|
areyoumydude
Jan 30, 2006, 3:36 AM
Post #1 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
I just thought I'd start a thread for you guys so that you don't have to highjack any other ones.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Ok.....go
|
|
|
|
|
veganboyjosh
Jan 30, 2006, 3:49 AM
Post #2 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 22, 2003
Posts: 1421
|
AWESOME.
i was thinking of the same thing today, when i's out climbing...
|
|
|
|
|
v_nuthin_ace
Jan 30, 2006, 3:51 AM
Post #3 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 12, 2005
Posts: 116
|
Good idea Larry.
joe your highline article shows the exact opposite stance, saying you will not make any move into the highline market, but now you claim to carry an array of highline gear. You sure do slither back and forth alot. You are saying yeah, i got highline gear, and there is printed material from your site saying your company will never sell highline gear.
And reaching out to the people who are better than you at what you want to do, is not sucking up, even in these community matters you sound like a business man. AND YOU EDITED THE WORDS SUCK UP THAT YOU WROTE AND REPLACED THEM WITH PAY HOMMAGE, DONT THINK I DIDN'T NOTICE. They are people and have opened their doors to many, not you, but that is because of your approach, not because they are not willing. Just because you can't make time to actually be out there doing the demos at climbing shows, and communing with fellow athletes, leads you to take the stance that they aren't out there because at the moment they have nothing to offer you.
Reply on the discrepency between what you say, and what is written in your highline article, if your "constant updates haven't changed it yet
And what about the fact that there were even websites with plenty of beginner and slackline info, 5-6 yrs ago, when you claim to come into it 3 yrs ago and say there was "nothing out there", and take credit for putting stuff out there, that actually was already out there.
I had no trouble learning everything from 20 ft lowlines to highline rigging from those same pre-joe people, and there was no initiation, or sucking up, just a respect for their knowledge and a willingness to learn. Perhaps your different reaction from them was due to your lack of one or both of those.
|
|
|
|
|
slacklinejoe
Jan 30, 2006, 5:13 AM
Post #4 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 5, 2003
Posts: 1423
|
And what exactly are you expecting me to say ?
That yes, I edit my text frequently. I should use the preview button more but I get caught up in emotion and hit submit only to realize that fast fingers are a bad thing when your not thinking clearly?
I'm exhausted - I covered a lot of ground today and a lot of routes for trying to rehab my wrists. I probably over did it and I'm dehydrated.
I typo, I edit, I re-word, I edit, I decide that was a bad thing to say and I really only put that there because I'm wound up, I edit. I do that a lot. Just understand that the last edit was what I meant by the time it all got said and I cooled off.
No matter how it all comes out, your just doing what you think is right from your perspective. Your full knowledge of me is from on here, where I'm most likely to screw up and put it up permanantly for the world to view.
I guess I should have put in the fine print "we don't MANUFACTURE" highline gear? Give me a break man, that site has 1,000's of pages of text. I'd love to offer highline gear but there are things holding me back on it, the biggest thing being liability concerns. Lawyers scare the hell out of me basically. The whole concept of building up a company only to have someone mis-use a product, get killed and loose it all or if not come out looking like a villian who doesn't care about people's lives?
It's easy to say I should design all this cool gear for highlines when you aren't risking getting in over your head and loosing what you cherish. Trust me, I've got tons of nifty ideas that haven't been tested. I guess if I had the balls and a good place to test it all I'd start making it but everyone else in the company doesn't want to take the risk either. I still have to worry about my employees too, they have a say in the company's risk taking as well.
As for as information: a lot of those sites are dead, scattered or incomplete. I admit, mine are no where complete either - I have plans but man there is a lot to post.
I went through the rockclimbing.com archives all the way back to the slackline forum's invention then searched all the stuff before that in the general threads. It took me over a month to read each and every one (can't say I remembered them all) but what I saw was 100 ways of doing things that had more drawbacks that the more currently used methods. By the time I got done I wasn't sure what in the hell actually worked right because you had so many people yelling different stuff. Random oddity: I had no idea ethos started off using ascenders in their rigs, while that design works obviously they chaged their focus. I tried a lot of the ways out any chance I could over the next few months. Some were ok, some were bunk. I started trying stuff out of the rigging books, that works but I didn't have the cash for pulleys (common trend on this forum) so I started tinkering. I looked across all sorts of sites on the web, a lot of them had conflicting info, some even recommended those damn orange petzl plastic pulleys (yeah that worked great for fragmenting plastic into my static rope). There was even step by step for twisting a stick into the line.
I guess all I'm trying to say is cummulative information needed re-organized and weeded out. No one told me to do it, it was something I wanted to do. There was info but it wasn't easy to sift through, going through rec.climbing was painful. That's changed a lot since I jumped in but even some of the sites that had the same goal as mine have already went under. What do you want me to say there: Yes there are people who are more versed in rigging that me - hell yes there is. Are there people who can out slack me - yep. I know I won't go down in the history books for slacking history, I'm not trying to - I do want to make it easier to get into though, and not just for climbers.
|
|
|
|
|
slacklinejoe
Jan 30, 2006, 5:25 AM
Post #5 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 5, 2003
Posts: 1423
|
Here, I posted below instead of editing:
Look if you want to bust me on staying in isolation just understand that last post from the previous thread. When barely started getting into making lines for my personal use and some friends + a couple ones that went on ebay to pay for said personal lines the two expereinced "professional" people who did reach out did so the basically A) Bitch slap me, B) threaten me. That's put me in defensive mode about the whole thing.
I didn't back down but it's been grating ever since. I didn't even have time to make it to the slacker rounds though comps before I had basically been told don't bother kid, your a useless idiot and a moron for ever thinking that a ratchet should ever be used to tighten a slackline even if it was soft-pointed out.
The people who tried it however, even the very experienced slackers with the expensive rigs, loved it. I decided to do a very slow and careful growth since I had a day job to only sell enough slacklines to pay for my climbing gear to get started. Well, people actually really liked them so I kept making them. After using them more and more I developed a lot of junk on my own to improve it and basically decided that isolation was ok since the web equalized us out. I couldn't afford to road trip the US and people seemed to find my stuff off the web easy enough. As of last year we started doing *small* comps locally. Crag cleanups, an OK bouldering comp, stuff like that.
As a company, we're growing crazy fast without hitting the major comps, I didn't have a huge reason to go since I couldn't get off work and had been burnt on the whole experienced slacker bit.
Yes, as of this year we've been getting more and more out of isolation. I actually do want to go do red rocks this year, last year I did try but didn't make it. No idea if I can, money is a little tied up trying to pay back school and things are uneasy at my day job.
|
|
|
|
|
uncleslackline
Jan 30, 2006, 5:54 AM
Post #6 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 13, 2004
Posts: 76
|
Joe the more you talk, the more you remove any doubt!
|
|
|
|
|
slacklinejoe
Jan 30, 2006, 5:59 AM
Post #7 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 5, 2003
Posts: 1423
|
In reply to: Joe the more you talk, the more you remove any doubt!
I'm really not sure how to address you, one half of me wants to just ignore you (kill file perhaps), the other have wants you to say what you really think and don't leave anything out. Basically, I know there is zero I could say that would change your mind about me so I don't try to. I don't doubt your place in the grand scheme of things, but I'm not sure you come across the way you really mean to.
Perhaps you need a separate thread though?
I'll just be glad when everyone gets it out of their systems, including myself. I'm tired of the bad aura in here, maybe isolationism is the answer for another while. Originally I'd have thought you'd be excited that I was getting more newbies into the sport en-mass, that meant more sport awareness in general and the more people in the sport who might go with your gear, maybe it didn't turn out that way, but I certainly didn't aim for the current disdain I get from you.
|
|
|
|
|
rockbel
Jan 30, 2006, 6:42 AM
Post #8 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 4, 2004
Posts: 90
|
so does anyone know why I can't access the user information for v_n_a? I was looking up the history of these fellows posts to figure out why all the angst...looks like uncle is actually part of the Slackline Bro's company...and I was wondering who v_n_a worked for. Seemed to me like this was getting a little overly heated to just be about slacklining...and oh look I was right. Has Uncle stated in any of these latest posts that he is Joe's buisness competition???? Sounds to me like someone is a little threatened by the new kid on the block...just food for thought...
and really, why can't I see the other bio?
|
|
|
|
|
coldclimb
Jan 30, 2006, 6:43 AM
Post #9 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 14, 2002
Posts: 6909
|
To me, this is ridiculous. I'm sorry that this has to happen. Or does it really? Can these differences not be resolved? In a sport as young and non-influential as ours, I think we need all the help we can get.
|
|
|
|
|
slacklinejoe
Jan 30, 2006, 6:52 AM
Post #10 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 5, 2003
Posts: 1423
|
Well, I'm open to (realistic) ideas.
We're growing but we're not that big yet, overly harsh divisions aren't conductive to growth.
I mean, we do all want the sport to grow right?
|
|
|
|
|
v_nuthin_ace
Jan 30, 2006, 3:19 PM
Post #11 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 12, 2005
Posts: 116
|
v nuthin ace has NOTHING TO SELL, and makes his living elsewhere than the slackline arena
his "angst" comes from joe's treatment of experienced veterans of the sport, and his loading of ambiguous info and subject changing attempts, on one of my first posts here, on an otherwise specific thread. Typical forum bullying on his part, and it was wrong for me to return him his own medicine.
i'm sure giving joe a taste of his own medicine is childish, but he bullied me the first time i ever posted here, and he has run off multiple high level slackers.
Joe you began the divisiveness a while back, unfortunately i have given you an out now, by returning the favor, and now letting you blame it on me.
|
|
|
|
|
slacklinejoe
Jan 30, 2006, 5:27 PM
Post #12 of 12
(2991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 5, 2003
Posts: 1423
|
Nope, I don't think it's any fault of yours that this came to a head. I never said you had something to sell. You may have your own personal affiliations, that's to be expected.
If your first post is the cause, this board is flooded with newbies and in general it's usually safer to assume they aren't experts in the field, so yes I go overboard in explaining a lot of background info.
Debating about whether a threaded line is more effort to set or not in an identical setup (i.e. identical distance and drop) - thats small stuff. I was trying to follow the line of thinking that from an engineering standpoint (and personal experience) setting the tension in the line was going to be reached with the same peak pulling from the person but with less system throw, you were talking from personal experience that it was the other way around. Nothing was concluded either way.
Debating about line swing weight - that too is a physics thing (notice a trend) and I wish to god I would have found the formula to prove mathematically what I "feel". Without repeatable independant analysis by others or some physics to back it up, that feel thing is really subjective. That too is pretty small beans and I certainly didn't start debating with malice.
I'm curious as to who you say I've scared off. To my mind I've only disagreed strongly in my debates with a couple people - those who simply felt that ratchets had zero place in the slackline sport and never followed any sort of logical debate. Yes, I disagreed with that, I was told it couldn't be done and it did work. I was then told it shouldn't be done, but the why was some ethics violation that appeared to be sent down from an official representative from the governing body of slacklines that just so happened to be in the form of competitors who had their best interests in me backing out of the market. I'm still a bit throw off by that, if they truely thought my gear was bunk, why not let me sell a few and then let them highly publicize the gear failures or that fact that everyone thought it sucked (neither happened though).
Of course I wasn't going to be overly concerned by that, they try to tell me that since they don't think it's ethical that it won't work and that despite being 2,000 + units (yes, that's a guess, I don't know how many without running the numbers) out there that "no one uses them".
Now I will grant you that when I first started posting I was fairly overzealous. Most people who are that into a sport usually are. There are people who heavily pushed their methods as well, i.e. 3 biner vs four biner debates that go on for pages too. Or someone insisting that those people using biners (successfully) are full of B.S. and to be a real slacker you've gotta buy this particular pulley set.
I did catch some attention for it in addition to those others. I guess, but I always felt I was being reasonable by usually providing links to everyone's gear and saying there are pros and cons to each setup, listing them and then saying for the slacker to select what worked for their particular needs. Something no one else seemed to be acknowledging - that not every slacker had the same needs in a system.
Despite that most post up about as often as they did prior, they just try and take personal pot shots at me every chance they get, or a few just ignore that topic in general and post up the other stuff they normally would.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
