|
sujones65
Jun 1, 2004, 6:12 PM
Post #6576 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 5, 2004
Posts: 228
|
In reply to: Do we really need to blow sunshine up each other's behinds if there is a slight possibility of offending someone?
I'll take sunshine blown up me @ss anytime 8^)
|
|
|
|
|
taualum23
Jun 1, 2004, 6:17 PM
Post #6578 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 13, 2002
Posts: 2370
|
In reply to: No only did they remain encouraging and friendly, the were very vocal about not rushing myself, they gave good and honest critiques of my placements, and most importantly they have done it 3 times between them. They know damn well I'm not the speediest leader and they can both DAMN sure climb harder than 5.4 in their sleep, but they keep encouraging me to tie in. Maybe you just needed to meet the right bunch of climbers. I suspect now you have.
Agreed. Those guys were there for my first full-on trad lead, (wohoo, 5.3 slab-crack baby!) ANd besides one comment about them watching an aid lead (TD??) everone was very courteous. Lets all get out and lead easy stuff sometime. I look forward to it.
Josh
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Jun 1, 2004, 6:22 PM
Post #6579 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
In reply to: And they say there's no commitment in sport climbing!
Jake
ps my first trad lead was on TD's rack and foo belaying :)
|
|
|
|
|
robbovius
Jun 1, 2004, 6:34 PM
Post #6580 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 20, 2002
Posts: 8406
|
In reply to: In reply to: ... I also have this little voice in my head that says, "no one's gonna wanna climb with you if you're taking a half hour to lead a 5.5 climb just so they can scoot up it, clean your gear and feel unchallenged" sj65 Sue, I have the same fear but I have to say, so far completely unfounded. In my 3 trad leads to date Jeff and Foo have stood patiently while I took ages to lead 30' 5.4's, one time doing all that fiddling and farting around only to place 3 peices all from the same stance and no others on the whole route. No only did they remain encouraging and friendly, the were very vocal about not rushing myself, they gave good and honest critiques of my placements, and most importantly they have done it 3 times between them. They know damn well I'm not the speediest leader and they can both DAMN sure climb harder than 5.4 in their sleep, but they keep encouraging me to tie in. Maybe you just needed to meet the right bunch of climbers. I suspect now you have.
Su, I second, (or maybe it's 3rd now) Wide's comments. Nobody around here is going to have a problem if you take your time working an easy lead. most here won't even complain about belay-slaving while you take multiple falls on a TR route (not that I would know anyting about that ;-) ) None of us wants to build a karma deficit, y'know? ;-)
if I can work it, I wanna go back to QQ this saturday and repeat that G-wall lead, several times - ummmm...maybe without the test falls - it'll be posted here if I can make it.
|
|
|
|
|
the_pirate
Jun 1, 2004, 6:39 PM
Post #6581 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 20, 2003
Posts: 3984
|
You guys are lucky to have a pool of so many experienced climbers to learn from. Take advantage of this. I can remember many days, going to Crow Hill or Ragged alone and standing at the base with my miniscule rack of stoppers and hexes. Looking at everyone that passed by with big, puppy dog eyes. Pleeease, will someone climb with me?
|
|
|
|
|
robbovius
Jun 1, 2004, 6:44 PM
Post #6582 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 20, 2002
Posts: 8406
|
In reply to: You guys are lucky to have a pool of so many experienced climbers to learn from. Take advantage of this. I can remember many days, going to Crow Hill or Ragged alone and standing at the base with my miniscule rack of stoppers and hexes. Looking at everyone that passed by with big, puppy dog eyes. Pleeease, will someone climb with me?
And nobody would, until he started blowing sunshine up their arses. Ain't nothin' in life fo' free, baby. ;-)
|
|
|
|
|
sujones65
Jun 1, 2004, 6:54 PM
Post #6583 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 5, 2004
Posts: 228
|
ok so here's the big question for all you more experienced trad climbers. Where and what climbs would you suggest for making this leap. Obviously I would prefer a nice clean crack climb, but since these seem hard to come by in these parts what would be your suggestion? I've lead (sans toprope) a 5.4 at Rumney (easy but, you know, not such good rock) a 5.8 on the Precipice at Acadia (hard, not the wisest choice but didn't fall...not ready to do that here by a stretch) and toprope lead (with Kevin) White Knight (at QQ) and feel confident to do it sans TR. Suggestions anyone?
Jake, I also am looking for some good solid technique builders through bouldering. Any suggestions in that arena?
sj65
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Jun 1, 2004, 7:10 PM
Post #6585 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
Hehe ok misconception. jake is a huge guidebook of bouldering areas lol Ive been to lincoln woods 5-6 times.. and pway 5 times tho only climbed 4 times :oops: i boulder at CR but that is all traversing.. most of my bouldering skills were developed at the gym
you can go to lincoln woods but the overhanging stuff is hard.. unlike rumney the overhanging stuff at LW still has crappy little holds and sharp as well or is just plain too hard for your and my level of climbing
HP .. i bet has stuff.. i dont know you'll have to ask derek ive never been there hehe
tips.. work on your pull up strength and straight arm hangs (to build up your strength and power to make the moves)
work on L hangs or leg raises and other core strength exercises(to keep your feet on the rock on overhangs and to be able to get them back on if they cut loose)
technique wise.... i cant say enough about traversing.. college rock is great because you can go from a crack to a sidepull to a tiny crimp to a big ass jug all in 20 feet.
other then that just keep following overhangs or get in the gym and boulder :SHRUG: Summertime is not boulder time.. friction sucks and the 2 main places around here tend to be buggy (LW and pway)
Jake
|
|
|
|
|
robbovius
Jun 1, 2004, 7:22 PM
Post #6586 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 20, 2002
Posts: 8406
|
Sue, the QQ lead I have been mentioning today was one suggested to me by one of the more experienced regulars last winter (forget who exactly, might have been jeremy) the first time I lead it, Foo and TD were there and had already done it once. it's not a stright route, and you lose sight of your belayer after the second overhang, adn when you get up to the top it's very difficult to give and hear commands (so I carry a ciouple of those small "family" walkie-talkies, though I have yet to use them) but to it's advantage there are plenty of nice cracks with large blocks on either side, and many opportunities for solid placements.
overall difficulty is about 5.5-5.6. It's steep and high enough to feel challenging (but not anywhere near terrifying), and fun, with a nice view of the bay from the top.
I also want to go back to purgatory chasm and look at the climbs there. there are a couple that i recall looking like realtively easy leads, though I could be on mars about that. only problem is PC is overrun with families and hikers on the weekends. weekdays are relatively unpopulated there.
*edit*
I agree with Jake, the CR traverse is stout, and long...I haven't the endurance or skill to make it all the way...best I've done is about 45% in one try, and only in one direction.
|
|
|
|
|
cracklover
Jun 1, 2004, 7:27 PM
Post #6587 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10162
|
In reply to: ok so here's the big question for all you more experienced trad climbers. Where and what climbs would you suggest for making this leap. Obviously I would prefer a nice clean crack climb, but since these seem hard to come by in these parts what would be your suggestion?
The obvious choice is to look for slabs with a nice clean crack running from bottom to top. I can think of several in the immediate Boston area:
1 - Any of several at the lower wall at Hammond Pond.
2 - At least one at the Black and White Rocks (Middlesex Fells).
3 - I believe there's one on the practice face at Crow Hill?
Can anyone add to this list?
The second choice is steep climbs with lots of good stances from which to place gear. This is one area in which the Gunks truly excels - there are literally perhaps two dozen climbs there that fit the bill. But there are also several in the immediate Boston area that are pretty okay for this. A few I can think of:
1 - Blue Route at Crow Hill (my first trad lead).
2 - Get the Boston Rocks guidebook, there have to be a bunch I'm not thinking of. And ask the other new leaders here, I guess I've run out of good suggestions! :oops:
And Rob's right. Nothing in life is free, but every experienced leader comes with the patience to sit for hours while a new leader sketches their way up 5.3 for hours. I suspect that any experienced leader will pay back the world at least once or twice before they feel their debt is paid for, from when it was paid to them when they started out!
Sue, you've put your finger on the exact reason why a lot of people say that "toprope protected leading" is worthless. I never did it myself, so I won't weigh in on the subject, except to say that whatever its uses, I think the practice exists mostly because of guides' liablity issues.
GO
|
|
|
|
|
elron
Jun 1, 2004, 7:29 PM
Post #6588 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 480
|
Sue (and others looking for good easy leads)...
Crow Hill: Boardwalk, Tom's Dilemma, Green Route, Blue Route to Chimney
Quincy: White Knight
Hammond Pond: Several on the practice face (edit: lower walls). The 5.4 all the way on the right is great
And once you have some experience, or an experienced person to go with, the Gunks. The Gunks must have the single largest concentration of 5.easy "G" climbs anywhere. You'll need to deal with a little exposure on some of them, but the holds are huge, the pro great, and the belays (often) are on ledges (i.e. not a log of hanging belays). Grab a fellow Mass Climber, drag them to the Gunks, and trade off leads with them on Beginner's Delight, Three Pines (currently closed because of nesting vultures I believe), Betty, Easy O, Gelsa, etc. Then buy them some beer afterward :)
Kevin
|
|
|
|
|
taualum23
Jun 1, 2004, 7:51 PM
Post #6589 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 13, 2002
Posts: 2370
|
In reply to: The obvious choice is to look for slabs with a nice clean crack running from bottom to top. I can think of several in the immediate Boston area: 1 - Any of several at the lower wall at Hammond Pond. 2 - At least one at the Black and White Rocks (Middlesex Fells). 3 - I believe there's one on the practice face at Crow Hill? Can anyone add to this list?
If you want to go "ludcrously easy to the point that I would probably solo it" there is the crack at rattlesnake that Chad and I did. Honestly, I'm quite sure there are better spots.
|
|
|
|
|
wideguy
Jun 1, 2004, 8:03 PM
Post #6590 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 9, 2003
Posts: 15046
|
Sue, for the newbie's POV depending on how nervous you really are, Mine and I believe Taualum's first trad lead was a slab fest at Rattlesnake Rocks. Probably 5.3? EASY climbing with several huge horizontal cracks running across the face at nice intervals. The actual climbing might be a bit boring for you, but the opportunity is there to place lots of gear from nice no hands stances. Very little chance of falling. Variety of choices at the top to build anchors of different styles. Sveral people here think it's a pile, but it worked nicely for me
The leads at HP are nice too, like stated. 5.4's-5.6's I think. Huge vertical cracks with a huge horizontal that crosses all of them about 1/2 way up. Little more challenging than the RR
|
|
|
|
|
sujones65
Jun 1, 2004, 8:27 PM
Post #6592 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 5, 2004
Posts: 228
|
In reply to: once you have some experience, or an experienced person to go with, the Gunks. Then buy them some beer afterward :) Kevin
Kevin,
Alright, if I go this weekend I promise I will buy all the beer :) And while we're on the subject and since I've been belaying your leads...can you tell me, other than anchoring in to something, what can I do to assure that I will catch you IF you fall. I've never had a leader fall on my belay before, but I don't know if there are more things I should be doing to be as confident as possible...especially when you go out of sight...
sue :?
|
|
|
|
|
elron
Jun 1, 2004, 8:41 PM
Post #6593 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 480
|
Sue, on multipitch climbs, having an anhor oriented for upward pull while belaying the leader is pretty important. At the Gunks this can be taken care of by using the trees (omnidirectional) or placing cams in horizontal cracks (good for upward and downward pull) for the anchors.
My bigger concern (and this may vary from leader to leader) when I'm out of sight on an easier climb is that the slack is fed smoothly. I've pulled over the tops of several Gunks climbs with what felt like 100 pounds of rope drag... not fun! If I'm gonna fall on lead, you'll hear me... and I won't yell "falling!" :) maybe something else that starts with "f" though!
The one time I fell was about a 30 footer, but it was on a slab, so I didn't get too much speed up... though i sure *felt* like I was going fast. According to Cathy, who caught the fall, "the rope just went slack for a little while, then went tight". She never really got yanked too bad. This is because a) I was sliding down a slab rather than free-falling b) she was well anchored to 2 bolts and wouldn't have gone far anyways, and c) I was about 150+ feet out on the lead... I think this translates to a fall factor of 0.2
Kevin
|
|
|
|
|
honeyhiker
Jun 1, 2004, 9:34 PM
Post #6594 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 114
|
Hey Sue, Dave's on for Thursday at Rumney so unless he bails we can do some hard stuff. I'm close to sending Repossession and plan on doing it Thurs. Definitely want to do Yoda again and Lies. Your arms will be so pumped you won't be able to climb Friday. :P By the way, you can buy a WMNF parking sticker at exit 23 for $20 and its only $5 more for a 2nd one if you want to split the total cost with another person its a sweet deal.
Anybody know which route the climber was on when he took the leader fall? I sure hope he's ok. Also, somebody said they saw water coming from inside one of the anchor bolt holes of Mr Popular, and would like feedback whether anyone else noticed this or was it just runoff? Dave's planning on looking into it anyway as we need to know which was happening.
Chris
|
|
|
|
|
sujones65
Jun 1, 2004, 9:47 PM
Post #6595 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 5, 2004
Posts: 228
|
Hey Chris,
great! Glad to hear that Dave's on board for Thursday..I finally feel like I'm getting a little bit back into shape so I'm ready to do some fun stuff. I am tentatively planning on going climbing this weekend so don't kill me. I'm more worried about the skin on my fingers than my arms!! There's something about that tingling feeling at the end of the day that I enjoy, though :wink:
I'll try to get up there early again, and choueiri (tony) may be coming with me. He's very nice and ready to climb more--you'll like him....he wouldn't kill a caterpiller at QQ which immediately put him in my "good" books (even though they were crawling all over me!)
any word from Beth or has she moved on to another climbing hot spot somewhere in the east?
let's touch base by phone tomorrow sometime
stay rad
sj65
|
|
|
|
|
honeyhiker
Jun 1, 2004, 10:16 PM
Post #6596 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 114
|
My fingers are all shredded. I'm getting some awesome callouses along with ankle rash from heel and toe hooking on that new route. I'm wearing pants or tights next time.
Beth is away for a couple weeks. I'm sure she's heading to the Gunks as much as possible. It'll be great climbing with her again when she gets back.
Too bad its raining still or I'd head down there tomorrow. If a miracle occurs and Mass is going to be dry tomorrow morning let me know and I'll head down if you want. If not I'm going birthday shopping, definitely torture buying something for a climber. One for you and one for me... :roll:
|
|
|
|
|
orangekyak
Jun 1, 2004, 10:25 PM
Post #6597 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 1832
|
Oh boy ... real climbing talk.
First, my weekend ... did not get to climb in PA. Partner stood me up. Anyone who has spent more than 20 minutes in car en route to crag with me knows how I feel about this - on par with the golden rule. You make plans, you keep plans. Right? None of this hangover bs ...
Monday, on the way home, we stopped at the Gunks. Heavily the overcast sky must have sent the cityfolk south because the place was a ghost town. We walked right up to Jackie. Unfortunately, some rain began to fall as we prepared for p2, so we rapped. Amanda cruised the awkward corner and roof cruxes like a solid 5.6 climber (Jackie is a 5.5). Y'all are nice folk, but I love nothing better (in climbing) than taking Amanda up "easy" climbs. Thanks to the gunks, I can take her up "easy" stuff that makes my heart work a bit.
You folk heading up there this weekend ought to check out Jackie. She's sexy.
Trad falls? I'm pretty psyched about them. Ask me again when I'm well above my gear, climbing with someone for the first time, needing to pee or poop, slightly dehydrated, with sweaty palms and hungry stomach. I think I've only taken trad falls 3 or 4 times. All were fairly close to the ground.
I'm a big advocate of self-imposed limits. Know what you can climb without falling. Subtract a few numbers. Practice your skills with experienced supervision. Take a class if you want that professional guide stamp of approval. Last summer I made myself stick to 6s and 7s. By the end of the summer I was comfortable on 8s, very pleased and confident.
This year I've yet to lead anything harder than 8 on gear. I have a desire to climb 9s, but a respect for 9 and its history. More 8s seem like the perfect solution.
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Jun 1, 2004, 11:26 PM
Post #6598 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
Jer that sucks man.. as one who's been on a few rides with ya.. i know a few of your theories and other useful bits o' knowledge.. hangovers are not an excuse.. ask josh.. he sucked it up hardcore for a long hike and no climbing at pway.. but didnt bail.. i was impressed
cool you did some fun routes with amanda though..
hehe you keep mentioning this heel hook chris.. i know i didnt use one.. i was also not leading it so maybe i'd use different beta above a bolt
is the 12 done? i'd love to try following that sometime
anyway lata
jake
|
|
|
|
|
honeyhiker
Jun 1, 2004, 11:44 PM
Post #6599 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 114
|
Hi Jake,
YOU Mr Muscles may not need to heel hook but I sure as well have to. LOL I flew up to that third bolt yesterday though so maybe next time my arms can handle the few remaining tough moves. I think I got it figured out yesterday but ran out of steam, and time, after the long weekend.
We're hoping to finish the 12 by this weekend. Some clueless guy came along and wanted to hop on it... like wow man, ignore the red tags and hope the freshly glued bolts along with missing bolts on the crux moves teach you a lesson. :evil: Aren't I horrid?! NOT!
Anyway, hopefully you can get on it this weekend. You need to wear pants to do a knee bar though, shorts just don't cut it.
C
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Jun 1, 2004, 11:54 PM
Post #6600 of 22774
(522613 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
hehe i could see that guy "kinda run out.... wait.. wtf... DOH"
haha knee bar.. i dont think i've ever used one of those before.. which means.. there might be a way around it 8^)
jules used the heel she has the cut to prove it.. i dont remember what i did but i know i didn't hook anything
|
|
|
|
|
|
