I don't see how you link to the forums from the routes database, but anyway my point is that it doesn't happen on RC like it does on mountain project.
I know about adding to information to the the routes, I am adding to the routes data, but most users are not. In mountain project, almost all those who note that they climbed a route add some helpful information about the route. In RC.com the users typically just note that they climbed the route. They are ticking, rather than adding helpful information. If that were to change, I think it would make RC more appealing.

IMHO there is a SMALL minority of users that revel in being rude and sometimes abusive. For every user that likes it "raw" and has 1000s of intentionally inflammatory posts, there are 100s of users that would prefer to talk about rock climbing in the a more civil manner, similar to what we do when we meet face to face. By catering to the vocal minority, I think that you drive away the larger and more civil user group. I don't want to see a whitewashed and heavily moderated site, but don't particularly enjoy participating in a site where threads commonly devolve into insult contests. Although I do not have data to support this, I believe that the mass exodus of users happened way before the spamming. I quit visiting due to the site becoming progressively more toxic. I am sure others had different reasons.

+1

I have no problem with site users keeping each other in check. This site went well beyond that for quite some time. With everything there is a balance.

On another note, some people have suggested catering to the n00b. Moving away from the cliche "do a search" or "you're gonna die" replies would be nice, but you can't maintain a community around shoe and first rope discussions.

I'm having trouble remembering exactly when moderation was much heavier and inconsistently applied. I came over to rc.com after wreck.climbing was already well in decline in non-spam posts. (Seeing a trend in my patterns?) While I'm not a fan of back and forth squabbling when it's clearly stopped being productive or people being dicks for the sake of it, I'd be much more likely to bail if moderation is too heavy-handed.

On another note, some people have suggested catering to the n00b. Moving away from the cliche "do a search" or "you're gonna die" replies would be nice, but you can't maintain a community around shoe and first rope discussions.

+1

I have no problem with site users keeping each other in check. This site went well beyond that for quite some time. With everything there is a balance.

I'm having trouble remembering exactly when moderation was much heavier and inconsistently applied. I came over to rc.com after wreck.climbing was already well in decline in non-spam posts. (Seeing a trend in my patterns?) While I'm not a fan of back and forth squabbling when it's clearly stopped being productive or people being dicks for the sake of it, I'd be much more likely to bail if moderation is too heavy-handed.

On another note, some people have suggested catering to the n00b. Moving away from the cliche "do a search" or "you're gonna die" replies would be nice, but you can't maintain a community around shoe and first rope discussions.

My recollection is that a large number of regular users were disgruntled with the direction the site took when DDT took it over, and left the site soon after. But I could be mistaken.

Have to disagree on that point, as the existence of teen magazines is proof it's not true. It's that the user quickly outgrows the community, not that the community can't exist. The problem is striking a balance between making the community accessible to new folk while at the same time keeping the interest of the older ones. Plus with new ropes and shoes coming out all the time and the decline of brick&mortar stores, how else is someone new going to get opinions on their first pieces of gear?

what kept users coming to rc.com was a vibrant, sometimes bawdy, familiar forum known as community. i came to this site for climbing info but stayed because of the connections i made. through community i picked up some good climbing buddies and friends.........most of them i know only online and haven't met in real life. with changes in rc.com leadership and issues with the site, most of my interaction has switched over to facebook. give a look at the threads in campfire or soapbox, there is not much turnover in discussion.

i benefited from gear reviews and also swapping knowledge climber to climber, ie., what down jacket do you prefer, or what harness is more comfortable on a longer climb. it's these kinds of exchanges that keep users coming back.

as well, it has to be recognized that climbers are a rowdy bunch, there's going to be off colour talk and a few stfu noobs. just keep out the dumb assery sexist, racist, and homophobic crap.

Not sure if that's agreeing with me or not, Marge. But if not, I'd like to amend my earlier statement to bring it more in line with what I meant, which is what you stated better.

I don't think many people would consider that picture (Williams on the first nude ascent of Shockley's Ceiling) to be sexually explicit content.

I miss the gear reviews from John. He always did good work on those trade shows.

I never enjoyed the lab talk because I'm just not interested in the physics of everything and those conversations could get numb from the over-analysis of the numbers, but I think those conversations were a good part of the meat for a while, and I did learn something when someone finally wrote up a summary for dummies.

looks like my first post was one of the posts to go. my point was !.this ship is sinking fast, if you're going to get change implemented, it has to be sooner than later.

but, you won't win any friends or favours by hiding posts you don't like

I don't think many people would consider that picture (Williams on the first nude ascent of Shockley's Ceiling) to be sexually explicit content.

I'll be PM'ing a few of you shortly with more explanation of why I hid your posts.

[Edit: As I pm'd those of you whose posts I hid, I'm *not* making a sitewide policy that threads can't get derailed, just I'd appreciate if we keep this particular thread on-topic for two reasons: 1) I want to make sure I hear from a wide variety of users, not just the vocal ones, and tons of o/t posts starts to make a thread feel like it's insiders only, and 2) I'm trying to come up to speed as fast as possible and make sure I read all these posts and think about them and a long stream of off-topic discussion just adds more cycles that slows me down, which slows down how fast I can make changes to move this site forward. If you want to just chit-chat, there's plenty of other threads for that.]

Jeff