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asandh
Mar 31, 2004, 5:03 PM
Post #26 of 42
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:)
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j_ung
Mar 31, 2004, 5:12 PM
Post #27 of 42
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Does this sum things up adequately?
You had a good time in the rain while retrieving your stranded gear. Then, other people made fun of you.
If this is correct, then it sounds like they have problems, not you. :wink:
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hyhuu
Mar 31, 2004, 10:06 PM
Post #28 of 42
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In reply to: I'm always against aiding any route meant to be freed if it is at all possible ... however, I respect and totally relate to the " my gear is stuck up there and I gotta get it down somehow :evil:" scenario. Sounds to me like you did right. Just don't let your bro get stuck again like that... obviously its not good for either of your images. 8)
Yet people keep aiding the Nose and Moonlight Butress. Seriously, all routes are meant to be freed eventually, now whether if it gets done is another different story. It's all relative to one's ability at the time of climbing, which leads back to the point of the story.
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climbjs
Mar 31, 2004, 10:43 PM
Post #29 of 42
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In reply to: Aiding in a pinch is not only fun but it good practice for rescue/problem situation type stuff. I say have at it! |
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johnnywel
Mar 31, 2004, 10:44 PM
Post #30 of 42
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This is in reference to the comment that you shouldn't aid a free line because someone may arrive later and want to climb it free. I have always understood that the first party to the climb has the right of way. Maybe it's just me but when I show up to a climb and someone is on it, I have the choice to do something else or wait. If the party ahead of you is slow, tough! It is up to you to leave or work it out with the party to pass. That's my two cents.
Pounding pins or placing bolts on an existing route is of course a different story, which didn't seem to be the case on the mentioned 5.9 crack. Also, if you you are planning to aid a free route it is often courteous to pick a less crowded line. Courtesy goes a long way in climbing.
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danl
Mar 31, 2004, 10:53 PM
Post #31 of 42
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The real question is why were you climbing at bellefonte in the rain?
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bouldertom
Mar 31, 2004, 11:16 PM
Post #32 of 42
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The weather report lied. And yes, it's pathetic that I can't trad lead EL Crack yet.
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bouldertom
Apr 1, 2004, 1:46 AM
Post #34 of 42
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Actually they did give me a ride there. My post wasn't so much about gaining my friends approval, rather whether it was illogical for me to aid the rest of the climb rather than just give up. Ok, I promise to stop caring about how others feel about my climbing starting now.
(Although if I started indiscriminantly bolting things or ruining climbs, I would hope one of my friends would kick my ass or something)
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coylec
Apr 1, 2004, 2:43 AM
Post #35 of 42
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Nice jab. Let me rephrase: who cares what style you do it in? I'm happy to be climbing anything.
when you start bolting, that's a whole new ballgame. when you start littering, that's when someone beats you with a #5 tri-cam.
coylec
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bouldertom
Apr 1, 2004, 3:05 AM
Post #36 of 42
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Sorry coylec, I wasn't trying to make a jab at anyone. All I meant was that I personally don't have the experience to even look at a drill and I'm no where near trying difficult aid. I'm not making any comments on trad vs aid vs sport because they all have their merits.
And I make a point to carry out more than I carry in. I hate it when people throw beer bottles down to the bottom of the crags that I climb at.
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rgold
Apr 1, 2004, 4:19 AM
Post #37 of 42
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As long as you neither damage nor modify the route, what you do up there is nobody's business. Free ascents involving lots of falls and/or hangs can use as much aid and take a lot more time than an aid ascent.
Deliberate practice aiding of a popular free route when there are crowds waiting to do it is inconsiderate, but in bad weather or a low population day, etiquette is not an issue. On the other hand, if you are trying to get off the route, you are not obliged to abandon gear just to shorten the wait of someone who showed up later.
By the way, sometimes it makes sense to combine aiding and bailing by aiding down a pitch rather than abandoning gear at the high point.
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coylec
Apr 1, 2004, 4:30 AM
Post #38 of 42
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bouldertom - i'm not trying to start stuff, just joking around. and thank you so much for helping keep our climbing grounds clean. if i ever meet you, i'll buy a drink of choice for your efforts.
rgold, as always, provides a well-written explanation of what I was trying to say. rock on!
coylec
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apollodorus
Apr 1, 2004, 4:59 AM
Post #39 of 42
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Aiding a free line gives you beta, so that you can't "flash" it later. Oh, no, not that.
But, many times the descent off a route is a walk-off, and getting up at all costs is safer than rapping.
If your goal is to free the line, don't aid up it first. Part of flashing a route is not knowing what is up there, or where that crucial rest is. Come back later, and achieve your goal.
If your goal is to just climb the route and adverse conditions (even wimping out) prevail, go ahead and aid it if you want. There is no glory, but no ignomy, in doing a route that way. Just because other people have freed a line doesn't mean that you need to. In this day of clean pro, aiding doesn't scar the rock or leave a bad scene for others. The only downside is what people might say about you, which is irrelevant for the most part.
If your life is threatened by a storm that moves in, and getting up is your way to safety, pull on gear like crazy and get up. And then haul on the rope to bring your belayer up as fast as possible.
If you are aid-curious, and want to hang on gear (using any manner of excuses), you should just do it. Climbing isn't like inventing: it's one percent perspiration and 99% inspiration. If your inspiration is to aid up, then go for it that way.
The only caveat is that you probably shouldn't aid up popular free climbs because the traffic jam that forms up solid behind you will start throwing rocks.
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the_antoon
Apr 1, 2004, 5:18 AM
Post #40 of 42
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Registered: Dec 21, 2003
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yes
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apieceinbozeman
Apr 1, 2004, 5:44 AM
Post #41 of 42
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Registered: Apr 1, 2004
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Fuck that shit! When I was in my climbing prime about 30 years ago, we were scared shitless so much that there were only two grades: LIVE OR DIE! What do you think of that, huh?
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epic_ed
Apr 1, 2004, 5:51 AM
Post #42 of 42
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Registered: Jun 17, 2002
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I think that's funny. Those are the same rules in Russian Roullette.
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