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jstp
May 28, 2004, 2:12 PM
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just saw those as well. notice the red death mark above the gates? not useable for sure. as for collectible value dunno, but not much i suspect. mostly for a reminder of a bygone era i suppose, sorta like racking all your nuts on the classic choinard oval for show. ... though i did hear tell of RR 'biners that were hollow for low weight. apparently didn't save much weight, made them sorta bulky and they tended to break. weren't very popular for obvious reasons, but i wouldn't mind tracking one of those down to take a look. --
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thegreytradster
May 28, 2004, 2:34 PM
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In reply to: ... though i did hear tell of RR 'biners that were hollow for low weight. apparently didn't save much weight, made them sorta bulky and they tended to break. weren't very popular for obvious reasons, but i wouldn't mind tracking one of those down to take a look. --
Two brands of hollow biners were made in the late 70's early 80's.
Choinard made an oval and Salwea made a asymetric D. I've got a few of both and still use them for racking, cameras, etc. They aren't bulky and about as light as modern ultralight wire gates. They weren't around long as they were about twice as expensive as conventional biners. There were also some incidents of them cuting and breaking on thin CrMo bolt hangers.
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jstp
May 28, 2004, 2:46 PM
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Got any pics of those hollow 'biners? i would really like to see one.
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thegreytradster
May 28, 2004, 3:01 PM
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The Choinard's are almost indistingushable from the old ovals until you pick one up, (other than a oval rather than round cross section on the spine). The Salweas' look a lot like a black diamond light D except larger in all respects. Also oval spine.
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brianinslc
May 28, 2004, 5:27 PM
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In reply to: The Choinard's are almost indistingushable from the old ovals until you pick one up, (other than a oval rather than round cross section on the spine). The Salweas' look a lot like a black diamond light D except larger in all respects. Also oval spine.
Yeah, kinda sorta. My Robbin's biners are very similar to the Coonyard hollow biners. I wouldn't be surprised if both were made by Salewa.
The chouinard hollow model is a bit thinner than their oval and looks flatter at a glance too.
My Robbins Ultralights were one of my first carabiners. I still carry one on my nut tool. Have a bunch kickin' around somewhere. If I remember, I'll shoot a pic of a hollow Chouinard and a Robbins for comparison.
Neat old biners. The ebay models almost look like the heavier Chouinard ovals. Wouldn't be surprised if Chouinard or Salewa made them. Pretty sure Robbin's didn't make carabiners, but, his names shows up on a bunchy of stuff from ice axes to clothing...
Was at the gym here in SLC (Rockreation) a few years back...noticed an older gentleman bouldering with perfecto footwork, very distinguished looking...and I was pretty sure I recognized him. Went over the desk to ask... Kid working had signed him in and had him fill out the standard waiver. Was readin' the name and exclaimed, "hey, I got a shirt with that name on it". I guess Royal just smiled and nodded. Kid was pretty embarrassed. Way too funny.
Brian in SLC
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fredbob
May 28, 2004, 6:12 PM
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If memory serves me correctly, the RR hollow biners were made by Salewa. RR never manufactured any hardware himself, but Salewa offered some of its products to be imprinted with other brand names. The hollow RRs are oval in shape.
As I recall, they didn't hold up well to use and grooves from hangers/wired stoppers wear suggested that well used ones might not sustain a big fall. I remember seeing a few broken ones at the base of El Cap (they didn't survive the fall), whereas, other brands of biners we scavenged at the base seemed perfectly fine (but probably had some unseen metal damage).
But, to address the original post, yes these are collectable. What are they worth? Well...
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ambler
May 28, 2004, 6:36 PM
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Before the hollow ovals, RR marketed a lightweight solid oval. I'm not sure whether those are the ones shown. They weren't very strong, but worked well for racking, carabiner brake rappels, or as etrier biners.
As for those old Chouinard/Salewa D's marked "tested" -- I believe there was a bad batch of those things that had to be recalled for testing (a high fraction, more than 10%, would fail as I recall). The biners that passed the recall testing were then stamped "tested" and returned to service. These were not the first generation of Chouinard D's, however -- at least one or two earlier versions, made by Chouinard himself, preceded them.
In my closet I have a few of these fossils. If they get valuable, I'd be happy to know.
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