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nathanial4
Feb 19, 2004, 5:10 AM
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I am looking for a rope that will be used for both Top Roping and some Rappeling. There are so many choices it get fairly confusing.
All opinions are welcome....
Thanks in advance for you help.
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vincent
Feb 19, 2004, 7:20 PM
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hey nathaniel i'm sure you've seen the cheap Edelweiss ropes at gearexpress.com. i've gotten one there and it's perfect for toproping, rappelling, and towing my friends car when it craps out J/k. unless you're some hardman sport climber who needs a real light rope to help with redpoints or a serious big wall climber who needs a heavy duty rope why not just go with an average rope. don't spend more money than you need to. unless you're real particular about stretch and all that physics crap just go with a rope you can throw around and get dirty and not have to feel like you need to worry over an expensive investment...
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sfclimber
Feb 20, 2004, 1:51 AM
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Given your proposed usage I would say:
- Go with a 10.5mm rope. They withstand more abuse than thinner ropes due to their thicker sheath. Top roping typically causes a lot of wear. If the rope eventually ends up being used for multi pitch or big wall climbing it will still be suitable.
- Go with a 60m rope. Though you will likely rarely use the extra 10m over the typical 50m rope, that extra 10m may be the difference between being able to toprope the route or having to borrow someone else's rope. If the rope will likely eventually get used for multi pitch, then the opposite is true; go with the 50m rope since very few pitches exceed 50m and you just end up pulling up an extra 10m of slack on every pitch! Some will argue that the 60m allows you to link pitches in multi pitch and is thus better suited, but this varies by area and is usually pretty rare. Still not worth taking in the extra 10m of slack pitch after pitch.
- Go with a non dry rope. Dry ropes are meant for preserving the rope elasticity in the rain. Multi pitch climbers sometimes must continue climbing or rappelling in the rain just to get to the top or bottom of the climb before being able to escape. Top rope climbers just lower off and find shelter thus do not need to pay the extra $$$ for dry treatment. Again, if the rope will eventually be used for multi pitch then the opposite is true; go with dry treatment in that case.
- Go with a single pattern rope. Bi-pattern ropes are great, but not worth the expense. Just use an approved marker (e.g. water based marker) or a piece of tape. Most toproping situations are less than a half rope length anyway and you can easily estimate how much rope to throw.
- Go with a rope that has 'good hand'. One that feels smooth, does not kink or coil.
My first top roping rope was a New England Ropes (now Maxim) G60. Worked great for years.
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nathanial4
Feb 20, 2004, 3:37 AM
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Thanks for the advice. I looked at some of the ropes on gearexpress.com and there are several that look good. I saw some on ebay that seemed like a pretty good deal for a 10.5mm 60m rope with low elasticity <8%
Thanks again.
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isaidwhat
Feb 22, 2004, 5:02 AM
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Be careful of ebay gear. Make sure you are buying un-used gear with the factory tags still on them.
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hikerken
Feb 24, 2004, 5:36 AM
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Now, just to show that there are many different answers, here is a totally different one: Use a static rope.
Until very recently, this was considered a huge error, but it is increasingly recognized that a dynamic rope is not the safest option for toproping: the most dangerous part of the climb is the first 10 feet or so, because if a person falls there on a dynamic rope, they are highly likely to hit the ground, and there is nothing the belayer is able to do, because the rope will stretch! A static line will not nearly as much.
Before anyone goes apeshit, it is worth mentioning that most ropes sold for gym toproping are static, not dynamic.
As for durability, I'd imagine that a static is probably good for ten times the wear of a dynamic in this application.
You would NEVER lead climb on your static line, but that is not what you have said you wanted it for.
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usaclimbing
Feb 24, 2004, 7:02 AM
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umm... slight correction on that on... most ropes sold for gym use are a hybrid rope. (i.e.-sterling tarzan). They are a combination of static and dynamic... thus they still strech some (I mean statics stretch too but not very much), but they dont stretch nearly as much as a dynamic line. These wouldn't be the easiest ropes to come by either. I mean not that hard, but most places aren't going to carry a spol of them so you would probably have to contact the company direct (if any will even sell to you that way) or get the store to special order (and who knows what the smallest spol sold is). I would go with a dynamic 10.5 rope (or about that) I wouldn't EVER buy anything larger and if mostly what you will be doing in top roping I wouldnt go much smaller. I'm pretty partial to sterling... you'll never kill marathon. mammuts are over priced... blue water isn't very good, and i dont know much about the other campanies.
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space_monkey
Feb 24, 2004, 7:21 AM
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I would just go down to the local marina and buy myself a blue and white twist boat rope for half the price!!! NOW thats what I'm talking about.
J/K couldnt help myself! It reminded me of when I seen two teenage boys at a local crag with one.
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goodwill
Feb 24, 2004, 7:52 AM
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I'll second most of the stuff that sfclimber said. Go with a 10.5mm, 60m rope, and try to get one with a good feel (along these lines, dry ropes are usually better than non-dry though.)
Having said that, I strongly recommend the inexpensive Edelweiss ropes that vincent mentioned. I just got an Edelweiss Anniversary rope a few months ago, and it's been great so far. After reading a lot of reviews, I decided that Mammut and Edelweiss were probably the two highest reputed rope manufacturers out there. And the great thing about some of the Edelweiss ropes that are available now is that they are dry ropes, but they're being sold as cheap as a lot of non-dry ropes. Given the choice, you might as well go with a dry one.
Will
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markc
Feb 24, 2004, 9:04 PM
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In reply to: blue water isn't very good, and i dont know much about the other campanies.
Please support your position rather than make a blanket statement. The two Blue Water ropes I've owned have handled very well, have held up well, and have a mid-range price. I personally haven't had a problem with them. What problems have led to your conclusion?
As far as rappelling and top-roping, a 10.5 or 11 mm will take the most abuse. Fat ropes are out of vogue right now, but fine for the OP's intended purpose. As others have said, a 10.5 may be a better all-arounder.
I have three ropes for different purposes. A 11 mm x50 m I bought when I started climbing (primarily TR and some sport), a 10 mm x 60 m I bought as I progressed in sport, and a 10.5 mm x 60 m for multipitch trad climbing when I wanted the increased length and durability. Owning more than one rope isn't a bad thing.
mark
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tweek
Feb 24, 2004, 9:40 PM
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I too have owned two blue water ropes and for falling there is nothing better. For top roping the sterling marathon is durable but for leading I would take the blue water (less impact force and my body can tell the difference).
For 99 bucks for a 50m rope it is hard to go wrong (see gear express). I would still go with a 60m for an extra 20. Go with gearexpress rather than amazon, they know whats up. Some of the other people who advertise here are good too.
10.5, I agree with everyone who said that.
If money is not as much of an option go with a bi color rope because it makes life so easy. Dry is not worth it because most dry treatment come off after a while and it sounds like you are not going to be doing long multipitch routes when the weather is nasty for the next year or two at which point you will probably buy a second rope regardless.
Static rope has two flaws 1) You can never ever ever lead on it 2) it puts more force on the anchor and climber so it hurts more and increases the chance that something might blow (see other threads on this web site for a complete flame war covering this topic).
As for falling in the first 10' of the climb and decking, keep a tight belay and its not like a free fall its just hitting the ground and I would say first 5' at most. Use a spotter ifyou are worried about it. This in not a major concern of mine while toproping.
Happy spending
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utahwiregate
Feb 24, 2004, 9:42 PM
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In reply to: blue water isn't very good, and i dont know much about the other campanies.
I'd have to second MarkC, I've climbed on bluewater for a couple of years (TR and Lead) and have really really enjoyed the way they have handled--low sheath slippage, great feel, etc.
What's wrong, IYO, with Bluewater?
-Gate
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pornstarr
Feb 24, 2004, 9:50 PM
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nice rope.
mammut4Lyfe
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lstockett
Feb 24, 2004, 10:50 PM
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In reply to: I am looking for a rope that will be used for both Top Roping and some Rappeling. There are so many choices it get fairly confusing. All opinions are welcome.... Thanks in advance for you help.
There are indeed lots of choices and it does seem confusing. Don't sweat it though. All climbing ropes conform to a strict set of standards, so it's hard to go too far wrong.
Starting off with an inexpensive 10.5 MM is probably your best bet. If you can affort it, go ahead and get a 60 meter rope rather than a 50. You'll end up wanting one if you ever start trad climbing.
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hikerken
Feb 29, 2004, 2:59 AM
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some have posted that the reason to get a dynamic rope is so that if you eventually want to lead climb on it, you can.
BAD idea!
Understanding that most of the safety information comes from the UIAA, at their conference on nylon and ropes for 2002,
http://www.uiaa.ch/article.aspx?a=76&c=1
they addressed this issue:
6. Safety Loss of Mountaineering Ropes by Lowering Cycles in Toprope Climbing. This paper details the surprising loss of capacity in dynamic mountaineering ropes due to top roping. The translation is not of high quality. A better edited version can be found in www.alpineclubofcanada.ca/services/safety/index.html.
The paper is highly technical, but the summary says it all:
Summary
The drop tests carried out on mountaineering ropes, which were aged in lowering procedures (toprope climbing), have shown that with an increasing number of lowering cycles the number of drops without breaking strongly decreases. Rope sections, which were bent in the figure eight descender or in the Munter hitch, for only 80 lowering cycles have only about half, or less than half, of the capacity of a new rope left. This safety loss occurs customarily after a few days of top rope climbing. By superimposing other factors of rope degradation upon those caused by the bending in the belay devices and the top carabiner, one can expect a further decrease in the number of drops held without breaking. The safety loss is of no consequence for a rope used solely as a toprope because fall factors are small but is critical for lead climbing, when larger fall heights are possible.
They further say:
The logical conclusion to this presentation is the use of a heavy sheath (top) rope for toproping. If the pitch has to be led to the toprope anchor, then a sport rope should be used for the lead and a different (top) rope for the lowering and subsequent toproping.
-----
So, you might want to actually use information and data from the experts, rather than take people's word for what is safe and reasonable.
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cliffhanger9
Moderator
Feb 29, 2004, 3:48 PM
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check out the gear reviews section of the site to research different ropes, see what other ropes users have rated the highest, and read their reviews!!
http://www.rockclimbing.com/shopping/index.php?c=23
good lucky and rock on!! :mrgreen:
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