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wude72
Nov 1, 2010, 1:45 AM
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Something to think about... http://tperkblog.com/2010/10/climbing-industry
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MS1
Nov 1, 2010, 3:23 PM
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wude72 wrote: Something to think about... http://tperkblog.com/2010/10/climbing-industry
From-the-link: wrote: My goal in laying out what I am about to expound is not to whine, complain, or through my rant seek to gain, but only to raise some questions, and hopefully stimulate some thought regarding the media-driven star mania, and lack of support for the people who really make it happen for the climbing industry. My main question is why, when the people who put up climbing routes, build trails, maintain the quality and safety of routes, and put all their time, money, and energy into furthering the quantity and quality of climbing routes and areas are largely ignored by the companies who directly benefit from the efforts of those individuals. Without new areas, and new routes to challenge the upcoming generations of new climbers, (and old), a stagnation of motivation and sales momentum would set in, and the industry would not be growing as steadily as it is. I know from personal experience that the climbing community at large is very appreciative and grateful for the efforts of route developers, if at times overly critical of the quality of their work, by and large they are complimentary and considerate. The industry, on the other hand, and I must say that this does not include everyone, but for the most part they seem to adopt a defensive, competitive attitude that reeks of either jealousy, or resentment of the time and ability that they wish they possessed. But when it comes to the obviously talented rock-climbing star, they bow down in gracious obeisance to the almost subconscious media-hyping star worship paradigm so ingrained in our modern culture of sports figure worship, not even acknowledging that while the efforts of these athletes are admirable, even if they are developing their own routes, less than 1% of the climbing community at large will ever be able to try their routes, whereas the anonymous route developer who is maxing out credit cards to afford hardware is directly stimulating the sales and use of the companies products without credit or support given. Again, I must put in a disclaimer for the few companies who do recognize and support the efforts of those who do much more for the sport than pose up the ads, and perpetuate the starry-eyed hero-worship culture we are so constantly distracted with as Americans. There are those who do recognize the priceless efforts of the anonymous route-developer, and I personally am grateful for the support I have received over the years, but all of my support has been given by friends in that industry, not necessarily by the industry itself. In other words, if not for who I have known, I would not even have the support I do have. So, in conclusion, I think that it is time that American companies start to recognize the invaluable contributions that lone route developers make to the perpetuation of their continued profits, and institute programs that reward the efforts of route developers. I think that in doing so, people who develop routes will be more inspired, informed, and educated regarding the proper hardware to be using for safety and longevity, and will have the resources to create a quality climbing experience for everyone.
Seems to me that marketers care about what attracts people to their products, not about rewarding people for their contributions to the community. Developing routes is a public service but it isn't necessarily exciting to see photos of. The bottom line is that people who want to sell products need cool photos and high-end climbers do cool-looking stuff. Note that the same effect applies in many other sports; very few people ride like Lance, but it's his picture that sells bike shwag to the slow-pedalling masses.
Also, try using your return key occasionally. You'll be surprised how much you like it.
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USnavy
Nov 1, 2010, 4:39 PM
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hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class.
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majid_sabet
Nov 1, 2010, 5:18 PM
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USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class.
be nice soldier
(This post was edited by majid_sabet on Dec 19, 2010, 4:27 AM)
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wude72
Nov 1, 2010, 5:28 PM
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Haven't you ever read 100 years of solitude? That Nobel prize winner goes on for two pages without a period. By the way, what is language class?
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gmggg
Nov 1, 2010, 5:59 PM
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USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class.
If you're gonna be a grammar nazi...
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spikeddem
Nov 1, 2010, 6:25 PM
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wude72 wrote: Haven't you ever read 100 years of solitude? That Nobel prize winner goes on for two pages without a period. By the way, what is language class?
Writing is like music. What sounds good doesn't always jive with theory, and what theory predicts would sound good doesn't always sound good. In this case you've combined the two: you've got what doesn't sound good and doesn't jive with theory.
You (assuming you're the author) don't even say what you want. You say that perhaps the industry should "reward" developers. Should they give developers left over Halloween candy? A high five? Money? Bolts? A few developers' photos on the side of the next 5.10 box of shoes?
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spikeddem
Nov 1, 2010, 6:32 PM
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In reply to: I think that in doing so, people who develop routes will be more inspired, informed, and educated regarding the proper hardware to be using for safety and longevity, and will have the resources to create a quality climbing experience for everyone.
I have to address this point, too. Why would they be more informed? Why would they be more "educated regarding the proper hardware to be using . . ."? In my opinion, even IF your reward thing (whatever you decide it should be) was in place, only the ones that are already inspired and knowledgeable should receive such "compensation."
(This post was edited by spikeddem on Nov 1, 2010, 6:32 PM)
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jt512
Nov 1, 2010, 6:46 PM
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gmggg wrote: USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class. If you're gonna be a grammar nazi...
. . . then capitalize "Nazi"?
Jay
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guangzhou
Nov 2, 2010, 5:29 AM
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wude72 wrote: Something to think about... http://tperkblog.com/2010/10/climbing-industry
I develop routes and most people have never of me. I don't get rpess in the climbing media, but climbing companies have been very supportive of my efforts. Overall, I can't complain bout the support I get from the climbing companies, or the climbers I meet.
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gmggg
Nov 2, 2010, 2:43 PM
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jt512 wrote: gmggg wrote: USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class. If you're gonna be a grammar nazi... . . . then capitalize "Nazi"? Jay
Right after you capitalize god.
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jt512
Nov 2, 2010, 3:00 PM
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gmggg wrote: jt512 wrote: gmggg wrote: USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class. If you're gonna be a grammar nazi... . . . then capitalize "Nazi"? Jay Right after you capitalize god.
Weke comeback; and you not only did you fail to capitalize "God," you failed to enclose it quotation marks. As a grammar Nazi, you'd barely make the rank of private.
Jay
(This post was edited by jt512 on Nov 2, 2010, 3:08 PM)
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areyoumydude
Nov 2, 2010, 8:17 PM
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jt512 wrote: gmggg wrote: jt512 wrote: gmggg wrote: USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class. If you're gonna be a grammar nazi... . . . then capitalize "Nazi"? Jay Right after you capitalize god. Weke comeback; and you not only did you fail to capitalize "God," you failed to enclose it quotation marks. As a grammar Nazi, you'd barely make the rank of Mann. Jay
Fixed
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phang_nga
Dec 19, 2010, 4:04 AM
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USnavy wrote: hmmm... you have a single sentence that is comprised of almost a hundred words and you have a single paragraph that should be split into five paragraphs. This is why you should have not slept during language class.
The "H" in hmmm should be capitalized.
Your first sentence would be much more readable if it was broken up into two sentences.
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notapplicable
Dec 19, 2010, 8:32 AM
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wude72 wrote: Haven't you ever read 100 years of solitude? That Nobel prize winner goes on for two pages without a period. By the way, what is language class?
Bwwaaaaaahahahahahah...!!
Did you just compare yourself, or who ever wrote that, to Márquez? Thats the funniest thing I've read since Nicholas Sparks opened his retarded mouth to USA Today and said...
"A Farewell to Arms, by Hemingway. Good stuff. That's what I write," he says, putting it back. "That's what I write."
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j_ung
Dec 19, 2010, 2:01 PM
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From-the-link: wrote: My main question is why, when the people who put up climbing routes, build trails, maintain the quality and safety of routes, and put all their time, money, and energy into furthering the quantity and quality of climbing routes and areas are largely ignored by the companies who directly benefit from the efforts of those individuals.
I don't think that's necessarily true. Most, if not every, 501c3 climbing org in America enjoys assistance from gear makers. The LCO I serve on gets thousands of dollars every year for anchor replacement and trail building. Sometimes, as in the case of the Access Fund, that sponsorship is massive. The climbing industry should be applauded for such efforts!
And as for route development, I'm not convinced commercialization would be a good thing.
In reply to: My goal in laying out what I am about to expound is not to whine, complain, or through my rant seek to gain...
Sorry, but everything you wrote after this opening phrase seems to contradict it.
Edit: From my Access Fund link:
In reply to: corporate partners The following businesses generously support the Access Fund. Please support them! Above the Clouds - $100,000+ Mountain Gear - 1996 Outdoor Research -1999 prAna - 1993 The North Face - 1992 Titanium - $50,000+ Black Diamond Equipment, LTD - 1991 Mammut - 1991 MSR® - 1993 Petzl - 1995 Therm-a-Rest® - 1993 Diamond Plus - $35,000+ Recreational Equipment, Inc. (REI) - 1991 Diamond - $20,000+ Alpinist Magazine Climbing Magazine Dead Point Magazine Marmot - 1992 Rock & Ice Magazine Urban Climber Magazine Platinum Plus - $15,000+ Clif Bar & Company - 1994 Osprey - 2003 Platinum - $10,000+ eGrips Climbing Holds - 1998 GORE-TEX® Products - 1991 Mountain Hardwear - 1998 Stanley - 2010 Stonewear Designs - 1998 Touchstone Climbing, Inc. - 2002 Trango - 1998 Gold Plus - $7,500+ SCARPA North America - 2006 Gold - $5,000+ Campmor - 1991 La Sportiva - 1991 Mountain Khakis - 2006 New England Ropes - 1992 Rock’n Jam’n - 2008 The Spot Bouldering Gym - Silver - $2,500+ Arc’teryx - 1993 BlueWater Ropes - 1991 Falcon Guides - 1991 Mad Rock - 2008 Metolius - 1991 Momentum Media PR - 2008 Outdoor Retailer Schoeller - 2009 Sterling Rope Company - 1994 SuperTopo.com - 2003 Rothschild - 2010 Major - $1,000+ CAMP USA - 2004 Clear Future Markerboards - 2010 Drive Current - 2010 Fixed Pin Publishing - 2008 Fox Mountain Guides & Climbing School - 2005 Moosejaw - 2008 Pacific Edge Climbing Gym - 2003 Professional Climbers International (PCI) - 2010 Spadout.com - 2009 Treasure Mountain Inn - 2005 Vertical World Inc. - 2008 Yates Gear Inc. - 1991 Contributing - $500+ Alpine Ascents International - 1998 Avery Brewing Company - 1995 DMM Excalibur - 1995 Evolve Sports - 2007 GearEXPRESS.com - Got it Real Estate and Development - 2010 Haven Housewrights, LLC - 2009 Higher Ground Roasters - 2006 Julbo - 2005 Liberty Mountain Climbing - 1992 Mountain Tools - 1991 New Belgium Brewing Company - 2008 Oskar Blues Brewery - 2009 Outdoor Utah Adventure - 2010 Rab - 2010 Red Chili - 1995 Rocks and Ropes of Tucson Stone Age Climbing - Tom K. Michael, DDS, PS - Trailspace.com - 2010 Upslope Brewing Company - 2009 Vandalian Restaurant - 2010 Verde PR & Consulting - 2009 Supporting - $250+ Alpine Endeavors Eastern Mountain Sports (EMS) - 1991 Hilleberg the Tentmaker - 2010 Intelligentsia - 2010 Omega Pacific - 1991 Pagoda Climbing - 2010 Rock & Snow - 2005 Wild Country - 1995 Zeal Optics - 2009 MEDIA PARTNERS Alister & Paine Andrew Burr Photography Andrew Kornylak Photography Andy Mann Photography Aurora Photos Big Up Productions Boulder Weekly Corey Rich Photography Dave Vuono Photography Eric Draper Photography Jay Beyer Imaging Jim Thornburg Photography John Evans Photography Josh McCulloch Photography Keith Ladzinski Photography Kevin Steele Photography Kyler Deutmeyer Photography Mountain Project.com Muderlak Photography Ousley Creative Randall Levensaler Photography Rockclimbing.com Sender Films Troy Mayr Photography
(This post was edited by j_ung on Dec 19, 2010, 2:08 PM)
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deschamps1000
Dec 19, 2010, 4:35 PM
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The climbing industry is incredibly supportive of grass-roots activism. I used to run an annual comp that benefited local access. It was amazing how much gear companies would send us to give out as prizes.
Now, supporting new routes is a different story.
1. There are plenty of people that will put up new routes regardless of whether or not a company supports them in doing so.
2. I very much question the idea that we should encourage more people to go out and develop routes. Not all pieces of stone need to be bolted, and I do not see any reason to encourage more people to start climbing.
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