws is called a pinkpoint. If there is any preplaced gear, its a pinkpoint. So yes to get the redpoint you have to take the draws down. But who cares, redpoint or pinkpoint, its still a send. And you best be chopping and re-placing bolts if you want that red point, too. Until then, it's just a pink point. Get with the times. I am with the times but the definition of redpoint and pinkpoint has not changed because some have gotten lazy and decided to just call pinkpoints redpoints. Personally I dont give a shit, preplaced gear or not if you get it clean on lead its a send.
Yes it has. Pinkpoint didn't change meaning but redpoint sure as hell did! Language changes dude just because someone can't get with the times doesn't mean we need to keep using archaic terms.
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jt512
Sep 18, 2010, 4:44 PM
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USnavy wrote: caughtinside wrote: You don't on a sport climb to get a redpoint, Yes you do. Climbing a line with preplaced draws is called a pinkpoint. If there is any preplaced gear, its a pinkpoint. So yes to get the redpoint you have to take the draws down. But who cares, redpoint or pinkpoint, its still a send.
And it's a redpoint. Your sport climbing dictionary is out of date.
Jay
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Gmburns2000
Sep 18, 2010, 8:33 PM
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just because they're there that doesn't mean you have to clip them.
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iamthewallress
Sep 18, 2010, 10:26 PM
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I was thinking like healyje...
I know that the mags don't think about the sport/trad division like I do, but to my POV, the distinction has more to do with the style of the climb (ground up vs. dogged) than the nature of the protection (gear v. bolts).
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Gmburns2000
Sep 18, 2010, 11:20 PM
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I was simply trying to say an absurd thing in a somewhat absurd conversation.
of course, I've asked a similar question before, so therefore:
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watchme
Sep 19, 2010, 3:07 AM
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That is why very few "trad" climbers are, uh, trad climbers.
Trad climbing is neither.
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jt512
Sep 19, 2010, 4:36 AM
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watchme wrote: Trad climbing is neither.
And even if it were it wouldn't be.
Jay
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milesenoell
Sep 19, 2010, 5:08 AM
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healyje wrote: You must be trolling as there is no x-pointing in trad climbing. You either did it clean (no dogging) onsight or you didn't - anything after that means you just got up it.
I just got my first taste of onsight trad lead recently, and I got a kick out of how different it really is to be placing your gear onsight, rather than on some climb you are familiar with. Way more engaging than an onsight sport lead (for me, anyway).
There's really nothing quite like fresh rock.
(This post was edited by milesenoell on Sep 19, 2010, 5:10 AM)
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