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treyr
Jan 5, 2002, 8:47 PM
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I like an ATC cuz it is simple.
Sorry Mick if this has been posted before but did not see it on search
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airscape
Jan 5, 2002, 9:26 PM
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I love my grigri, I know lots of ppl have issues with it, But on a lead, there is no better device, I can pay slack 10 times faster with a grigri, then with any other divice, so my partner does not get pulled of when he is in a hurry and needs slack fast.
And it doesn't twist the rope.
I would not use it for rappeling though.
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treyr
Jan 5, 2002, 10:35 PM
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Yeah it is good but it is expensive
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missedyno
Jan 7, 2002, 2:41 AM
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i like my new (xmas present) of the SDG...
it's "like" an atc in that it's the same set up. but there are notches on the sides for wide, and for narrow ropes. so being lighter than most people i belay, it's easier to lock the rope in without the lock up of a gri gri. i was dissapointed when it was given to me at first because i asked santa for an atc. but i just used it on a week-long trip and i love it. you can even wrap the rope around the stem of the device to give a single rope more friction.
i don't like it to rappel with though, give me my trusty figure 8 for that! mmm.... speeeeed....
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jumaringjeff
Jan 7, 2002, 2:58 AM
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I'm currently using a reverso. Quite smooth, but the auto-locking feature sucks. Also, it offers a little bit TOO much friction on 10mm dbl rope. Nice smooth raps. It makes a lot of noise on my rack too (BIG plus in my book).
Best of all, it looks pretty damn cool.
Happy jumaring,
jj
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whoistheman
Jan 7, 2002, 3:39 AM
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I like ATC's, but have been using the Reverso for months now and will continue to use it. IMO, the self locking feature for bringing up a second on a multi-pitch route is better than using a ATC, or a munter hitch because it auto-locks and can be released (usually without building a block and tackle suggested here: http://www.usmga.net/gear/reverso.htm and here:
http://www.usmga.net/guidelines/guidelinesreverso.htm
)by pulling on the free (non-anchor) locking 'biner for seconds on low angle slabs, or attaching a sling, then redirecting the sling through the belay and stepping in the sling (don't forget to redirect the belay strand through the anchor as well) for a second on a steeper angle route.
I will never again use (or allow a belayer to use, for belaying me) a figure 8 to belay or rappel after reading this: (UNLESS using a DMM belaymaster 'biner.)
http://www.uiaa.ch/journal/20003.pdf
or try:
http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:KaqDKM5q9Ls:www.uiaa.ch/journal/20003.pdf++uiaa+20003.pdf&hl=en
If the above links don't work, I have hosted the PDF file here:
http://cake.xmission.com/20003.pdf
The article discusses several fatal accidents that occurred when a figure 8 was cross-loaded or twisted against the locking 'biner and broke a notch out of the locking cylinder - I strongly suggest reading the article (after downloading Acrobat from Adobe if needed) to get a clearer picture.
[ This Message was edited by: whoistheman on 2002-01-06 20:02 ]
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climbchick
Jan 7, 2002, 3:48 AM
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Those links didn't take me anywhere & I'm very interested in reading whatever it has to say about Figure 8s . . could you maybe just sum it up?? Thanks
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greatgarbanzo
Jan 7, 2002, 3:49 AM
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ATC but if the regular "jack" is about to belay me i hand him my gri-gri...
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whoistheman
Jan 7, 2002, 4:03 AM
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See my updated post above, I will try and copy/paste the relevant text.
Here it is: (Long)
Introduction
For decades climbers have been using
a Figure-of-Eight (Foe) as
standard equipment for abseiling.
Both experts and complete novices
have used this piece of equipment, invariably
attached to their harness or
waist belt by a screwgate karabiner,
without any reported problems. Yes,
there have been many abseiling accidents,
due to an inadequate anchor
point, or the rope getting cut, or abseiling
off the end of the rope, or losing
control of the free end of the rope, etc,
etc. But until five years ago there had
not been any reported failures of the
Figure-of-Eight (FoE) or its attachment
karabiner.
Then in 1995 in England a climber
had a lucky escape whilst abseiling,
when his FoE levered open the gate of
the attachment karabiner but failed to
come free. The following year a student
at an adventure centre was not so lucky,
his FoE levered itself out of the attachment
karabiner, and he fell 40 metres to
his death. Before the ink was dry in reporting
and analysing that accident, an
accident occurred in Germany in 1997,
due to an identical failure mode. This
time the accident occurred whilst belaying
with a FoE. A sport climber fell,
and the sudden pull on the rope caused
the FoE to break out of its attachment,
leaving an opened screwgate karabiner
attached to the belayers harness.
The problem is not really with the
Figure-of-Eight, but with the typical
climbers screwgate karabiner, which is
just not strong enough to withstand the
levering action of a FoE in these abnormal
configurations, and does not prevent
these abnormal configurations
from occurring. But the levering effect
is not restricted to a FoE. More recently,
the same mode of karabiner failure
has occurred due to the levering action
of an energy absorbing system (see
article by Charlet).
-Shaft
[ This Message was edited by: whoistheman on 2002-01-06 20:40 ]
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aulwes
Jan 7, 2002, 5:01 AM
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I like my ATC!! I interested in buying a belay plate. I've seen people use them, but I can't seem to find them in stores.
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mikedano
Jan 9, 2002, 9:29 PM
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I have a HB ATC. It's gold colored and it has a metal ring to connect to the carabiner instead of a flexible wire. I love it. I'm not so keen on the BD ATCs because I've seen ones where the rubber coating has rubbed off the connecting ring, exposing the wire. I'm not so sure it's good to have the rope run past the exposed wire (which can break and leave a sharp end hanging out)
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buckjeep
Jan 9, 2002, 10:18 PM
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Registered: Nov 14, 2001
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What about the Trango JAWS?
anyone try that?!
I was checking out one of those...
Thinkin of getting one, but how is it on the rope etc. etc.?
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climber_girl
Jan 9, 2002, 10:29 PM
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Registered: Sep 2, 2001
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hey! i have a trango Jaws and love it!! I have used the BD one but just don;t find it comfortable, and kinda small. with my trango, if u REALLY needed to let go of the rope, u could shove it into one of the slots. it looks cool and practically everybody that i climb with uses them! they are GREAT!
Brittany
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daisuke
Jan 10, 2002, 1:11 AM
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the trango jaws work good, it's good to have the teeth there to catch the rope, I was belaying a guy that weighs a lot more than me once and he fell and I lost my footing and we both sailed into the air whereupon my right hand let go of the rope, it caught on the teeth and kept us both suspended.
I personally own a simond cubik, similar to the jaws but yet different, I like it because it has larger openings and it's very easy to pay out slack or take up rope compared to a regular ATC, it does rap rather slowly with twin 10mm ropes though, not so fun... but all in all it's great and I wouldn't change it
D
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bigfish03
Jan 10, 2002, 2:09 AM
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Registered: May 29, 2001
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i also have a hb ATC and like it very much. i was also interested in Trango Jaws, so mabey ill get one and try it out.
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clmbngfiend
Jan 10, 2002, 8:54 PM
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I like the good old ATC myself. Heads up to anybody with the Jaws. I don't know for sure but have heard that the jaws can twist the rope. It can also damage to core of the rope shortening the life of the rope, or so I have heard.
Peace
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amethyst
Jan 11, 2002, 4:52 PM
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Posts: 113
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Okay. I wonder if anyone has any input for me. I am soon going to be leaving the country for awhile which means my climbing partner will be left high and dry. I was thinking of getting him a Silent Partner, they are made by Wren Indusries and are supposed to be the best and safest self belay / solo climbing device - sounds to good to be true? Has anyone ever actually used one? I would appreciate any info BEFORE I shell out $225-00!!!! I know climbing by yourself is never a really good idea, but if you are going to do it you should try and be safe...right?
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pollux
Jan 11, 2002, 6:41 PM
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Registered: Aug 26, 2001
Posts: 106
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ATC, simple and effective. Gear failure isn't a facture (just dumb belayers). I have never heard of a gri gri failing but it can lead to non-atentive belayers.
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rck_climber
Jan 11, 2002, 8:28 PM
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I, too, am with most others here...
ATC is my favorite, it's cheap, simple and works well. It's also easy to show people how to use and I've never had a problem with any of mine.
I do, however, prefer to rap off a Figure 8 because I find the ATC too slow and jerky.
Just my thoughts though.
Mick
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ravens_wing_jim
Jan 12, 2002, 11:41 PM
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Registered: Dec 23, 2001
Posts: 396
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My favorite is my wildcountry variable controller
Also still have my old BD ATC,never had a
problem with it
And I prefur to rap on my BD super 8,
and have belayed with it as well, if you
use the small end, there shouldnt be any
problems.
My belay biner is a big ol DMM autolocker
DAM I LOVE MY GEAR!!!
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krustyklimber
Feb 8, 2002, 10:01 AM
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Registered: Jan 25, 2002
Posts: 1650
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The Gri-Gri is my favorite! It's the only device I'll belay with while sleeping, if I have to be awake and I'm trad climbing and/or I want save weight I like a belay/rappel device, I really like my new SBG by Omega Pacific (looks like I may be the only one who does.) It has a wide and a narrow side and can be rigged a few different ways, each providing more friction, the solid shaft keeps it from jamming while my partner hangs but it is still easy to hold him without slippage. It's only drawback is it doesn't work very well with fat ropes.
Jeff
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pwsk
Feb 8, 2002, 11:53 AM
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Registered: Jan 23, 2002
Posts: 54
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BODY BELAY rocks...although it's starting to wear me down a bit, if you know what I mean!
No, seriously, ATC's the best for me thank you. Stich plates also work very well and as we've discussed before, the Gri-Gri is great(hey, notice the alliteration) if used correctly!
Rock on...
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zlipper
Feb 8, 2002, 1:42 PM
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Registered: Oct 13, 2001
Posts: 383
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i like my terango Jaws best theres sooo much friction space for my rope and its strong
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jsm280
Feb 8, 2002, 4:33 PM
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Registered: Jul 6, 2001
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So far just a standard ATC.... If I was going to buy something I would get the trango jaws... I have used a friends and love it. You can use the jaw side if you need the extra grip, or the normal side for rapping or light people belay....
I also have a reverso and found it is not as smooth for feeding out on lead belay....???? maybe just me.... other than that I love it for multi pitch stuff..... belay from the ancor... don't care so much for the auto locking feature.
Gri Gri is #1 if I am belaying someone who is working a route and will be hanging around.
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climber1
Feb 12, 2002, 8:27 PM
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although I use an ATC, I still prefer a figure 8.
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