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detourdave
Jun 21, 2002, 9:15 PM
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I was climbing at Moores Wall NC with a friend of mine. He was leading and kept falling just below the crux of the route (Quaker State). Every other time he fell he put in another piece of gear to protect the crux. On one of these falls something happened that I have only seen once before, the sheath of the rope broke and peeled up along the core about 2 feet . Needless to say, we were a little freaked out, especially when it was the carabineer that caused this. Here is how it happened; he had about 4 pieces protecting the crux and several of the pieces were clipped to the same biner weighting it from multiple directions (mistake) although mostly from the top. When he fell, the rope ran along the joint between the gate and the biner instead of settling in to one end of the biner. That joint on most biners is a notch which is machined with very sharp edges and that was enough to actually cut the rope on a small fall, maybe 6 feet. If the wall was longer, it may have started to cut into the core also. Now I only use wire gates on the rope end of my runners and I only clip the non-wires to the gear.
Has anyone ever heard of this happening before and should I spread the word, or is it a freak occurrence from setting up a multi-directional anchor poorly?
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cedk
Jun 21, 2002, 9:42 PM
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I think that's a serious problem. With carabiners
It's something that's worried me since I came across a Petzl Spirit that had an edge so sharp it could almost draw blood. I sent that spirit back and they replaced it with one that was slightly better but for 10 bucks you'd think they could have some quality control. I probably won't buy any more Spirits. Some cheaper 'biners actualy seem better in this repsect. The Metolius I have are very smooth. As are all my wiregates.
This question seems to have been double posted.
[ This Message was edited by: cedk on 2002-06-21 14:44 ]
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killclimbz
Jun 21, 2002, 9:56 PM
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I have never seen this, but there have been a few posts lately about similar issues with carabiners. Is it possible that this carabiner had some abuse that caused the burr or was it a new one? Just curious. I have always found Petzl to be one of the better quality companies, but then again I don't own very many of their biners.
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pelliott
Jun 21, 2002, 9:58 PM
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What you are talking about is a cross loaded biner. The chances of this happening are increased when you have pro from multiple directions clipped into the biner.
The biner inverts due to the wide angle of the forces from the pro. I would agree though that cutting the rope just shouldn't happen even on a cross load. I would contact the manufacturer and find out what they have to say. Please post the results.
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detourdave
Jun 24, 2002, 4:03 PM
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This was a regular biner, the slot where the gate attaches to the biner had very sharp machined edges - this is actually true of a lot of biners, except wiregates, so beware.
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rickoldskool
Jun 24, 2002, 5:22 PM
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Dave, next time post your topic in just ONE forum. Trad and beginners? You clutter the site more than it already is.
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detourdave
Jun 24, 2002, 6:15 PM
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Yeah, I know I double posted - I posted this in beginner and then tried to move it to trad and couldn't figure out how to do that. Sorry about the clutter but now I know what I am doing.
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cedk
Jun 24, 2002, 6:32 PM
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What brand and model of 'biner? PM me if you'd rather not say for some reason.
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detourdave
Jun 24, 2002, 6:43 PM
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It was an REI brand biner, the ones with the gold gate. A "D" with a straight gate. The biner and the rope were in great condition - the rope was cut on a regular manufactured feature of the biner, the joint between the gate and the D.
It is not really REI, or their manufacturers fault. It is a common "feature" of all non-wire biners actually. The u-slot that joints the gate to the D or Oval body of the biner can have very sharp edges. This is why I only put wires on the rope side of a quick draw or runner now. The circumstances that lead to the rope shave are rare, granted, but if it happened to us 20' off the ground, it could happen to anyone 20 pitches up a big wall.
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punk
Jun 24, 2002, 6:52 PM
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It very hard to picture how did the rope came to contact with the biner most likely it will be a biner failure before rope in cross loading case
A diagram with the pro situ, the rock and the way the rope runs through the biner will help greatly in a trying to analyze what happen
Climb safe
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