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joe
Jul 10, 2004, 4:33 PM
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Registered: Jun 22, 2003
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TWENTY DOLLARS FOR A BACKCOUNTRY PERMIT?
TWENTY F*CKING DOLLARS.
TO SLEEP UP IN THE MOUNTAINS.
DO I GET A CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST WITH THAT?
PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFTTT.
okay, i'm done.
RANT_OFF
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calamity_chk
Jul 10, 2004, 5:27 PM
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I heard they're using the fees to put a McD's and a Starbucks up there. Maybe a B&N if they can get enough money.
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jackscoldsweat
Jul 10, 2004, 6:33 PM
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'My blood is bruised and borrowed. You thieving bastards.
You have turned my blood cold and bitter,
beat my compassion black and blue.
Hope this is what you wanted.
Hope this is what you had in mind.
Cuz this is what you're getting.
I hope you're choking. I hope you choke on this.
Taken all I can, taken all I can, we(?) can take.
Taken all you can, taken all you can feckin' take
Got nothing left to give to you.
Blood suckin parasitic little tick/blood suckin parasitic little tick
Take what you want and then go.
I HOPE YOU CHOKE!'
and that my friends just about sums up my feelings on backcountry permit fees...
JCS
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calamity_chk
Jul 10, 2004, 6:46 PM
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i am jack's hatred of backcountry permits.
i am joe's hatred of starbucks.
i am all that is wasteful and consuming, i am mainstream America.
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vivalargo
Jul 10, 2004, 6:54 PM
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Thatīs a complete outrage. I thought the wilderness was ours, not a resource on which to conduct municipal funding scams.
Sobody must pay for the officials to collect the fees, I guess . . .
SCHITE!
Only the rich will ever see a tree.
JL
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thrasher
Jul 11, 2004, 1:53 AM
Post #6 of 32
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Where are they charging $20 for a permit?
Not that it matters, anybody that buckles under and pays it is a fool anyway.
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areyoumydude
Jul 11, 2004, 2:17 AM
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Registered: Dec 28, 2003
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Rocky Mountain NP. $20 for a camp site or back country pass and no we did not pay. 8^)
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thrasher
Jul 11, 2004, 3:07 AM
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I understand the entrance fee to get into NP's. What I have a problem with is charging for a permit to go into the backcountry of Forest Service land. I won't backpack in national parks if I can help it. And I'll be darned if I EVER pay for a stinkin' backcountry permit. If the station is open as I drive by(usually at 3AM on the way to the trailhead), I will stop and get one of the free ones. But I will NEVER pay for one of those things. just as I have never paid for one of those ridiculous Adventure Passes either. What a crock!
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climbinganne
Jul 11, 2004, 3:15 AM
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there's assholes out there...we are paying for them
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thrasher
Jul 11, 2004, 4:42 AM
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Yep, assholes ruin everything.
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andy_reagan
Jul 11, 2004, 1:53 PM
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where can you go to find out if you think you are one of these assholes you speak of? I have my strong suspicions... :?
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joe
Jul 11, 2004, 5:13 PM
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In reply to: I understand the entrance fee to get into NP's. What I have a problem with is charging for a permit to go into the backcountry of Forest Service land.
this is my point. i understand needing funds to pay for the costs of maintaining campgrounds, roads and whatnot but what am i paying for with a backcountry permit? is someone out there pulling weeds? do the bears need grooming? WTF? i'm not against contributing, i just like to know what i am shelling out for. and who came up with TWENTY DOLLARS? i'd be willing to bet that it was someone who hasn't spent a whole lot of time in YOUR PUBLIC LANDS.
my rogue bivy technique is unstoppable.
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dirtineye
Jul 11, 2004, 5:17 PM
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All I can see is that they need to know where to look in an emergency. Seems fair to charge a small amount just to cover the cost of keeping up with use and records. Why that would cost 20 bucks is beyond me.
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joe
Jul 11, 2004, 5:26 PM
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that's what i'm saying. i'll pay five bucks, like in zion.
rescues...never thought about that. maybe they're sick of paying for helicopter flights. this is making a little more sense.
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areyoumydude
Jul 11, 2004, 5:34 PM
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Ef 'em. Let the tourons pay. I'm roguein' it all the way.
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elvislegs
Jul 11, 2004, 6:29 PM
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yup.
f-ck that shit.
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danooguy
Jul 12, 2004, 2:52 PM
Post #17 of 32
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Registered: Dec 31, 2002
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You should pay it and shut the hell up about it.
Many other sports and events have similar taxes and fees, some higher, some lower, and require far less rationing of usage, require far less maintenance because of utilization and demand, and have far less impact on the environment than backcountry camping.
If you refuse to pay the permit fee, you are no different than the hunter that refuses to buy a license and contribute the overall well being and future of that sport. In hunting those people are called poachers.
To "rogue" it, is the moral equivalent of backcountry poaching.
20 bucks. That's how much an hour to enjoy what?
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bumblie
Jul 12, 2004, 3:12 PM
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I wouldn't have a problem with backcountry fees, if those who drive on the newly constructed roads, to the multi-million dollar visitors center were charged an appropriate amount. As it is, those benefitting from these costly "improvements" pay significantly less (if anything at all).
This whole backcountry fee business is a way for land managers to extort unfair fees from an avid user group, that is small and relatively powerless.
The sad thing about the whole fee-based programs, for our National Parks, is that this temporary progam was supposed to have ended several years ago, but the powers that be keep extending it.
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elvislegs
Jul 12, 2004, 3:47 PM
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In reply to: 20 bucks. That's how much an hour to enjoy what?
$0.21 / Hr. average.
something i'm already paying taxes for.
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tgreene
Jul 12, 2004, 3:53 PM
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While planning our vacation this fall, I checked out the Yellowstone website, and their fees are insane. We were wanting to do some backpacking, but with the fees, rules and regs, I think we'll probably just hit the neighboring parks instead, and "cross over" to where we want to be.
I also like the fact that you cannot carry a firearm to use if attacked by bears, and they actually suggest pepper spray stating that it's 80% effective... FU@K THAT, I'll bet the other 20% wished they were packing more than a can of spray with an effective range of 10 feet!
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lostcause
Jul 12, 2004, 5:18 PM
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Out of curiousity, does anyone know if this price has increased dramitically over the last year? The last backcountry permit I bought was only $5 but wasn't RMNP, it was for Arapahoe (?) just to the south.
The reason I'm curious is I was wondering if fees would start to skyrocket since the parks are seriously hurting financially now. Many parks are laying off rangers and staff. I read where some were even halting most garbage pickups to save money. Federal spending for the national parks has been hurt in recent years.
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danooguy
Jul 13, 2004, 4:21 AM
Post #23 of 32
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In reply to: is that this temporary progam was supposed to have ended several years ago, but the powers that be keep extending it.
At least thats a valid argument.
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overzealous
Jul 13, 2004, 3:38 PM
Post #24 of 32
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Registered: Mar 24, 2004
Posts: 257
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In reply to: 'My blood is bruised and borrowed. You thieving bastards. You have turned my blood cold and bitter, beat my compassion black and blue. Hope this is what you wanted. Hope this is what you had in mind. Cuz this is what you're getting. I hope you're choking. I hope you choke on this. Taken all I can, taken all I can, we(?) can take. Taken all you can, taken all you can feckin' take Got nothing left to give to you. Blood suckin parasitic little tick/blood suckin parasitic little tick Take what you want and then go. I HOPE YOU CHOKE!' and that my friends just about sums up my feelings on backcountry permit fees... JCS
So, how do you really feel about it? Don't be shy, express yourself...let it all out.
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camhead
Jul 13, 2004, 4:45 PM
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Posts: 20939
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hi everbiddy.
pretty cool to see that thrasher and I actually agree on something finally.
anyway, just thought I'd add some info to this thread that I read in a recent issue of the Canyon Country Zephyr. Dealing with the rising prevalence of fee demo programs in our public lands. Basically the Bush administration is pushing for the increasing privatization of BLM, NFS, and to a degree even NPS areas through concessionaires and other for-profit entities. There is a bill in congress right now that would introduce an $85/year pass required for ANY use of public lands. Wanna go climbing? Wanna go have a picnic? Wanna drive across some national forest on a county-maintained road? Better have your permit.
Pretty fucking lame.
This bill seeks to do nothing less than commodify public lands, which believe it or not many politicians see as a sort of SOCIALISM.
We'd better start writing our congressmen before the entire west becomes Texas.
wish I could remember more on this issue.
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