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trguy
Mar 13, 2004, 10:18 PM
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A general question. When you tell someone you climb 5.11c what does that mean to you? Does it mean that after several weeks of “projecting” you were able to get to TR that 11c with no falls – your most difficult grade to date. Or that you typically can on-sight lead 11c (the other extreme).
Just curious what the general thought was. I see posts with individuals touting grades and wonder what they actually mean when they say them. For what it’s worth, I think the grade you climb is the highest grade you typically can on-sight lead. (no offense to you TR guys/gals) Thoughts?
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superfox
Mar 13, 2004, 11:09 PM
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I think that the way it goes is that if someone says "I have climbed 5.12", it means that they have projected and led a 5.12. If someone says "I climb 5.12", it means that they can consistently climb 5.12s, but I may be wrong.
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fracture
Mar 13, 2004, 11:15 PM
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Redpoint.
Otherwise there are no 5.14 climbers, which wouldn't make sense.
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smithclimber
Mar 14, 2004, 12:30 AM
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In reply to: If someone says "I have climbed 5.12", it means that they have projected and led a 5.12. If someone says "I climb 5.12", it means that they can consistently climb 5.12s.
My thoughts exactly.
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drrock
Mar 14, 2004, 12:45 AM
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ipsofacto
Mar 14, 2004, 12:51 AM
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In reply to: There is a difference between "I have climbed 5.11" and "I am a 5.11 climber", defintely. Being a "5.11 climber" means you can climb 5.11 anywhere and in any conditions.
Are you the final authority on this matter, or can I exercise some autonomy by saying you don't know s--t from rice krispies.
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ipsofacto
Mar 14, 2004, 1:04 AM
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23456789
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oudinardin
Mar 14, 2004, 1:22 AM
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Just a side note. Time machine should be up and running again soon. So anytime could be anytime. Or anywhere. I'm only off by a year or so now. I'll keep all of you posted. Oud
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drkodos
Mar 14, 2004, 1:24 AM
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The grade I say I climb at is the grade I don't need to use gear or a rope.
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chossmonkey
Mar 14, 2004, 1:36 AM
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There are different qualifications. A 5.11 sport climber consitently redpoints 5.11's. A 5.11 trad climber consitently onsights 5.11. A 5.11 rockclimber climbs 5.11 and has fun doing so whether they are getting spanked or onsighting, gear or sport routes.
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hosh
Mar 14, 2004, 1:53 AM
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It depends on who I'm talking to and why. If I'm talking to someone that I'm trying to get to mentor me, I'l tell them that I climb 5.9, pushing 5.10 because that's where I'm most comfortable. I can climb just about any 5.9 I've even been on and I can usually on-sight 5.10's or get them with a little work. If I'm talking to someone who's a prospective partner, I'd tell them I'm a 5.11 climber because I can usually work out a 5.11 and I'm pushing 5.12 right now. Sport lead, I'm comfortable up to about 5.10 and Trad lead, well, I don't konw what my comfort level is. I've climber up to about a 5.9 on lead and it didn't sketch me out but there's not anything harder in this area that I know of so I can't push my limits in that area. I usually say that I'm a 5.10 climber though. (My ego would like to say 5.12!) :wink:
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mreardon
Mar 15, 2004, 12:28 AM
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WARNING - SPRAY ALERT: Personally I believe it's the level of consistent onsighting ability at any style. Example: I'm climbed 5.12 trad, 5.13 sport, and V10+ bouldering. I've worked harder routes at all three and soloed near to my hardest levels. HOWEVER, my onsight ability in all three is 5.11-5.12a. So when people ask what level I climb at, I always tell them 5.11ish. I rarely fall on anything 5.10 and under but it does happen. More often than I wish some days :D
I remember Jason Campbell after onsighting Moonlight Buttress (mutli-pitch 5.13 trad) and doing more than 20 5.14s still stating that he's only a 5.12 climber.
Others have different rules. :D
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curt
Mar 15, 2004, 12:43 AM
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In reply to: WARNING - SPRAY ALERT: Personally I believe it's the level of consistent onsighting ability at any style. Example: I'm climbed 5.12 trad, 5.13 sport, and V10+ bouldering. I've worked harder routes at all three and soloed near to my hardest levels. HOWEVER, my onsight ability in all three is 5.11-5.12a. So when people ask what level I climb at, I always tell them 5.11ish. I rarely fall on anything 5.10 and under but it does happen. More often than I wish some days :D
Careful Mike - have fixedpin, aaxxx and hikerken approved this post? Hahahahahahaha.
Curt
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mreardon
Mar 15, 2004, 12:58 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: WARNING - SPRAY ALERT: Personally I believe it's the level of consistent onsighting ability at any style. Example: I'm climbed 5.12 trad, 5.13 sport, and V10+ bouldering. I've worked harder routes at all three and soloed near to my hardest levels. HOWEVER, my onsight ability in all three is 5.11-5.12a. So when people ask what level I climb at, I always tell them 5.11ish. I rarely fall on anything 5.10 and under but it does happen. More often than I wish some days :D Careful Mike - have fixedpin, aaxxx and hikerken approved this post? Hahahahahahaha. Curt
Just call me spraylord!
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barefeetnochalk
Mar 15, 2004, 2:15 AM
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hahaha, you mofo's take this sh*t way too serious.
When someone asks me what grade i climb (which aint often) i tell them the highest grade that i can lead clean (ie: no hang doggin') and the highest grade i can boulder. Some would call it "talkin it up" but i like it that way.
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deleted
Deleted
Mar 15, 2004, 2:30 AM
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[quote:3a5733afa3="oudinardin"]Just a side note. Time machine should be up and running again soon. So anytime [i:3a5733afa3]could[/i:3a5733afa3] be anytime. Or anywhere. I'm only off by a year or so now. I'll keep all of you posted. Oud[/quote:3a5733afa3]
can we vote for dumbest post of the year already, or is that in november?
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drrock
Mar 15, 2004, 2:45 AM
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savedbymynuts
Mar 17, 2004, 7:03 AM
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I asked my self the same question. this is my conclusion.
the way I see it is quite simple... most climbers agree that Chris Sharma is a 5.15 climber after he climbed Realisation. He did not onsight it he had to work hard to redpoint it. If someone asked a runner how fast he can run he will not give you his average but the top speed he attained. Not while going up hill against the wind on a bad day but his best.
I guess I was concerned with looking as one that couldn’t walk the talk.
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overlord
Mar 17, 2004, 11:50 AM
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if i say that i CAN climb a level, it means i can get a RP within a few tries, maybe flash it if im lucky.
if i say i have climbed the grade, it emans i have done some routes of the grade with more projecting.
and non of the above are applicable for TR.
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el_trevor
Mar 17, 2004, 2:28 PM
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does the grade someone climbs at really matter?
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crazygirl
Mar 17, 2004, 2:39 PM
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when someone asks you how hard do you climb, are you all limited to one word response? there is no possiblity if explaining further, for ex:
'i've climbed a few 5.12's, but i lead 5.11c on sport and 5.11a on trad"
no, i guess, thats not an option.
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markc
Mar 17, 2004, 3:35 PM
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In reply to: does the grade someone climbs at really matter?
It could if someone misrepresents their abilities and gets in over their head. There are situations where biting off more than you can chew could mean quite a bit more than lowering off.
Usually, it's just irritating to hear someone spray how hard they climb, only to watch them flail on a route that's significantly easier than the numbers they were throwing around. Wait, I meant funny. Definitely funny.
I generally give the multi-layered response other folks referred to: x trad, y sport, z goofing off on TR. I don't inflate, because I'm comfortable not being a great climber.
mark
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yanqui
Mar 17, 2004, 3:49 PM
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still can't figure out these damn insert buttons
mreardon wrote:
I remember Jason Campbell after onsighting Moonlight Buttress (mutli-pitch 5.13 trad) and doing more than 20 5.14s still stating that he's only a 5.12 climber.
oops ... actually the hardest pitches on moonlight buttress include something like 4 low-level 5.12 pitches and a crux pitch that is fairly consensus 12d, although some say 13a when led without preplaced gear (most of the early repeats involved some preplacing). I only know this because my ex-roomate did one of the early repeats. Maybe this is what Jason Cambell meant when he said that he's a 5.12 climber? Or maybe this has something to do with that other post about how the grades out west are going soft with respect to the east?
Anyways, you gotta respect JC's humble self-analysis. And I was all ready to pound my chest and say I'm a 5.11 climber. Maybe I'm only a 5.10 climber after all. I guess that's OK, though. When I started climbing, way back in the stone age, 5.10 climbers seemed like gods to me. And now, there I am.
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abalch
Mar 17, 2004, 4:45 PM
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In reply to: It depends on who I'm talking to and why. If I'm talking to someone that I'm trying to get to mentor me, I'l tell them that I climb 5.9, pushing 5.10 because that's where I'm most comfortable. I can climb just about any 5.9 I've even been on and I can usually on-sight 5.10's or get them with a little work. If I'm talking to someone who's a prospective partner, I'd tell them I'm a 5.11 climber because I can usually work out a 5.11 and I'm pushing 5.12 right now. Sport lead, I'm comfortable up to about 5.10 and Trad lead, well, I don't konw what my comfort level is. I've climber up to about a 5.9 on lead and it didn't sketch me out but there's not anything harder in this area that I know of so I can't push my limits in that area. I usually say that I'm a 5.10 climber though. (My ego would like to say 5.12!) :wink:
And do you explain your climbing level to people like you did here? If you just tell a prospective partner that you are a 5.11 climber without explaining how you did here that you call yourself that because you usually can work out a climb of that level, you might be leading this prospective partner to feel that you are better than you are, and if they are inflating their rating as well, you two could be in a world of hurt. I more often talk down my rating, so when I climb better, I surprise myself and others, but I don't lead a prospective partner to trust in my climbing level to lead a pitch that he is unable to, and he thinks I can.
Ususally, when I speak to prospective climbers around the area, I will just tell them some of the climbs in that area that I have climbed, and explain to them how comfortable I am in each type of climbing that might be encountered that day.
The only time I worry about ratings is when it comes to the safety of me or my climbing partner. Most of the time, unless I am speaking to a partner, I just say, "I climb rock"
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roc-dude
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Mar 17, 2004, 4:54 PM
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Ok here is a twist on this. What about a person who does not lead. Example; My girlfriend. She can second anything I can lead and can toprope onsite harder routes. She has been able to onsite toprope most of the mid 11's I have put her on. What level does she climb? One more twist. She does mid 11's on vertical or slab but on overhang she struggles on 9's, What level does she climb?
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