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eclarke98
Nov 30, 2001, 8:18 PM
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Registered: Aug 23, 2001
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I was out climbing two weekends ago and shortly before I left two guys showed up and set up a top rope. I had talked to them for a bit before they started climbing and found out they had about 2 years experience, or so they said. One of the guys proceeded to tie himself in with a rope harness (it looked extremely uncomfortable, especially for a guy) and then he started to climb in tennis shoes, even though the route was a 5.10d. These guys hadn't gotten past the first 15 feet of the route by the time I had left, so it sort of made me think about if they knew what they were doing.
When I got to the top of the cliff to take down my anchor, I just about had a heart attack when I saw their anchor. It was one short piece of webbing running from one bolt through the other, in an upside down L shape (think of a 2 sided American Death Triangle) then the rope was running through one ancient looking carabiner that was smaller than I had ever seen. Clearly this was not a safe anchor at all, if any one point failed these guys were screwed.
I was so shocked that someone would trust their life to this that I went down and asked if they wanted to borrow some gear to fix up their anchor. They sort of seemed angered at this and said it their anchor was perfectly safe.
I'm wondering if I should have even gone down and talked to them about it. Do we as climber's have a responsibility to watch out for each other? Should a climber who doesn't know any better be responsible for themselves?
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squeeks
Dec 5, 2001, 6:16 AM
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Registered: Aug 21, 2001
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i have been in similar situations before. only when i offered to help fix the situation they asked what they did wrong. i politely told them and they fixed it themselves under my direction and supervision. they nicely thanked me for the help and admitted that they were new to the sport and were never properly taught how to set up an anchor. other then that people usually do get offended when help is offered. at least i know that there is one more SAFE new climber out there and hopefully he will help others down the road.
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hooligan_dawgs
Dec 13, 2001, 4:00 AM
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personally i would apreciate help if it's offered but that's just me. of course if i see something that's unsafe i'd be sure to point it out and if they want to be jerks that's ok too cause sooner or later their gonna find out the hard way. but i think that we do have a responsibility to other climbers, and not only that, you never know when you'll meet a new friend that will climb with you later on. that's really what it's all about isn't it meeting new people that love climbing and making new friends. this isn't a loner sport because it's more fun in tightly knit groups.
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hangerlessbolt
Dec 13, 2001, 4:41 PM
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From the perspective of being sympathetic to the lives of others; explaining to them the error of their setup would be a good call. Generally speaking, climbers look out for climbers.
From the perspective of selfishness; if these guys die while climbing there, you could be faced with access issues to your local crag.
Be polite, be sincere, and if they don’t listen to your wise words of caution; begin beating them about the head, neck, and chest!
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talons05
Dec 13, 2001, 4:56 PM
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Registered: Aug 23, 2001
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They had no reason to be rude. And yes, I do feel that as experienced climbers, it IS our responsibility to fix a problem like that if we see it. It will do no good for access (not to mention families) to have new climbers splatting on the ground...
AW
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graniteboy
Dec 14, 2001, 6:09 AM
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Registered: Dec 1, 2001
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Am I my Brother's keeper???
Although I would think it's a nice thing to save somebody's ass, I've seen that general scenario played out so many frikkin times that I just plain quit talking to them. I'm definitely getting jaded. There are thousands of newbie gym climbers who apparently have more than my 30 yrs climbing/guiding experience....
If I see someone who actually IS about to die, I call them on it. And their little egos usually get all pissed off. I think I'm heading more toward the "Boy, you really screwed up, huh? That leg looks broken. For a #5 camalot and 80$, I'll give you a belay outta here, OK?". Jaded.
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stigonrock
Dec 14, 2001, 1:07 PM
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Registered: Aug 3, 2001
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Hey eclark98.
You did the right thing...which was to warn those guys, however the responsibility is utlimately theirs. If anything happened to them after you left, then its totally their fault especially as you did warn them.
As climbers we all have a responsibility to warn/ advise others if we see things going wrong, but its up to the individual to heed and take the advice offered.
You even went a step further and offered to help them out. Ok they didn't accept it...but good on you for trying.
Nice one man
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lschlack
Jan 5, 2002, 11:55 PM
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Registered: Jan 1, 2002
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It seems to be the right thing to do, to let them know their rig is unsafe. If its done in a mild and humble way, most will listen. Its often when we tell others in a way that can downgrade them that they get offended.
Even if they do become offended, you have done what you should have.
I also agree with something hangerlessbolt said earlier. If someone dies, we risk access problems. Its not our job to run around inspecting everybody elses anchors, but if we see something that is real wrong, we should speak up.
I do however sympathize with the attitudes some have experienced from those you tried to help. Never the less keep offering.
Regards,
Larry
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