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anotherpoorclimber
Jul 5, 2003, 10:27 PM
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Someone I know has a rope for sale, over ten years old but never used. Is it safe to use a rope like this? I'm trying to get equipment without spending a lot of money.
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meataxe
Jul 5, 2003, 10:31 PM
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If it's that old, I would not use it.
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thatweakguy
Jul 6, 2003, 9:29 AM
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Over here, in the climbing industry we are told 5 years is the lifespan for soft-wearing equipment (Harnesses, tape, rope, slings) and 10 years for hardwear (biners, trad stuff etc.) assuming it has been stored, maintained and used correctly.
In saying that, my ropes don't last 2 years, but the slings on my quickdraws were up to 11 years old (until recently), but in good condition....honest.
Take whatever advice you take, but at the end of the day if you are in doubt, that should answer your question. Otherwise ask 'how much is your own life worth?!'
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apollodorus
Jul 6, 2003, 9:37 AM
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Mammut tested some old, unused ropes they had in their warehouse, and they broke on the first UIAA-type test drop. I don't remember how old they were.
If you are toproping, an old rope is probably fine. For serious leader falls, I would suggest getting a new rope.
As plastic ages, it loses its elasticity. So, an old rope becomes more like a static rope, and also weaker. Use the old rope as a TR rope or haul line or fixed line. Get a new rope for leading on.
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redpoint73
Jul 6, 2003, 10:50 AM
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Why would you spend money on something that old? Especially climbig gear. That person should just throw the rope away if he has had it that long and not used it.
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pico23
Jul 6, 2003, 3:38 PM
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In reply to: Someone I know has a rope for sale, over ten years old but never used. Is it safe to use a rope like this? I'm trying to get equipment without spending a lot of money.
This almost seems like a troll. If I had a rope sitting around for 10 years and it hadn't been used, I'd probably give it away. Besides this person more then likely doesn't climb much, how can you trust how the ropes been stored.
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jt512
Jul 6, 2003, 8:11 PM
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In reply to: Someone I know has a rope for sale, over ten years old but never used. Is it safe to use a rope like this? I'm trying to get equipment without spending a lot of money.
TR only. Ropes lose elasticity with age, even if unused.
-Jay
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alpnclmbr1
Jul 6, 2003, 8:24 PM
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This is old data but still interesting
In reply to: Subject: Rope Life--Some Data From: Chris Harmston
Newsgroups: rec.climbing
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 14:00:41 -0700
Here is some test data from an investigation I conducted last summer.
Ropes were provided by a customer who was asking similar questions as you all are.
All ropes were used slightly. I conducted a pull test on a loop of rope
with an overhand followthrough knot (used this knot to minimize knot
tightening and test machine travel). I did not conduct drop tests because
we do not have this capability at this time.
1) 1986 Chouinard 8.8 mm. 3240 lbf @ knot. (this is a half rope)
2) 1986 Chouinard 11 mm. 5944 lbf @ knot.
3) 25 year old 11 mm Edelrid. 5141 lbf @ knot.
Conclusions. Don't know how strong these ropes were when new. Single strand strength of these ropes is conservatively half the loop strength (big assumption on my part). I would say this is pretty good overall. I do not know what the dynamic properties of these ropes were nor do I know how time affects the dynamic properties. My recommendation to the customer was to not take any chances with the ropes in lead climbing. I would use them for top roping without any reservations.
Data from a test I conducted on 12/22/98 (research into Dan Osman's failed rope--to be published later so don't ask questions about this right now please). Loop, knot was a quad followthrough figure 8 (I have a newmachine now and can test with longer travel).
All ropes are BD ropes. New condition 1997 ropes.
1) 11 mm. 6643 lbf @ knot.
2) 11 mm. 6803 lbf @ knot.
3) 10 mm. 4596 lbf @ knot.
4) 10 mm. 4765 lbf @ knot.
5) 10 mm. 4952 lbf @ knot.
Conclusions: very strong.
My Conclusions and Recommendations. Rope strength does not appear to decrease with time. I don't trust old ropes because I do not know how theelastic properties change with time. This needs further research. Chris.
Chris Harmston
Quality Assurance Manager/Materials Engineer BS. ME.
Black Diamond Equipment Ltd. |
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cjcalls
Jul 7, 2003, 12:14 AM
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In reply to: Someone I know has a rope for sale, over ten years old but never used. Is it safe to use a rope like this? I'm trying to get equipment without spending a lot of money.
Hey I've got a rope I'll sell you that is only months old. Its only been used a few times. Of course I took several BIG wipers on it with the rope running over a edge. But it should still be fine for toproping...as long as the frayed sheath doesn't hang on anything.
Let you have it real cheap.
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anotherpoorclimber
Jul 9, 2003, 2:35 PM
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Wow... the jury is back, and we have a verdict! Thank you everyone! Guess I'll be shelling out for a new rope.
Mmmm, another month of ramen and PB&J....
I'm going to pass this on to the guy with the rope as well - he hasn't climbed for years, and had no idea about the safety of it - hence my question.
So, to make slings out of this thing... cut it up and join the pieces with a figure-8 knot? :)
-apc
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mreardon
Jul 9, 2003, 4:25 PM
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I don't bother with tests. But from experience, it seems that 7 years is a lucky number to finally lose the ropes sitting on the shelf that I use for leading (if they last even that long, usually I'm only good for 1-2 years for a good lead rope). Everything else is a toprope or turned into a rug :D
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allan_thomson
Jul 15, 2003, 10:11 PM
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't it still be used as an abseil rope, to prevent your climbing ropes getting f*cked?
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jcinco
Jul 15, 2003, 10:23 PM
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you know the old saying:
"If you can't see core,
then use it some more."
Just kidding.
Just buy a new rope. You can get a good 60m rope on the web for $80.
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watersprite
Jul 15, 2003, 10:31 PM
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aw, Michael - do you make rugs out of used ropes? That is so cute...
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climbsomething
Jul 15, 2003, 11:09 PM
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In reply to: Wow... the jury is back, and we have a verdict! Thank you everyone! Guess I'll be shelling out for a new rope.
heh, you read the jt512-alpnclimber1 magnum opus on old ropes, eh? ;)
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tenn_dawg
Jul 15, 2003, 11:22 PM
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Isin't there another thread running now on this same premise? Or am I imagining things. I could swear I just read through Pages and pages of bantering over some old studies, and opinions.
Travis
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flynnypek
Jul 16, 2003, 7:32 PM
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I wouldn't use it... :roll:
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tahquitztwo
Jul 16, 2003, 7:42 PM
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I wouldn't use it either. :shock: .....tell the guy he's got the makings for a great entry mat(rug) :? .....but not for climbing. And as someone else said, you can't be sure where and how it was stored....heat, sitting on concrete floors, etc. will erode and destroy a rope's ability to functiont the way it was intended for climbing use (even toproping).
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SlowTurtle
Oct 22, 2007, 7:27 PM
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this must be hard to buy used products anyone can simply give you a false estimate of use. In this case brand new ropes from the store knowing they are usually fresh would be ideal
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reg
Oct 22, 2007, 7:33 PM
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[quote "jcinco"]you know the old saying:
You can get a good 60m rope on the web for $80.[/quote]
where?
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epoch
Moderator
Oct 22, 2007, 7:48 PM
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Sorry all, couldn't resist.
Good use on the search function. However, it is tacky to reply with what you would hope to be useful informaiton or a comment pertaining to a post that is older than, say, 12 months.
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knudenoggin
Oct 27, 2007, 4:13 AM
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[quote "apollodorus"]Mammut tested some old, unused ropes they had in their warehouse, and they broke on the first UIAA-type test drop. I don't remember how old they were.
If you are toproping, an old rope is probably fine. For serious leader falls, I would suggest getting a new rope.[/quote]
I concur in your recommendation,
but find the assertion re Mammut baseless: the UIAA's Pitt Schubert made a
quite contrary assertion (and I think it was even regarding USED ropes),
saying that his investigation into aged ropes found that ALL of them he tested
--some even 25yrs old or older--survived at least one UIAA fall.
(By which I don't know if that is "passed" in terms of impact force limit,
or just didn't break.) That 25yrs I think is figured from circa 2000, so ca.
1975, at which time ropes were only holding 3 falls or so, new?
Mammut seems intimately connected with UIAA (e.g., it was seemingly mostly
M's testing that led to UIAA's infamous rope-markers-are-bad notice),
so I think it's up to them to resolve this conflict of assertions, if indeed
they are even who makes it about the breakage.
--kN*
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stymingersfink
Oct 27, 2007, 5:46 PM
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epoch wrote: Sorry all, couldn't resist. Good use on the search function. However, it is tacky to reply with what you would hope to be useful informaiton or a comment pertaining to a post that is older than, say, 12 months.
I think sometimes it depends on the thread topic, really. Some of the old threads are quite a hoot to see echoed to the front page again . This one probably didn't need to be there again, but I guess it's better than seeing an entirely new thread devoted to such an old worn out topic.
I'll second the commendation on using the search function though.
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