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johnwesely
Jan 23, 2012, 1:43 PM
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The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches and maybe less if I am plugging gear. Since I usually have to drive four hours to climb, I am usually at the crag around noonish. I know this isn't absolutely awful considering how much time I spend driving, but it still breaks down to about an hour or more per pitch, which seems really slow. I would really like to be able to get more out of my climbing days.
For those of you who are more efficient than me, what are some habits I can adopt to speed up my climbing day? I am not really interested in one off tricks like wear your racked up harness on the approach. It doesn't really seem too unreasonable to get ten or more pitches out of a half day. Help me get there.
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herites
Jan 23, 2012, 2:15 PM
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Let me share our story. I usually climb with my girlfriend and with a friend. Assume my gf is climbing, I am belaying. I lower my gf, chatting to my friend, she takes her shoes off, unties, I pull the rope, we sort our gear, walk to a new route, I'm tying in, putting shoes on and waiting for one of them to put me on belay. See where it goes? It's awfully unefficient. My friend could sort our gear while he's idle, my gf could first untie, then remove the shoes, etc.
Make sure everything is efficient and organized. While your partner ties in, puts on shoes you could sort the gear for your turn. Also, always have the water bottle and some snacks in reach, so you don't have to trek back to your pack. If you are doing routes close to each other, both of you should tie in.
Find where are you losing time, always do something, never idle.
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csproul
Jan 23, 2012, 2:56 PM
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Don't be so hard on yourself, 5-7 pitches in a half day isn't that bad. I think the most obvious thing you can do to up the pitch count is to climb easier routes. I know that's probably not what you had in mind, but it is the most obvious answer. The next thing might be to pre-plan what you are going to climb. Location matters. The concentration of routes in an area, how quickly you can get from one area to another, how familiar are you with the areas and routes...these all speed up the process. I seem to get better pitch counts when climbing multi-pitch routes too. I guess I just naturally waste more time when I'm on the ground. So maybe treat cragging like multi-pitch days and minimize change-over times just like you would on multi-pitch routes. I think it also very important to have a like-minded partner, who is willing to try and speed things up and not kill time between routes.
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lena_chita
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Jan 23, 2012, 3:21 PM
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I would like to hear the tips, too.
But IMO large part of it is the nature and the attitude/mindset when you are cragging vs. doing multi-pitch. 4-7 pitches a day is how my usual day of sport climbing goes, too.
In a day of single-pitch cragging, so much time is spent walking around, waiting for people, talking, snacking, watching other climbers, and just lounging around. With a multi-pitch, you tie in and go. And unless you are on some super-popular route you are not waiting for others, and you are not wasting your time talking, walking around, etc. etc.
Also, with the single-pitch climbing I am likely to be working at least some of the routes as a project, e.i. there is hanging involved, which eats up time really fast, and then I am likely to want to rest for a pretty long time, if I am trying to redpoint; While with multi-pitch, you are likely climbing closer to your onsight/easy redpoint level, probably not working the route, unless that was your specific goal-- but then you wouldn't be doing too many pitches in that day, either. Also, I know some people who don't care so much if you as a second aid through a section, if their goal is to be quick and cover the distance.
You can definitely make a day of single-pitch cragging more efficient, if you want to.
One day this past spring, my 2 partners and I did 23 single-pitch sport routes total located at three separate crags near each other in 5 hours (I did 13 of them). That's about 13 min per pitch, including cleaning draws on some of them, and walking around/packing. It was for a comp, I was trying to get as many routes as I could, so I had an incentive. The way we did it: we had two ropes, so I would climb one route, with one guy belaying, while the other guy found the next route, flaked the rope, clipped the first bolt, put the shoes on, etc. As soon as I was done, my belayer went to belay the other guy, while I packed the rope and moved it to the next route. Then I would climb the route that was just done by the 3rd guy, with the 3rd guy belaying, and clean the draws on the way down, while the second guy prepared the rope, and got ready to climb on the next route. And so on. A few times I got lucky with other people's draws already hanging. :) And couple of the routes I didn't get on the first try, so I had to do them again.
Couple summers ago my partner and I did 11-12 single sport pitches each in a day, so 22-24 total, don't remember exactly now. This was at 5 or 6 different crags (we had to do 6 specific routes for a fundraiser comp in the afternoon, and in the morning we were just climbing), so it included a lot of walking, but summer days are long.
And boy, was I tired the next day. :)
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johnwesely
Jan 23, 2012, 3:50 PM
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My record sport climbing was doing 15 pitches over 5.10 at the Red a few years ago. I think I did 18 pitches in all, but I don't really remember now. I also did 14 pitches at the Gunks two years ago, but I doubt many of those pitches were graded over 5.10. Those days just sort of happened though. I would really like to develop the habits to approach that efficiency more often.
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USnavy
Jan 23, 2012, 4:38 PM
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johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches
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johnwesely
Jan 23, 2012, 4:43 PM
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USnavy wrote: johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches Last I heard you were changing that value to zero, change your mind? Good on you.
Are you talking about that Facebook status. That was my little bro playing a pretty funny trick on me while I was asleep.
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caughtinside
Jan 23, 2012, 5:18 PM
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Well, I'll start with the obvious... wake up early and get to the crag before noon.
Other stuff has already been suggested like climbing easier pitches. Of course, you may not find it satisfactory to climb easier all day. My pitch count defintiely drops down if I'm trying within a couple letters of my max all day. Maybe try alternating hard/easy, so you're getting some recovery on easier pitches?
I also top rope a fair bit. The best are the freebies where you can lead one, and then leave the rope up maybe with a directional, and toprope a neighboring route. sort of a bonus.
I'd also suggest toproping at the end of the day. Once I start getting tired and I've done my hard leads, it's easy to feel satisfied and get complacent. Just throw a toprope on someting and burn out on it.
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granite_grrl
Jan 23, 2012, 5:40 PM
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johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches and maybe less if I am plugging gear. Since I usually have to drive four hours to climb, I am usually at the crag around noonish. I know this isn't absolutely awful considering how much time I spend driving, but it still breaks down to about an hour or more per pitch, which seems really slow. I would really like to be able to get more out of my climbing days. For those of you who are more efficient than me, what are some habits I can adopt to speed up my climbing day? I am not really interested in one off tricks like wear your racked up harness on the approach. It doesn't really seem too unreasonable to get ten or more pitches out of a half day. Help me get there.
Maybe you need to start getting on harder stuff? It is nice to get milliage days, but I probably find it most satisfying getting on hard (for me) routes that will trash me in 5-7 pitches.
Otherwise maybe look for some different partners? I find there are some people I climb with where I can get in 10 or so pitches with without effort. Other partners I'll move slower with. Make sure you both have the same agenda.
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donald949
Jan 23, 2012, 6:31 PM
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johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches and maybe less if I am plugging gear. Since I usually have to drive four hours to climb, I am usually at the crag around noonish. I know this isn't absolutely awful considering how much time I spend driving, but it still breaks down to about an hour or more per pitch, which seems really slow. I would really like to be able to get more out of my climbing days. For those of you who are more efficient than me, what are some habits I can adopt to speed up my climbing day? I am not really interested in one off tricks like wear your racked up harness on the approach. It doesn't really seem too unreasonable to get ten or more pitches out of a half day. Help me get there.
I wuz happy that our group got 10 100' pitches. Since I had my 2 boys, I only got 3 pitches myself. Would have like another. But it was rewarding to see them make the full 100' climbs.
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j_ung
Jan 23, 2012, 6:39 PM
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caughtinside wrote: Well, I'll start with the obvious... wake up early and get to the crag before noon. Other stuff has already been suggested like climbing easier pitches. Of course, you may not find it satisfactory to climb easier all day. My pitch count defintiely drops down if I'm trying within a couple letters of my max all day. Maybe try alternating hard/easy, so you're getting some recovery on easier pitches? I also top rope a fair bit. The best are the freebies where you can lead one, and then leave the rope up maybe with a directional, and toprope a neighboring route. sort of a bonus. I'd also suggest toproping at the end of the day. Once I start getting tired and I've done my hard leads, it's easy to feel satisfied and get complacent. Just throw a toprope on someting and burn out on it.
Good advice. Organize the day better, rather than using tricks and tips.
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lena_chita
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Jan 23, 2012, 7:11 PM
Post #12 of 41
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donald949 wrote: johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches and maybe less if I am plugging gear. Since I usually have to drive four hours to climb, I am usually at the crag around noonish. I know this isn't absolutely awful considering how much time I spend driving, but it still breaks down to about an hour or more per pitch, which seems really slow. I would really like to be able to get more out of my climbing days. For those of you who are more efficient than me, what are some habits I can adopt to speed up my climbing day? I am not really interested in one off tricks like wear your racked up harness on the approach. It doesn't really seem too unreasonable to get ten or more pitches out of a half day. Help me get there. Last weekend the guy at the crag next to us did 10 200' pitches after 12. He set up his rope on the top and climbed, roped solo'd, w/ mini traxton. He would rap off and do it again. The bottom 100 feet were in the 8/9 range, the top, 10a/c range. That would be a pretty good burn. I wuz happy that our group got 10 100' pitches. Since I had my 2 boys, I only got 3 pitches myself. Would have like another. But it was rewarding to see them make the full 100' climbs.
Sorry, but I am pretty sure that this is not quite what JW is looking for. Running TR laps on the same route is a good training, for some things, but not even remotely in the category of cragging efficiency.
Oh, and anything under 5.10 doesn't count. 
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donald949
Jan 23, 2012, 11:50 PM
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lena_chita wrote: donald949 wrote: johnwesely wrote: The average cragging day trip for me involves between roughly five and seven pitches and maybe less if I am plugging gear. Since I usually have to drive four hours to climb, I am usually at the crag around noonish. I know this isn't absolutely awful considering how much time I spend driving, but it still breaks down to about an hour or more per pitch, which seems really slow. I would really like to be able to get more out of my climbing days. For those of you who are more efficient than me, what are some habits I can adopt to speed up my climbing day? I am not really interested in one off tricks like wear your racked up harness on the approach. It doesn't really seem too unreasonable to get ten or more pitches out of a half day. Help me get there. Last weekend the guy at the crag next to us did 10 200' pitches after 12. He set up his rope on the top and climbed, roped solo'd, w/ mini traxton. He would rap off and do it again. The bottom 100 feet were in the 8/9 range, the top, 10a/c range. That would be a pretty good burn. I wuz happy that our group got 10 100' pitches. Since I had my 2 boys, I only got 3 pitches myself. Would have like another. But it was rewarding to see them make the full 100' climbs. Sorry, but I am pretty sure that this is not quite what JW is looking for. Running TR laps on the same route is a good training, for some things, but not even remotely in the category of cragging efficiency. Oh, and anything under 5.10 doesn't count. 
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johnwesely
Jan 24, 2012, 12:04 AM
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I guess this is as good as any time to say this. I think I may have met you at the New this summer. I realized this a month ago. You were with Dan Brayack I think, and I was with a blonde girl. If that is the case, it was nice to meet you.
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yodadave
Jan 24, 2012, 12:10 AM
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I'll second the TR Solo for simply "getting more out of my climbing days"
I would say i can triple my daily mileage if i TR Solo. I know a lot of sport and trad areas where it would work to climb half a day clippin' and pluggin' and then burnout out on TR Solo just to get your full workout. Bring two ropes and you and your partner can trade out routes.
lena i take your point that this is not strictly in the defn of what JW asked but it really is a good mileage answer to the problem. For difficulty i figure forget the number of routes and go for simply challenge.
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lena_chita
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Jan 24, 2012, 12:40 AM
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johnwesely wrote: I guess this is as good as any time to say this. I think I may have met you at the New this summer. I realized this a month ago. You were with Dan Brayack I think, and I was with a blonde girl. If that is the case, it was nice to meet you.
Entirely possible, but I have no idea what you look like. Do you remember where we were (which crag), so I could maybe get a memory jolt?
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johnwesely
Jan 24, 2012, 12:49 AM
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You were at the campground on top of Kaymoor. I am tall, really skinny, and bespectacled. At the time, I had a very weak attempt at a mustache.
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johnwesely
Jan 24, 2012, 12:51 AM
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I am not personally interested in the top roping answers, but I am glad they were posted for other people to see. Top roping really scares me. I feel like I am soloing and don't like it at all.
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areyoumydude
Jan 24, 2012, 1:00 AM
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Damn, I thought this was a beer thread.
I've got nothin'.
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johnwesely
Jan 24, 2012, 1:02 AM
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areyoumydude wrote: Damn, I thought this was a beer thread. I've got nothin'.
If you have beer advice, by all means...
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lena_chita
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Jan 24, 2012, 1:08 AM
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johnwesely wrote: You were at the campground on top of Kaymoor. I am tall, really skinny, and bespectacled. At the time, I had a very weak attempt at a mustache.
Oh, O.K. I stalked you. And yes, I definitely met you. But for the life of me, I can't remember being at Roger's this summer. It all blends together after a while.
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areyoumydude
Jan 24, 2012, 1:23 AM
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johnwesely wrote: areyoumydude wrote: Damn, I thought this was a beer thread. I've got nothin'. If you have beer advice, by all means...
Adding V8 to crappy beer is a good way to get your RDA of veggies.
Do whatever it takes to keep your beer cold.
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camhead
Jan 24, 2012, 2:29 AM
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areyoumydude wrote: johnwesely wrote: areyoumydude wrote: Damn, I thought this was a beer thread. I've got nothin'. If you have beer advice, by all means... Adding V8 to crappy beer is a good way to get your RDA of veggies. Do whatever it takes to keep your beer cold.
mmm, red beer. we used to drink a lot of those on river trips.
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guangzhou
Jan 24, 2012, 2:42 AM
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Not sure where you climb, but you could increase routes per day by leaving the night before and camping at the cliff.
When I lived in the south, it wasn't usual to have four or five of us go tot he cliff together, sometime more. That meant I was always able to get a belay on a route. Some people don't want to climb loads and load, just a few routes is enough, others want to push themselves on hard routes, some want mileage.
Eman
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bearbreeder
Jan 24, 2012, 6:44 AM
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1. do multipitch ... serious multi, not just the 2-3 pitch wonders ... im talking like 500m+ of vertical gain ... youll easily get 10+ pitches in a few hours
2. on said multi climb with a partner who is quick at following ..
3. if you lack said multi ... climb below yr level for maximum mileage ... obviously climbing at yr limit or projecting stuff takes up more time generally ...
4. climbing climbs youve done before goes faster usually than those yr trying to flash/onsight ... you know the moves and gear already
5. make it an goal that you MUST get X number of pitches in ... even if you need to do them by headlamp at the end of the day ... they can be easy "filler" pitches ... it gets you into the habit of non stop climbing
6. make a resolution that you wont yap ... just climb ... most people lose time by yapping on the ground ...
7. belay from the top ... while it may seem to take more time to set up ... i find on quite a few climbs it actually saves time as there is no tendency to yap, yr partner is at the bottom ... it also gets you in the multipitch mode of efficiency where yr partner is tied in and ready to go once yr off belay ... good for practicing for multipitch efficiency ... if you can control the yapping, belaying from the bottom should be faster, but you need to treat it like multi ... partner should be ready and tied in to do with shoes on the moment you touch down ... and no flirting with hawt gurls
8. get a strong partner, not necessary a strong leader, but someone physically and strong enough techique wise not to have too many issues with the climbing and doesnt take forever ... and also as dedicated as you to mileage
9. have a set break time for water and lunch ... those are rewards for climbing ... not something you do between every climb ...
10. make sure you are well hydrated and nourished , and have enough sleep prior to the climbs ...
11. time yourself ... on multipitch if you are taking more than 30 min per pitch between the two of you on a climb somewhat between yr level ... theres a good chance yr descending in the dark on a decently long climb ... adopt the same headspace ...
12. adopt the same division of labour as multi ... on person flakes the rope immediately or moves it to the new climb, while the second reracks ...
13. DO NOT bring large packs ... a daypack or bullet pack ... with large packs youll end up bring shiet you dont need and taking it out/putting back in ... waste of time
14. just like multi have all yr topos and climb beta ready the night before ... you should know exactly what climbs you want to do with alternates ... also try to hit up crags with many climbs you can do ... instead of just one or two within yr limit
at the end ... treat it like multipitch ... and youll climb faster and be more efficient ... and itll server you well on bigger stuff
when i take a newer person up the chief (12+ linked pitches in 5-6 hours) ... i do a prep day where i lead 10-12+ pitches and they follow and clean ... or vice versa ... the sole focus is on speed and safety ...
(This post was edited by bearbreeder on Jan 24, 2012, 7:08 AM)
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