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cellfish
Aug 23, 2002, 7:43 PM
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I've been spotting a lot of boulders in my neck of the woods covered in moss. What's everyone's take on the ethical question of cleaning them of?
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climblouisiana
Aug 23, 2002, 7:54 PM
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Avoid doing it. The boulders could be in an evvironmentally sensitive area.
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jds100
Aug 23, 2002, 8:06 PM
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Check with other climbers and boulderers about the status of access and relationships with landowners and managers of public lands. Usually, if it isn't your private property, don't alter the environment. I've seen it personally come back to bite the whole local climbing community, when inconsiderate and selfish rogue climbers chose to just do whatever they wanted.
I second the concern about the environmental impact, too, as well as the access impact.
[ This Message was edited by: jds100 on 2002-08-23 13:08 ]
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cellfish
Aug 24, 2002, 2:29 AM
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OK, question answered. Thanks
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mcsosar3456
Aug 24, 2002, 3:08 AM
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what? i think that placing bolts causes more long term change to the environment than removing moss from some boulders. unless there is some type of endangered moss or whatever there, i say go a head and clean the problems on the boulders. you dont have to get rid of all the moss, just the stuff actually in the way of the problem, like on the holds.
most of the boulders in new england have to be regularly cleaned of moss otherwise they would be unclimbable. same thing for a number of routes.
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needtolearnhowtoclimb
Aug 24, 2002, 4:00 AM
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burn it all? now dont burn it. make an outfit out of it and wear it climbing.
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psych
Aug 24, 2002, 4:02 AM
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Nah dude, don't burn it OR wear it, if it's thick use it as a crashpad!
Mike...
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topher
Aug 24, 2002, 4:05 AM
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ok living in a rain forst yo-u come a cross some moss. out im my neck of the woods, if you didnt clean the moss off you wouldnt climb. all you socal climbers are to dam lucky. so clean the stuff then climb it.
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cellfish
Aug 24, 2002, 4:39 PM
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OK thanks again. So I leave the endangered moss, but clean the rest. Got it. Or can I just transplant the endagered stuff to a national moss sanctuary?
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billcoe_
Aug 24, 2002, 5:06 PM
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Yup: and don't walk on the ground either. Ya just don't know how many environmentally sensitive species you are destroying. It's people like you - walking on the ground: that give the rest of us a bad name.
Just stay home and surf porn on the computer all day, don't leave your house: otherwise, you will be killing thousands of micro-organisms and plants. Hey, probably even insects.
Hope that helps:
Bill
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psych
Aug 24, 2002, 5:44 PM
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I don't think it's so much about "preserving endangered moss", as it is about preserving the scene nature has created. Lots of things rely on that moss, but mostly just bugs which I have issues with. Hate bugs.
Anyways, back to my point. Thick thick moss won't grow back anytime soon, and by ripping it off to clean a possibly good line it's kind of a one way thing, you can't just put it back. What if the line sucks? What if it's the only one in the area, no one's going to come back. I think it's different if it's in an established crag, but defenitely check with other FA's and boulderers who have established routes there. Respect the decisions of those who came before ya, if they left it because it would make the place look like crap, maybe they have a point.
I guess climbing and a respect for nature are almost at opposite ends of the scale, since by climbing we change the cliff faces (removing moss, and lichen and other bits), but I think it's important to keep as much respect for the natural area as we can.
Mike...
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mcsosar3456
Aug 24, 2002, 8:03 PM
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are there any endangered mosses? i mean its only moss.
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apollodorus
Aug 24, 2002, 9:08 PM
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The moss could be a breeding habitat for the endangered West Nile Virus, so you better leave it alone. Otherwise, the virus might become extinct.
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krustyklimber
Aug 25, 2002, 1:41 PM
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Peel 'em and lay it at the base for bouldering pads!!!
Around here we are rescrubbing routes and problems all the time, moss grows back soon after climbers stop climbing on it.
Jeff
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john1987
Aug 26, 2002, 3:50 AM
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I would'nt mess with it. Just find another climb.
John
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krustyklimber
Aug 28, 2002, 6:54 PM
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Most places that grow moss don't only grow it on certain boulders and routes, it grows everywhere on rocks, trees, boulders, cars that sit more than a year... anything that holds still...
Peeling a couple boudlers, or routes, isn't going to have much of an effect on an ecosystem...
Most of the moss on these boulders gets wiped out each spring when this slope avalanches, and/or it gets gathered by animals for home building material, birds gather tons of it to line their nests with.
Not far from this spot is a V1 boulder problem I have to rescrub every time I go there!
My neihgbors to the north and I live in a temperate rain forest everything is coated in moss... you cannot just go find another problem that isn't covered in moss without walking to a different climate zone!
It is as silly as me saying don't ever remove lichens fron rock, or put chalk on them, or step on the grass around the base, or lay your crash pad down blocking the sun from reaching small oranisms in the dirt.
This is environmentalism gone crazy! The same kind of thinking says we should stay out of the wilderness so it will remain unspoiled. Then we wouldn't know it and love it... so why would we protect it!
We don't have to impact the land as much as our forebearers, but we don't need to run to the opposite extreme either!
Toss the Moss!!!
Jeff
[ This Message was edited by: krustyklimber on 2002-08-28 11:56 ]
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