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rivercityrni
Jul 3, 2004, 11:50 PM
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What's a good way to tell when you've become dehydrated? I never know how much water to drink, if I'm dehydrated, etc. Any recommendations?
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blackwell4
Jul 4, 2004, 12:01 AM
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Frequent clear urination is the only sure measure of good hydration. Our "thrist" message comes on late. By the time you feel thristy, you may way behind the curve and not be able to recover..
I live in Texas and the summers are hot, many climbers think they are cashed out and cut the climbing day short, when really they are another victim to dehydration.
My reccomendations are;
Take more water than you think is necessary, 1 liter per hour is minimum
Begin drinking when you get out of the car.
Drink deep when ever you are on belay.
Get used to having to hunt a good place to pee.
Do this and your friends will wear out and you'll still be climbing.
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dono169
Jul 4, 2004, 12:11 AM
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CLEAR pee is the key as stated above. If u have it, ur hydrated if not, drink up
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celticelement
Jul 4, 2004, 12:16 AM
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You can get a lot of info by googleing Dehydration.
When backpacking or hiking in places where access to water may be an issue I have found myself naturally falling into a state of mild dehydration. I seem to be able to go a good deal longer on less water if I stay just under the normal comfort level. My thought when I am pinched for water is, if I am urinating I am drinking too much, but if I start malfunctioning because of a lack of water then I have defeated the purpose of rationing my water.
One symptom I did not find listed in the couple of sites I looked at was cramping. I always thought that cramping is one of the symptoms of mild to moderate dehydration- I could be mistaken. I had an encounter with that symptom (I think it was conected) once during a early winter hike. We had snow on the ground, and my water was becoming slush. I had something salty at breakfast with not enough water to go along with it because my water was basically all ice. I did not feel the need for water until a couple of hours later I started to have cramps that I could not explain - I did not even feel thirsty. Then I remembered I had had very little water in a long time. I took about a half quart of water and the cramps almost instantly disappeared.
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willingspirit
Jul 4, 2004, 12:44 AM
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Yep, urination is key. In the medical field, we use the amount of urine a patient makes to help us make sure that the patient is not dehydrated.
Minium amount of urine is 0.5 cc/kg/hr. Generally that means that most adults should make a minimum of 30 cc ( or 1 ounce) per hour. So if it's been 4 hours, and you don't pee at least 4 ounces, you're not drinking enough. You can lose a lot more than that through sweat and water vapor from your lungs when it's hot, so you'll have to drink more than one ounce per hour.
I find this to be a handy guide for me to help keep me from peeing too frequently, since I'm new, female, and haven't got the peeing in the woods thing very well coordinated yet.
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kimgraves
Jul 5, 2004, 4:41 AM
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I agree that straw colored urine is the best way to tell if you’re drinking enough. But don’t start drinking when you get to the climb. Start hydrating on the drive up. Drinking frequently, rather than deeply is more important – a couple of swallows every 10 minutes are more effective than a pint every hour. You want to match how fast your stomach can empty with how fast you drink. Carrying a hydration system is very effective. For myself, I find that drinking and eating enough is the key to staying sharp.
Best, Kim
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ajkclay
Jul 5, 2004, 12:06 PM
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the colour guide is reasonable, but you need to be aware that other things can influence colour:
Vitamin tablets (esp vit B) -yellow
Some breakfast cereals - yellow
Beer - clear
Diuretics -clear
etc etc...
The best way to tell if you are dehydrated is ask yourself this:
"Have I been regularly sipping water for the last few hours?"
If your answer is "yes" then the answer is probably "no."
Remember, the hotter the day, and the greater the exertion, the greater the fluid requirement.
Once you are dehydrated it's going to take a lot to rehydrate.
oh, btw, it's better to sip small amounts frequently than gulp large amounts infrequently as a large portion of gulped water (h2O drunk in large quantities) will go straight through and make you pee a lot without rehydrating you as efficiently.
None of this is exhaustive, but just make sure you drink small amounts frequently.
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ajkclay
Jul 5, 2004, 12:09 PM
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In reply to: haven't got the peeing in the woods thing very well coordinated yet.
wouldn't it be a peeing above my belayer thing? :lol: and that is not an easy thing to get right! :lol:
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dredsovrn
Jul 23, 2004, 4:26 PM
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If you get dizzy and fall down, you might be dehydrated. Just keep the water flowing at a reasonable pace when it is hot and you are exerting yourself and you will be fine. I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TV.
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roboclimber
Jul 23, 2004, 4:46 PM
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Willingspirit pretty much summed up one of the best indicators. If you are peeing regularily (assuming that you are not on any medications and that you have no associated medical problems or disorders), then your level of hydration is most likely adequate. If you are waiting to check the color of your urine as a guide, you could be mildly dehydrated when the color goes from clear to dark. The body can maximally absorb about 1 L of water per hour from the digestive track into the systemic circulation; however, a whole lot more can be utilized under extreme heat and activity (such as climbing) by the body. This could eventually lead to an increasing deficit that could not be replenished. So, stay hydrated by sipping on something throughout the day (as was already stated; water is the best, and stay away from electrolyte drinks while exercising), and if you notice that you are not urinating very often (every two hours), keep increasing the level of fluids until you are.
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ajkclay
Jul 24, 2004, 2:27 AM
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In reply to: water is the best, and stay away from electrolyte drinks while exercising
good point I forgot to mention that :)
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lv2climb7
Jul 24, 2004, 2:32 AM
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5fdsafdsfdsa
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bryhopkins
Jul 24, 2004, 2:46 AM
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why dont you want to drink drinks with electrolytes?
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dutyje
Jul 24, 2004, 3:11 AM
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In reply to: Take more water than you think is necessary, 1 liter per hour is minimum
OK.. Show of hands here. How many climbers go out for an 8 AM - 8 PM nice long day of climbing and carry 12 liters of water up the mountain?
How many climbers go out for a 9 AM - 2 PM day of climbing and carry along 5 liters?
I carry more water with me than anyone I know. I'm climbing in North Carolina in the middle of summer and it is incredibly hot. I'm going out climbing tomorrow morning, hitting the trail around 9:30 AM and not planning to return until after 5 PM. By this standard, I will be dehydrated because I *only* plan to bring 4.4 liters of water with me (instead of the theoretical minimum 7.5).
Water is heavy. Rules like "1 liter per hour" really oversimplify things. If you're climbing in severe heat, begin hydrating the day before. Drink a couple liters (over the course of a couple hours) before you go to bed (you'll have to urinate in the middle of the night. Get over it). Drink another liter of water in the car on the way to the crag. Basically, "top off" before you get on the trail and you won't have to carry as much water.
Proper intake of food actually helps you stay hydrated as well. It's counterintuitive, but some salt (I like beef jerky) will also help you to stay hydrated.
The signs everybody already covered (frequent, clear urination) will tell you whether or not you brought enough water. Climb regularly and you'll begin to learn what your individual needs are.
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roboclimber
Jul 24, 2004, 3:17 AM
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bryhopkins wrote:
In reply to: why dont you want to drink drinks with electrolytes?
The formulation of most electrolyte drinks is too high in salt and other electrolytes to replenish the water that one is losing in the heat i.e. water will be moved from intracellular stores to extracellular stores to dilute the concentrated solution that you are consuming. If you drink electrolyte drinks while exercising in the heat, they may actually exacerbate the problem and cause a greater degree of dehydration. Save the electrolyte replenishment for when you are home on the Lazy Boy; while in the sun, stick with plain water.
P.S. I miss Washington a ton. I was a permanent fixture on the wall at Marymoor. Redmond rules!
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ajkclay
Jul 24, 2004, 3:34 AM
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In reply to: why dont you want to drink drinks with electrolytes?
okay, at the risk of starting a "quote this quote that" war (which I will ignore):
There are a number of reasons ranging from physiological to human nature:
First, if you take electrolyte drinks that is waht you are stuck with. One of the biggest problems you can face is not wanting to drink your drink because you are sick of the taste. This is a sure way to become dehydrated. It is rare for someone to get to the point where they can't stand drinking water.
Second, water empties from the stomach quicker than anything else as it does not require processing and therefore provides for a remedy for the problem raised in this forum.
Third, if your drink contains simple sugars they take longer and require more fluid to empty from the stomach and GI tract. Additionally due to the insulin response elicited you may experience a brief burst of energy followed by a big low - cyclists call it "bonking."
Finally, the electrolytes provided in sports drinks are in quantities that are based upon gross generalisations and are in no way likely to match the specific requirements of your system as the individual needs will commonly vary hugely between individuals. They are just not adequate.
Drink water, it's easy to get and it works.
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ajkclay
Jul 24, 2004, 3:37 AM
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In reply to: bryhopkins wrote: In reply to: why dont you want to drink drinks with electrolytes? The formulation of most electrolyte drinks is too high in salt and other electrolytes to replenish the water that one is losing in the heat i.e. water will be moved from intracellular stores to extracellular stores to dilute the concentrated solution that you are consuming. If you drink electrolyte drinks while exercising in the heat, they may actually exacerbate the problem and cause a greater degree of dehydration. Save the electrolyte replenishment for when you are home on the Lazy Boy; while in the sun, stick with plain water.
^^^
that too :)
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eyecannon
Jul 24, 2004, 6:17 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: Take more water than you think is necessary, 1 liter per hour is minimum OK.. Show of hands here. How many climbers go out for an 8 AM - 8 PM nice long day of climbing and carry 12 liters of water up the mountain? How many climbers go out for a 9 AM - 2 PM day of climbing and carry along 5 liters? I carry more water with me than anyone I know. I'm climbing in North Carolina in the middle of summer and it is incredibly hot. I'm going out climbing tomorrow morning, hitting the trail around 9:30 AM and not planning to return until after 5 PM. By this standard, I will be dehydrated because I *only* plan to bring 4.4 liters of water with me (instead of the theoretical minimum 7.5). Water is heavy. Rules like "1 liter per hour" really oversimplify things. If you're climbing in severe heat, begin hydrating the day before. Drink a couple liters (over the course of a couple hours) before you go to bed (you'll have to urinate in the middle of the night. Get over it). Drink another liter of water in the car on the way to the crag. Basically, "top off" before you get on the trail and you won't have to carry as much water. Proper intake of food actually helps you stay hydrated as well. It's counterintuitive, but some salt (I like beef jerky) will also help you to stay hydrated. The signs everybody already covered (frequent, clear urination) will tell you whether or not you brought enough water. Climb regularly and you'll begin to learn what your individual needs are.
I agree, I take about 1 liter for every 3 hours.
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jt512
Jul 25, 2004, 8:27 PM
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In reply to: bryhopkins wrote: In reply to: why dont you want to drink drinks with electrolytes? The formulation of most electrolyte drinks is too high in salt and other electrolytes to replenish the water that one is losing in the heat i.e. water will be moved from intracellular stores to extracellular stores to dilute the concentrated solution that you are consuming. If you drink electrolyte drinks while exercising in the heat, they may actually exacerbate the problem and cause a greater degree of dehydration.
Can you document any of the above with citations to scientific literature. Everything I have read on the subject says just the opposite, that electrolyte drinks actually enhance hydration, and are even more important while exercizing in hot weather.
-Jay
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ajkclay
Jul 26, 2004, 12:01 AM
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In reply to: okay, at the risk of starting a "quote this quote that" war
In reply to: Can you document any of the above with citations to scientific literature. Everything I have read on the subject says just the opposite, that electrolyte drinks actually enhance hydration, and are even more important while exercizing in hot weather.
I told you it would happen, I just didn't mention his name
:lol:
It's a helpful post on a website NOT a thesis submitted for peer review in a scientific journal.
TOOL
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jt512
Jul 26, 2004, 12:06 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: okay, at the risk of starting a "quote this quote that" war In reply to: Can you document any of the above with citations to scientific literature. Everything I have read on the subject says just the opposite, that electrolyte drinks actually enhance hydration, and are even more important while exercizing in hot weather. I told you it would happen, I just didn't mention his name :lol: It's a helpful post on a website NOT a thesis submitted for peer review in a scientific journal. TOOL
It's not helpful if it's wrong. MORON.
-Jay
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ajkclay
Jul 26, 2004, 12:27 AM
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It's not wrong, it is right we are just not going to get caught up in your pathetic attempts to prove that you are Master of the Universe by starting a quoting research arguement.
Anyone with half a brain will know that you can find research to argue either side of an arguement in the majority of cases especially when it comes to food supplementation.
We just can't be arsed with your pathetic attempts to prove to yourself that you really aren't a jerk and that the kids at school were wrong for picking on you.
Go and try to boost your ego somewhere else - try pulling wings off flies, I bet it was fun back in school huh?
Last post regarding self important fools.
If we ignore him, hopefully he will lose interest and try to find another group of "cool kids" to try to impress with his knowledge. I'm sure you all saw this type of know-it-all-kid when you were in Junior High.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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jt512
Jul 26, 2004, 12:48 AM
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In reply to: It's not wrong, it is right we are just not going to get caught up in your pathetic attempts to prove that you are Master of the Universe by starting a quoting research arguement.
The question isn't about me. It's about what is better to drink. Period.
In reply to: Anyone with half a brain will know that you can find research to argue either side of an arguement in the majority of cases especially when it comes to food supplementation.
Anyone with a whole brain will be able to evaluate discrepant studies and make a decision on the issue.
In reply to: Any fool can post
You've certainly made that clear.
-Jay
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roboclimber
Jul 26, 2004, 6:44 AM
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Jay, in reply to your earlier question, there are two issues that should be raised in a discussion of sports drinks. One is that a large majority of athletes feel that a sports beverage with added sugar is beneficial to athletic performance because of the hypoglycemic states that endurance events can induce. When I have read literature about beverages most people argue about the carbohydrates being of great benefit (there often is little discussion of the electrolytes); however, a large portion of drinks are not correctly formulated (iso-osmotic formulations) for the average joe that plays hard on the weekend, which raises the second issue about electrolytes. Ultra endurance athletes lose a significant amount of salt through the process of sweating and can become hyponatremic during long duration events with high exertion levels (18 hours of ultra marathoning or extreme racing). Electrolyte replacement is critical for those individuals because if they do not get salt they can have severe neurological consequences. Conceivably, a weekend warrior could get into this situation as well; however, severe dehydration and heat stroke is not a common event. Most people have adequate salt intake to cover the loss that occurs with activities in the sun; what they need is water. As for the process that I stated earlier, I am not aware of any studies on this; however, electrolyte physiology will tell you that this is a very real occurrence. The same process would occur if you were to ingest a few tablespoons of salt. Electrolyte drinks and there "performance" enhancing benefits is a heated topic among exercise physiologists. The question you raised was excellent. I hope the long winded reply didn't wear you out.
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