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ubotch
Aug 23, 2002, 8:24 PM
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I don't know if this has been covered before but if it has I could not find it.
I am just wondering if someone could explain how it works to me. It sounds interesting but the little that I read on it just confused me more. Is pro used? Do you need a short rope? Is it only done in special circumstances? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
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dustinap
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Aug 23, 2002, 8:37 PM
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As a note, I've simul climbed a total of about 6 pitches, and like 2 of them were 4th class, the other two were around 5.4 or 5.5. I'm probably not the most educated person to ask, but here is how it worked.
The leader and the second are both roped up as normal, the follower belays like he/she normally would, and then when you're out of rope, the second will start climbing after taking the leader "off belay". The two climbers should keep up with each other, meaning that there shouldn't be more slack in the rope then you'd have on a normal belay. The leader still must place gear, or eventually the two would be simul freesoloing.
One of the technical pitches i've simul climbed was in Toulumne. The rap anchor was down hill from the bolted belay. The leader, a memeber of this site, clipped into the anchor with slings, and started walking down the rock. He weighs alot more then me, I probably could have fallen with these circumstances and not even moved him.
[ This Message was edited by: dustinap on 2002-08-23 13:38 ]
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madscientist
Aug 23, 2002, 8:43 PM
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I find this interesting to be in a beginner forum. Simul-climbing is not for beginners. You should be pretty sure that you are not going to fall, and your partner should be sure that they are not going to fall. Also, you don't want your partner to fall.
When two people are simul-climbing, they are attached together by a rope, and gear is generally placed between the two climbers and attached to the rope in the normal manner. When the leader falls, the weight of the second acts as the belay. When the rope becomes tight, the leader stops falling. Until recently, when the second falls, the leader had to hold him up or fall himself. They both then fall onto the gear. This is very dangerous. There is a device called a tibloc that will prevent this from happening.
Simul-climbing is generally used when the climbing is really easy for both climbers. It is a scary and dangerous way to climb, but it can cut the climbing time in half and thus it is used in the mountains to move faster. There is no need to simul-climb if speed is not an issue.
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dustinap
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Aug 23, 2002, 8:50 PM
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also, for the tibloc to be effective you'll need a couple of them, the tibloc will get put on a piece of gear. The piece of gear may very well get cleaned by the second while both climbers are still climbing. This is the reason why you might need a couple of them.
BTW, simul climbing is not recommend for beginners, and is NOT a beginner technique.
[ This Message was edited by: dustinap on 2002-08-23 13:50 ]
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ubotch
Aug 23, 2002, 9:43 PM
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Thanks for the info. I've only been leading trad for about 6 months so I will stay away from simul-climbing for now. Its good to get that cleared up though.
Thanks again
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dustinap
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Aug 23, 2002, 9:45 PM
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You could always practice simul climbing on 4th class or 5.0 or something. You may need to simul climb someday.
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pbjosh
Aug 23, 2002, 9:57 PM
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simuling is a great skill to have in the mountains but it requires you to be really solid (it's closer to a more secure form of free soloing than it is to traditionally belayed climbing) and to know that your partner is really solid.
I usually simul on easy routes, I've even simuled up to 5.8. Here are some times and #'s of pitches for routes to give you an idea:
E Buttress of Whitney with optional 5.8 start - maybe 9 pitches - in 3:20 simulclimbed entire thing
N Arete of Bear Creek Spire 5.8 - 10 pitches - belayed 2 5.8 pitches, simuled 8 pitches, 5 hours
Tahquitz Rock - Hard Lark, West Lark, East Lark - total of 18 pitches up to 5.7 all three routes in ~5 hours including descending 3 times and eating lunch in the middle of it all, not even hurrying.
Again, simuling is great but it requires a lot of trust and you should definitely not simul anything that is remotely "difficult" for you, whatever level that is.
josh
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stevematthys
Aug 23, 2002, 11:04 PM
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yea, make sure the leader is placing pro because if he does not place pro and he falls then you are both going to eat shit.
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stevematthys
Aug 23, 2002, 11:04 PM
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yea, make sure the leader is placing pro because if he does not place pro and he falls then you are both going to eat shit.
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