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thewyseclimber
Jul 28, 2004, 6:19 AM
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So i work at a camp on pike's peak, and among other things I'm a climbing and rappelling instructor. I've heard things about people being too heavy to climb or rappel, and we do have a wide variety of people go through our camp. We set up some easy topropes, and do some 70-80 foot rappels on atc-style devices. I'm concerned about the gear, and issues with overweight people using the stuff. I'm the one belaying and instructing, and I need to take care of the camp's gear as best I can. Does anybody have any input on this topic? I had a guy rappel the other day who was at least 250 pounds. We have fully adjustable harnesses, so taht's not the problem. I just don't know if it's possible to put undue strain on the gear or the system, either in a top rope or a rappel situation. Plus it concerns me to think if I had to rescue the overweight person from, say, a shirt jammed up in the atc. Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.
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tisar
Jul 28, 2004, 8:31 AM
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The gear is absolutly fine with "big" kids as it's designed to withstand forces you'll _never_ reach in rappelling or toprope situations, not even if that guy would have had 500 pounds or more.
There's a extensive discussion on rappelling for kids in another thread which should be helpfull:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=65351
Many of your questions should be answered there.
- Daniel
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brokenarmboy19
May 19, 2005, 9:54 PM
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I would pay to see a 500 lb guy rappell that would be entertaining
oh and i weigh 240 and have never had an issue
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keinangst
May 19, 2005, 10:46 PM
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Just put a screamer on the rap line.
(kidding, for the literal folks)
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nedsurf
May 19, 2005, 11:02 PM
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You should really get the camp to pay for the AMGA top rope site mngr. class for you. If they don't know about it they might be totally oblivious to all the legal pitfalls associated with running a program. You SHOULD already know the answer to this question before presenting yourself as the informed authority of this activity. The AMGA class will give this beta to you. Discuss this with your camp director.
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md3
May 19, 2005, 11:06 PM
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There are considerations other than gear. Maybe you have already dealt with them, but your rescue protocols may need to be amended. How does an instructor normally deal with someone who gets hair or a shirt stuck on a rappel? If the load line isn’t on a load releasing hitch that you can release with this kind of weight and you expect to do some sort of haul, will it work with this sort of load? A one person z drag might not. You can experiment with high loads on both the load releasing hitches and hauls systems by having two (or three) people put their weight on the line in a controlled setting.
The belay itself – no reason most shouldn’t be able to hold the really big person and lower them if necessary, but some set ups are much better for this than others… Have you ever had to lower someone heavy a rope length on a skinny, new rope and started to worry after you started because of how hard it was to manage and how you didn’t have a system set up that allowed for adding additional friction?
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wjca
May 20, 2005, 8:00 PM
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In reply to: Just put a screamer on the rap line. (kidding, for the literal folks)
Put a 500 pounder on rappel and see if he (or she) doesn't scream. It would probably be a contest between the fatty rappelling and the guy giving the fireman's belay to see who screams the most.
Or go the other route, put a moaner on the rap line.
Wait a minute, this isn't Community. Sorry.
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wideguy
May 20, 2005, 8:07 PM
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I'm over 250 and haven't snapped a TR or Rap setup yet. 8^)
That said, especially on rap, your subject may enjoy a more aggressive device than a regular ATC. I find I reallly enjoy my Trango Jaws or a ATC-XP for the extra friction to help keep my rap speeds down with minimal effort. I have several partners that switch to my jaws to belay me for the same reason.
But the gear, that's plenty strong, no worries.
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wjca
May 20, 2005, 8:09 PM
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In reply to: I'm over 250 and haven't snapped a TR or Rap setup yet. 8^) That said, especially on rap, your subject may enjoy a more aggressive device than a regular ATC. I find I reallly enjoy my Trango Jaws or a ATC-XP for the extra friction to help keep my rap speeds down with minimal effort. I have several partners that switch to my jaws to belay me for the same reason. But the gear, that's plenty strong, no worries.
Yea, but are you a screamer? I just can't help myself, there's not much going on in Community right now.
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greenketch
May 20, 2005, 9:52 PM
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thewyseclimber,
there is no prob with a heavy climber. A good trick to keep in your bag for those heavy ones (or when you must rap with extra weight) extend the device with a sling girth hitched to the harness. First off this gives them control and keeps stuff out of getting caught. Then add a biner on the leg loop and an extra one on the biner that attaches the device to the sling. Have them run the rope through the device down to the leg loop, up through the extra biner, and then down through their brake hand. This extra "Z" in the brake line gives heavyweights a lot more friction and thence better control.
Better that you try it out for yourself first and see exactly how it works before you point them at it.
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