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boospot
Mar 8, 2003, 1:42 AM
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I totally suck at free climbing and its getting me down. Should I start aid climbing?. Is this the reason most people get into aid climbing?.
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iamthewallress
Mar 8, 2003, 2:06 AM
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I'll admit, it has something to do w/ my fascination w/ it...
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nailzz
Mar 8, 2003, 2:20 AM
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This is exactly why people start aid climbing!
...
except not at all.
I would guess that if you took a sampling of 100 aid climbers you would find that well over 50% of them free climb at least 5.10 trad.
I would characterize aid climbing as an area of extreme specialization within climbing. It is by no means a cop out way to climb. In many ways it is infinitely harder and scarier than most free climbing out there.
So, person X starts climbing. He begins by following his mentor up some moderate trad climbs and maybe top-roping some sport routes. Before long he realizes that he really likes to place gear so he opts for trad over sport and plunges himself headlong into climbing trad routes, especially long ones that get him waaaaay off the ground and take a full day. Before long he meets somebody who turns him on to aid climbing and, based on that persons recollection of their epic adventure on El Cap last summer, he saves up enough dough for haul bags, a portaledge, some hooks and whatnot. Then, he quits his job in May, sells everything he owns except his climbing gear and his car and drives to Yosemite. Once in Yosemite he sells his car to a tourist and enters Camp 4, his new home for the summer, and into the fall if his funds can hold out.
He spends the summer sherpa-ing for the wall rats who in turn teach them all they can about big-walling. By the end of the summer he is a respected member of the dirtbag community and has done several ascents to the top of El Cap himself. Autumn comes, he runs out of money, and heads home to sponge off his climbing buddies until he get a new job. He lives like a rat for the winter months, pinching every penny because come May .... guess where he's going?
Wow, talk about a tangent.
Slow night at work all, sorry ...
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danskiz
Mar 8, 2003, 2:21 AM
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I do think that unfortunately most aid climbers are't very good free climbers. I do know some aid climbers that can climb hard free. Personally I love them both. Aid climbing is much more mental than free climbing though. A1 or A2 not so much, but you start hitting A3 and up and it can get nerve racking. Aid climbing is a lot more physical than it looks too. I remember when I led my first A4. When I got to the top of the pitch there was a small ledge, I just laid there for like 5 minutes before I even built the anchor. My mind and nerves were shot. I actually had to think about how to build the anchor, something that is usually second nature. I think that is the biggest difference between aid and free. Although both have some of each, free climbing is more physical, and aid climbing is more mental. Depends on what you like.
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epic_ed
Mar 8, 2003, 4:27 AM
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I'm an aid climber, and I climb crap free. I use no crap in the process of ascending a route. Lots of whining, crying, and thumb sucking, but no crap.
Oh, maybe that's not what you meant. :P
I will never be a 5.12 climber -- trad or sport. So for me, the best way to get up big, towering, majestic rock formations is to aid. If there were no huge rock faces to climb I wouldn't even bother, but scaling something like El Cap by any "fair means" is still a formidable challenge for me so I chose to aid rather than not climb it at all. It's not for everyone. So yes, I suck bad enough at free climbing that I will never be able to climb the big walls that I want to without aiding.
Ed
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apollodorus
Mar 8, 2003, 5:25 AM
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Some of the gnarliest free-climbers are also aid climbing masters. And some aid climbers have completely retired from free climbing. And some sport climbers at the top of the heap couldn't aid up C2 to save themselves.
So, there are all kinds out there.
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passthepitonspete
Mar 8, 2003, 2:14 PM
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To answer your question: Yes! This one sure is.
Just because I can free climb doesn't mean I have to.
That would involve training, which is far too much work for me. I can solo big walls off the couch, and by the time I reach the summit I am usually fit.
Then again, I think there is some obligatory 5.10 on Bermuda Dunes. Ten pitches up El Cap seems like a perfect time to come out of Free Climbing Retirement - I certainly lack the motivation to do so any sooner.
I'll get up - somehow. I always do.
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mrhardgrit
Mar 9, 2003, 10:44 AM
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Well, if you're not too hot on your free climbing, aiding is a really great way to get a LONG way up a wall, without having those steely fingers!
I personally have taken to it [aid] in recent years because training and climbing above 5.12 was giving me loads of injuries and hence I am now happier to climb the easier stuff for pleasure and push myself in terms of aid. A couple of my Brit partners who came out to do some big walls with me last summer boulder at V10, so all aid climbers can't be crap!
Tom
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apollodorus
Mar 9, 2003, 10:58 AM
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I watched PTPP free the spookiest "no pro" I'd seen in a long time on Excalibur. I was too stoopid to take a photo of it: my bad. There was NO way to get pro. It was fifty+ feet of free-solo above a ledge fall. Imagine two giant blocks touching, corner to corner, with no way to get pro. That was his lead.
PTPP may be retired from free climbing, but I saw him come back, as a consultant, to do that B.A. pitch.
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mother_sheep
Mar 11, 2003, 11:00 PM
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I have to admit that this post has really made me feel better about some druthers I've been having about taking on my first big wall, having only been climbing for barely over 1 year. I have no fear of heights and exposure and I trusts my partners (my teachers) with my life, literally. The higher I can get on a wall, the more I feel like I am actually climbing. Single pitch climbs are fun but to me hanging high above the earth is what its all about. I'm a mere 5.10 climber at best and knowing verly little about aid, I wan't sure if that fact was going to hurt my cause. I plan on aiding this weekend so I can get the basics. In a way I'm happy to see that there is a fair amount of people who climb aid that aren't what I would consider to be fabulous free climbers.
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yeti
Mar 11, 2003, 11:11 PM
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The idea behind aid is to take the easiest means to climb outrageous lines. Why not grab the gear basically? I guess aid climbing is the lazy way of climbing. Until you really start doing it that is!
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alpinelynx
Mar 12, 2003, 9:46 PM
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Somehow I don't think this is the case with all aid climbers. Is it hard to fathom that aid climbing is, in fact, an interesting and fun endeavor in and of itself?
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andyk
Mar 13, 2003, 8:51 PM
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All I can say on the subject is that I've climbed el cap with 6 partners and 5 had climbed Brit E7 and all said aid climbing was scarier and tougher!
Personaly I've never come accross any free climbing too worrying (although I didn't lead that 5.9 pitch on Iron Hawk or 5.10 on Lost In America!)
Andy K
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mojorisin
Mar 22, 2003, 7:58 PM
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I couldnt help but jump on this one, love your post nailzz. Aid climbing is lazy and the easy way out ONLY to those who have never done it. I hear alot of people dis it but they have never really tried to climb hard aid or just DONT GET IT. there are places you could never get to with out aid climbing. Take a 20 foot blank wall for instance. Sure you could make a 3/8 bolt ladder but those who really aid climb know thats the P&$$ys way out. Its not about jugging ropes or hanging from gear,,altho you must do both of these to aid climb. All I can say is find a good teacher and give it a go. You might be surprized.
P.S. figure out what it will cost for the best trad rack you could buy,,then triple it.
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passthepitonspete
Mar 22, 2003, 8:10 PM
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You didn't lead it, Andy? Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!!! [DDEL] Then you got off easy, mate.
Holy sandbag, Batman! That shore as hail ain't no fav-nahn on Steel Raptor! It scared the livin' bejeepers outa me. Unfortunately *I* didn't have a partner to bail me out....
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smithclimber
Mar 22, 2003, 9:30 PM
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No, not all aid climbers are bad free climbers.
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bvb
Mar 22, 2003, 9:39 PM
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seems to me i recall a time when the best free climbers and the best aid climbers were often one in the same -- steve sutton, ron kauk, bill price: you know, that crowd. later on, there were guys like dave bengston and pete takada. true, the folks who performed at the most hard-core levels on both free climbs and walls were a pretty small bunch, but they did exist. no reason you can't excel at both. it's a simple matter of wanting it. so get busy, younguns, make yer mamas proud.
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michaelpaul
Mar 24, 2003, 3:13 PM
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No Doubt Bob! You tell 'em! Any one also remember the likes of Randy Leavitt or Charles Cole? Putting up the Hardest of El Cap Routes, when they weren't Climbing or doing the FA on the Stiffest of Free Routes!
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talons05
Mar 24, 2003, 3:36 PM
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I have been climbing for almost 7 years now, and I have led up to 5.12 on trad. I just started aid climbing this year, and the hardest route I've done is an A3. I will say this:
Aid climbing is MUCH scarier than sport or trad!!! I have never been so scared in my life as when hanging free in the air on the tiniest piece of gear that I own... Muchos respecto to the guys who are doing A4 and above. I would crap my pants!
A.W.
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passthepitonspete
Mar 25, 2003, 4:46 PM
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Emphatically you "get it", Austin!
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climber1
Mar 25, 2003, 8:38 PM
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I actually know of a person that fancies himself an aid climber. he's climbed some aid routes, but usually bails. he also backed off a 5.5 free climb. . . . .on top rope. :twisted:
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crap
Mar 25, 2003, 8:58 PM
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If aid was "Crap free" they wouldn't let me do it!
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alpinelynx
Mar 25, 2003, 9:51 PM
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I like the clinky sound of the gear myself. climbing windchime.
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