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feelio
Jun 7, 2002, 4:06 PM
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doesn't chongo realize that a few days in the Kinkos could net him a summers worth of cash? At least a few grand, for sure!!! I mean, Christ, hasn't anyone ever heard of coillating copiers? Plop the bible on, go get a cup of joe, bam, 10 bibles are copied, netting 1000 bucks!
I talked to pete a few years ago about getting this book, never did, and I still have the cash and want it.
What part of this equation does chongo not get? Surely the guy wants/needs a little cash?
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radistrad
Jun 7, 2002, 4:28 PM
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money does not make everyone happy...
I've hung with chongo a bit and he does not seem like money is what life is about for him, albeit I'm sure he can use some more..
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feelio
Jun 7, 2002, 4:44 PM
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I wasn't implying that money is everything, just that it can't hurt to make a little for his effort in writting such a saught after book.
I mean I counted close to ten folks on this phorum that are ready and waiting to expand their knowledge.
Knowledge is true wealth.
I just want to speed up my solo techniques, and I have tried everything I know.
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passthepitonspete
Jun 7, 2002, 7:23 PM
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OK, here's the scoop on Chongo's book.
I had the opportunity to speak with Chongo in the lodge caf a couple nights ago.
It was almost impossible to get him to talk about anything except his physics book! There is no doot aboot it - Chongo's passion lies in his physics and not in his climbing book.
I asked him about a collaborative effort, whereby I would slash and burn the thing from its 600 pages to about 250 or 300. This I could easily do by removing the unnecessary repetition, and I could add a few of my own Dr. Piton tips and anecdotes. (See, I actually DO climb, unlike Chongo recently, so I actually HAVE personal climbing anecdotes to share!) I thought a streamlined and updated version would be a lot more saleable. I told Chuck I had no interest in rewriting the thing because that would be too much work, but he would have no part of it. He wants to maintain complete control, and doesn't care to relinquish it to anyone.
Fair enough. I "get it".
I can't help but feel he is squandering a rather precious resource - me - someone who could help reduce the size of the tome and make it more marketable.
Plus I work cheaply!
But Chongo has no interest in marketing it in a large operation. He seems to relish its underground publishing, and seems to like to maintain some sort of aura of mystery around it.
He has taken recently to selling key chapters for $20. This is for the very simple reason that this is more profitable for him. He simply cannot be bothered selling the whole book for anything less than $100. Poor Nathan (Natec) told me he had to practically beg Chongo to sell him the damn book!
See, it comes down to two things as I see it - Chongo has lost the passion for the wall climbing book because his physics books are selling so well, or at least he tells me they are, and he's just too damn lazy to bother trying to sell the wall books.
Your best bet would be to hunt him down in the Yosemite Lodge cafeteria and see if you can convince him to actually sell you a book!
Now, here is your Dr. Piton Big Wall Tip of the Day:
Chongo told me he has recently registered a domain name.
Chongo Nation
If you click on it, you will see that the site is under construction. One cannot help but wonder how long this will remain in effect! When will Chongo actually find someone to get round and make it WORK?
Don't hold your breath, people.
At Chongo's pace, it may never happen. Remember, it took him a year and a half to climb half of the Sea of Dreams on El Cap!
Which is even slower than ME for cryin' out loud!
My suggestion is this - keep after him in person. He has no email address, and does not know anything about the internet.
Please tell him of the efforts I've been putting forth to promote his book.
Honestly, I felt kind of "jilted" the other night! I made what I felt to be a substantive effort to help him, and was basically dismissed, which kind of hurt my feelings a bit.
I don't think Chuck has any clue of the interest I and you-all have generated over his book, and he doesn't seem to be aware of how many people would really like to buy the damn thing!
Sheesh.
What the hell do we have to do? Hit him over the head with our money?
I don't know a workable solution to this problem.
Maybe I should write my own damn book.
Yours in frustration,
"Pass the Pitons" Pete Zabrok
Editor,
The Complete Book of Big Wall Climbing
by Chongo
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feelio
Jun 7, 2002, 7:48 PM
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A few options.
1.Pirate the book and just give him cash.
(very uncool)
2. Write your own damn book, and climb for free for the next 20 years like Ronnie Zero, with the profits.
Knowledge isn't always free, but once it's in your head, it's "public domain". there are alot of us out here that want the knowledge, and have the cash.
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bshaftoe
Jun 7, 2002, 8:13 PM
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Quote:
Registrant:
Tucker, Charles (UGRZWPJKZD)
PO BOX 1948
Yosemite, CA 95389
US
Domain Name: CHONGONATION.COM
Administrative Contact:
Tucker, Charles (GEVDSSTTWI) chongonation@hotmail.com
PO BOX 1948
Yosemite, CA 95389
US
none none
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mitchal
Jun 7, 2002, 9:11 PM
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Hey Pete,
Just write a book of your own,we all want one and Chongo doesn't seem to want to give it up.You wouldn't be pirating if it was your own book.Tell him people are clamoring for the book,and if he won't deliver,you will.If he doesn't like the idea,you may want to rethink(respect thing)or if he likes the idea,I would like the first autographed copy.
Climb Happy
Mitch
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dsafanda
Jun 12, 2002, 11:33 PM
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It seems that no one wants to write a new "How to" Big Wall book right now. I've been trying to convince Chris Mac to work on one. While he thinks it's a good idea he doesn't have the bandwith to take on a new project right now. I suspect the truth is that the no one can imagine how the profits could equal the amount of work involved. Too bad. The Long book is good but outdated. Then again, who needs one if Pete is giving away all the goods for free.
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atg200
Jun 13, 2002, 5:18 PM
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Anybody else see the humor in Pete making anything more concise
I'd like a copy, though I'm not holding my breath.
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dsafanda
Jun 13, 2002, 5:22 PM
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Yeah...I think a Pete/Chongo collaboration would need to be sold as a 10 volume set.
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boretribe
Jun 13, 2002, 5:38 PM
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I had absolutely no interest in aid climbing until I started hanging out on this site. You guys should be ashamed of yourselves .
On that note... sign me up for a copy of the book.
Is not life a hundred times too short for us to bore ourselves?
--FN
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passthepitonspete
Jun 27, 2002, 12:20 AM
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I spoke to Chongo in person last week.
You can order his book by sending a $100 U.S. postal money order to him at:
Chongo
Yosemite Valley, California
USA 95389
Chongo is 100% trustworthy, and you will get your book.
If and when it ever gets up and running, his website will be:
http://www.chongonation.com/
and his email address will be:
chongo@chongonation.com
Don't hold your breath on the website. I'd just mail him the cash if I were you.
I'm the editor, and can tell you it is well worth the money. It's a bit wordier than I would have liked, but he wouldn't let me trim it.
Chongo taught me most everything I know!
Chongo is Dr. Piton's Wall Doctor.
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natec
Jun 27, 2002, 12:46 AM
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As the proud owner of the Chongo Bible of Big Wall climbing, I will also tell you all that it is definitely worth the money. Hey, you all pay $100 for textbooks and trust me this thing is way more informative. The book is 600 pages and is the best thing you can get for wall information (aside from inviting PTPP's stinky ass into your home).
I am going to try and get with Chongo this week to see if we can work something out in order to get his book to the users of this site.
For now, I would go the P.O. Box deal. He is trustworthy, although slow.
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socalclimber
Jun 28, 2002, 2:34 PM
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I borrowed a copy from a friend, and I have to say, it is impressive. I will comment however, it is VERY POORLY WRITTEN! I have to read ton of technical material for my work and the last thing I need is poorly written technical material. There are repetitive sentices everywhere. The drawings are good for the most part. I really can not see spending a $100 on it. It is just to painful to read in my opinion. You can still get a ton of useful information out of it though. I don't write all that well myself, but then again, I'm not the one writting a book.
It is too bad Chongo won't give Pete the go ahead to do a severe edit and release a second edition, this would be worth the $100!
Just my .02 worth.
Robert
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passthepitonspete
Jun 28, 2002, 3:32 PM
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Your comments about the repetition are valid, but it is not that bad a read.
Chongo likes to "repeat things for emphasis" and he would not let me edit them out. I didn't get much editorial license, unfortunately.
That being said, you are one of the very very few people who have suggested it may not be worth the money.
Everyone else, including me, has found that the hundred dollar investment has saved thousands of dollars' worth of agony, stupidity, big wall theory, and unnecessary work.
But yeah, there are too many words.
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justsendingits
Jun 29, 2002, 11:12 AM
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If one thing in that book helped you climb safer,100$ is a small price!!!!!
[ This Message was edited by: justsendingits on 2002-06-29 07:39 ]
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bigdan
Jul 14, 2002, 3:35 AM
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anybody else had luck with this? i think i'll probably go ahead and give it a whirl...
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billcoe_
Jul 16, 2002, 2:04 PM
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I'm gonna bite. I'll let you know if/how it turns out for me.
Pete: I can't imagine anybody doing a better job on the writing than you. You're humorus, intellegent, erudite and witty. You might consider your own book based on your writings here.
BTW: I didn't see where Sauron earlier called you a liar like you said. He meerly said that the reg. number was wrong for that book and asked if there was a reason for it.
Kinda touchy eh?
PS I think erudite is a good thing. If you look it up and it really means "asshole", it was in no way meant to be a backhand slap at PTPP!!! I still think you're a good guy, but touchy!
If you take offense at anything I just said in this post let me just make a pre-emptive apology right now. No need to PM me. Sorry Pete. There.
Warm regards:
Bill
Dohhhh: I am posting this part of this message about a week after I put it up here. I realize that one can edit a message so if I say a bad word like ..... or ..... you can edit it out later and no one will know that you said ... or ... .
Funny no?? So never mind Pete, guess Sauron decided that you were not a liar and instead of apologising just edited it out.
Dohhh.
Oh BTW; Chongos money order is in the mail as of today 7-21-2002.
[ This Message was edited by: billcoe_ on 2002-07-21 17:47 ]
[ This Message was edited by: billcoe_ on 2002-07-28 21:57 ]
8-5-2002 UPDATE: Chongo comes through!!! Book (OK, it's pages with holes in it) showed up today. This book looks to have been a lot of work for some folks. Nice Pete, real nice. I haven't had a lot of time to study it, but a cursurary perusal shows it to be well worth the $100 to me, but I just lost $8,000 on the sale of a depreciating Prowler so hey, I ain't hurting. If I get 1 or 2 good things out of this book (looks like it will be substantially more than that) I would consider that worthwile to me.
BTW, Petes writings on RC.com detail some of the more important stuff covered in the book, but I'm very happy to have it so detailed and easilly available in 1 location.
There is is:
[ This Message was edited by: billcoe_ on 2002-08-05 20:08 ]
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passthepitonspete
Aug 16, 2002, 7:36 AM
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erdeneruc wrote [in another thread, moved here to minimize clusterf*ckage]:
Quote:
This is my first post here after lurking for so long! The quality of contributions to this forum is very high, and it is nice to learn something for a change from a forum.
I would like to obtain a copy of Chongo's "The Complete Book of Big Wall Climbing" yet the references I see tell me that I should find him in the Valley...
How do I get a hold of Chongo? Any chance that he reads this post, or someone who does lets him know of our interest in the book out here?
In any case, I will be in the Valley in the second half of September and could try to find him somehow...
Erden
First of all, apologizes for moving your post. All in the name of minimizing the wank factor, dude.
I hope you'll forgive me!
At any rate, I will be in Yosemite on August 28 or so, and I will bug the heck out of Chongo to read this thread, and get himself online and www-literate.
As you can see from the post above, Chongo is dependable and you can mail order the book from him as per my instructions.
In the Valley, look for him in the Yosemite Lodge cafeteria in the morning, or leave a note on the Camp 4 kiosk bulletin board.
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erdeneruc
Aug 16, 2002, 4:09 PM
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No problem, Pete. I am trying to navigate my way around the variety of topics on this board myself... I will follow the instructions here.
Thank you for your diligence.
Erden.
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johnhenry
Aug 16, 2002, 4:57 PM
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I was drinking beer with Chongo last week. He had several copies left for sale and was definately trying to pedal these but after these last few, he really does not plan to sell any more.
He was talking about some other dude who had either pirated the book or was trying to do his bidding.
Chongo has a remarkable, albeit out-there, sort of mind for wall mechanics but, by his own admission, has only climbed a handful of walls.
Good luck in your quest!
I would have bought one if I had had the money.
P.S. Chongo's tip of the day: use a Tibloc instead of a clove hitch on your 2:1 haul
John
[ This Message was edited by: johnhenry on 2002-08-16 10:00 ]
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kungfuclimber
Aug 16, 2002, 5:04 PM
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Brings up an interesting point..
What is the US (international?) law with regard to the copyright of books no longer in print. Truely it is illegal to plagerize such material but is it illegal to copy it when that is the only means of distribution?
I'd hate for this "big wall bible" to be a limited stock item!
I can imagine a pptp edited version doing good business with people on this site, nevermind shops (I'm sure the MEC would carry it).
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theclimer
Aug 16, 2002, 5:49 PM
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Quote:What is the US (international?) law with regard to the copyright of books no longer in print. Truely it is illegal to plagerize such material but is it illegal to copy it when that is the only means of distribution?
I'd hate for this "big wall bible" to be a limited stock item!
Perhaps we should pose this question to our good friend oozingpustule. He's a lawyer, after all...
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trevor
Anonymous Poster
Aug 16, 2002, 6:37 PM
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I'm just curious if Chongo would allow RC.com to buy several of these books and offer them for sale here.
If someone wants to contact Chongo and ask him, then I will arrange payment/delivery/etc for the book. But we will need to arrange a discounted price so it will be worth the effort to provide the service. If you are going to meet with him, then send me a PM or email.
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kungfuclimber
Aug 16, 2002, 6:49 PM
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Well.. The web helps those who help themselves
A quick search got me to this site:
www.fetc.org/fetcon/1199/copyright.html
The short version is that copies of the book cannot be legaly made unless a) the author has been dead for 70 years and over or b) the author gives permission. Clearly "b" is the prefered solution.
[ This Message was edited by: kungfuclimber on 2002-08-16 12:08 ]
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