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pendereki
Dec 9, 2008, 3:23 AM
Post #26 of 60
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johnwesely wrote: jt512 wrote: johnwesely wrote: Wiregates are the easiest to clip so the climbaxe ones would be just as easy to clip as any other. Thank you for your expert opinion. Jay Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can and I didn't.
Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden...
Oh wait, I can't and I did.
Don't buy crap.
CM
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currupt4130
Dec 9, 2008, 4:43 AM
Post #27 of 60
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pendereki wrote: johnwesely wrote: jt512 wrote: johnwesely wrote: Wiregates are the easiest to clip so the climbaxe ones would be just as easy to clip as any other. Thank you for your expert opinion. Jay Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can and I didn't. Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can't and I did. Don't buy crap. CM
I'll second the "Don't buy crap". Spend a few extra bucks to get something tested and true. I get sketched out when one of my partners pulls out her Rock Empire cams... I pull the trigger and the freaking thing folds over.
It's my opinion that when you pay the few extra bucks for BD or Petzl over some no name crap from Madrock or climbaxe you get the dedication to quality that is so well established with them and not the other guys. I'll pay my few extra bucks knowing full well that BD and Petzl have a firm history of good gear and extensive testing and quality control (less the Zephyr phenomenon)
(This post was edited by currupt4130 on Dec 9, 2008, 4:45 AM)
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USnavy
Dec 9, 2008, 8:39 AM
Post #28 of 60
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johnwesely wrote: Wiregates are the easiest to clip so the climbaxe ones would be just as easy to clip as any other.
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johnwesely
Dec 9, 2008, 1:17 PM
Post #29 of 60
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currupt4130 wrote: pendereki wrote: johnwesely wrote: jt512 wrote: johnwesely wrote: Wiregates are the easiest to clip so the climbaxe ones would be just as easy to clip as any other. Thank you for your expert opinion. Jay Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can and I didn't. Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can't and I did. Don't buy crap. CM I'll second the "Don't buy crap". Spend a few extra bucks to get something tested and true. I get sketched out when one of my partners pulls out her Rock Empire cams... I pull the trigger and the freaking thing folds over. It's my opinion that when you pay the few extra bucks for BD or Petzl over some no name crap from Madrock or climbaxe you get the dedication to quality that is so well established with them and not the other guys. I'll pay my few extra bucks knowing full well that BD and Petzl have a firm history of good gear and extensive testing and quality control (less the Zephyr phenomenon)
I have had 6 of the climbaxe draws for over a year now, and they are my favorite draws except for the short sling.
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jt512
Dec 9, 2008, 1:59 PM
Post #30 of 60
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johnwesely wrote: currupt4130 wrote: pendereki wrote: johnwesely wrote: jt512 wrote: johnwesely wrote: Wiregates are the easiest to clip so the climbaxe ones would be just as easy to clip as any other. Thank you for your expert opinion. Jay Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can and I didn't. Gee whiz, I guess if I was really really strong like you and could redpoint .12s I would get super picky and annoying about gear all of a sudden... Oh wait, I can't and I did. Don't buy crap. CM I'll second the "Don't buy crap". Spend a few extra bucks to get something tested and true. I get sketched out when one of my partners pulls out her Rock Empire cams... I pull the trigger and the freaking thing folds over. It's my opinion that when you pay the few extra bucks for BD or Petzl over some no name crap from Madrock or climbaxe you get the dedication to quality that is so well established with them and not the other guys. I'll pay my few extra bucks knowing full well that BD and Petzl have a firm history of good gear and extensive testing and quality control (less the Zephyr phenomenon) I have had 6 of the climbaxe draws for over a year now, and they are my favorite draws except for the short sling.
So, are you going to replace those skinny spectra runners next year, like you're supposed to? Sure you are. And what's the open-gate strength of those biners? That's the single most important attribute of a carabiner, and the ClimbAxe website doesn't even disclose it (but who cares, as long as they're the cheapest, eh?). Furthermore, those biners have notched noses, which is a general pain in the ass, and a potential safety issue because of the possibility of the notch hooking a bolt hanger. If those are favorite quick draws, I'd have to see the rest of your draws.
Jay
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johnwesely
Dec 9, 2008, 2:22 PM
Post #31 of 60
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I have some omega pacific 4.0s, black diamond, petzl, and mammut draws. The open strength is on the website and is 6.5 kilonewtons. That is weaker than the spirits open gate strength and I will give you that, but if weren't for these draws being so cheap I would not have been able to climb at all. I turned all of my sport draw into trad draw so I have replaced the spectra.
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jt512
Dec 9, 2008, 2:36 PM
Post #32 of 60
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johnwesely wrote: The open strength is on the website and is 6.5 kilonewtons. That is weaker than the spirits open gate strength...
That's the lowest open-gate strength I've ever heard of! I thought that the EN minimum for anything but ovals was 7kN. Those draws are unsafe.
Edit: I don't know where you got the 6.5 kN figure from. If you've got the Veri-Light XT biners, the website says that they have a 9kN open-gate strength, which is reasonable.
Jay
(This post was edited by jt512 on Dec 9, 2008, 2:45 PM)
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dingus
Dec 9, 2008, 3:02 PM
Post #33 of 60
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jac4 wrote: Hello. I don't know anything about rock climbing, but my climber-brother has asked for a "set of quickdraws" for Christmas.
For your reference, boys. Please study the underlined parts.
The dude is NOT a climber. He wants a cool gift for his Bro. "Cheapest' , gate open strength.... irrelevant.
Its meaningless to the OP.
I recently bought all new draws and biners. I did not even GLANCE at the gate open strength of the black diamond and Pretzel biners I bought. I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me.
Gate open strength is nothing more than a purchase decision scoring criteria, so far as name brand biners go.
DMT
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jt512
Dec 9, 2008, 3:15 PM
Post #34 of 60
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dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me.
Why? You don't value your life?
Jay
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dingus
Dec 9, 2008, 3:26 PM
Post #35 of 60
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jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me. Why? You don't value your life? Jay
I value my life. I don't value obsessing over largely equivalent strength ratings. Neither the Pretzel nor the BD biners are substandard.
DMT
(This post was edited by dingus on Dec 9, 2008, 3:26 PM)
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johnwesely
Dec 9, 2008, 3:32 PM
Post #36 of 60
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jt512 wrote: johnwesely wrote: The open strength is on the website and is 6.5 kilonewtons. That is weaker than the spirits open gate strength... That's the lowest open-gate strength I've ever heard of! I thought that the EN minimum for anything but ovals was 7kN. Those draws are unsafe. Edit: I don't know where you got the 6.5 kN figure from. If you've got the Veri-Light XT biners, the website says that they have a 9kN open-gate strength, which is reasonable. Jay
I have no idea were I got that figure from. I was pretty tired this morning and I looked at the figure last night.
You win this time.
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jt512
Dec 9, 2008, 3:43 PM
Post #37 of 60
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dingus wrote: jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me. Why? You don't value your life? Jay I value my life. I don't value obsessing over largely equivalent strength ratings. Neither the Pretzel nor the BD biners are substandard. DMT
The BDs used to be. They had 8 kN open-gate strength, when better biners had 9.5–10. I found it a little suspicious several years ago when BD biners started coming out marked with 9 kN open-gate strength, with no noticeable change in design.
Jay
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dingus
Dec 9, 2008, 3:50 PM
Post #38 of 60
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OK, so you were supicious. Suspicious doesn't equal below-standard biner failure.
DMT
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vegastradguy
Dec 9, 2008, 3:51 PM
Post #39 of 60
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rather than wasting your money, i would suggest that your brother be a bit more specific in what brand he wants. otherwise, you stand a fair chance of your brother not using a gift you are going to probably spend over $100 on.
i have a rule about climbing gear that my friends and family all follow- they never buy it for me unless i specify exactly what i want- brand, model, color, etc, etc....otherwise, they pretend i dont climb around the holidays and buy me videogames.
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king_rat
Dec 9, 2008, 4:13 PM
Post #41 of 60
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To answer the OP, If I am buying climbing equipment I prefer to spend a few more dollars on good quality gear rather then going for cheap stuff. Not necessary because one is safer then the other. but because, in my experience, the better quality stuff is more durable and is far more pleasant to use.
The number of quick draws you buy is up to you, generally a climber may need somewhere between 10-12 quickdraws. however having 5-6 quickdraws means that you can pool your gear with your partner, and between you have a full rack.
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jt512
Dec 9, 2008, 4:49 PM
Post #42 of 60
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dingus wrote: OK, so you were supicious. Suspicious doesn't equal below-standard biner failure. DMT
8 kN < 10 kN. And a factor-1 fall generates about 9 kN. You decide.
Jay
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dingus
Dec 9, 2008, 4:55 PM
Post #43 of 60
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I already did decide - I decided its not THE MOST IMPORTANT criteria when selecting a krab.
DMT
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k.l.k
Dec 9, 2008, 5:12 PM
Post #44 of 60
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jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me. Why? You don't value your life? Jay
Different applications. I don't think Dingus spends most of his time maxed out on short, ueber-steep sport routes with a single biner between him and the talus sharks.
Honestly, I can get more sketched on sport routes where I have only a few feet of rope out, the GF anchored tight (because I outweigh her 2-1), and a potential grounder at each of the first three clips. I bought Stubais just for that scenario, because they have unreal open gate strength and seat well on the hangers. If I had decent sport nearby and surfed all the time, I'd probably have at least one or two quicks setup with steel lockers or something.
I don't like the Stubais nearly as much as many of my other biners for long routes. If I'm doing long trad stuff, I usually don't take them. On the longer things, where falls are less frequent and the common sport-scenario isn't a factor, things like handling and weight can factor in a lot more heavily.
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dingus
Dec 9, 2008, 5:17 PM
Post #45 of 60
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k.l.k wrote: jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me. Why? You don't value your life? Jay Different applications. I don't think Dingus spends most of his time maxed out on short, ueber-steep sport routes with a single biner between him and the talus sharks. Honestly, I can get more sketched on sport routes where I have only a few feet of rope out, the GF anchored tight (because I outweigh her 2-1), and a potential grounder at each of the first three clips. I bought Stubais just for that scenario, because they have unreal open gate strength and seat well on the hangers. If I had decent sport nearby and surfed all the time, I'd probably have at least one or two quicks setup with steel lockers or something. I don't like the Stubais nearly as much as many of my other biners for long routes. If I'm doing long trad stuff, I usually don't take them. On the longer things, where falls are less frequent and the common sport-scenario isn't a factor, things like handling and weight can factor in a lot more heavily.
Good post. Of course I knew from whence JT comes on this issue. The one size fits all approach doesn't work for me.
Cheers
DMT
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mikeboomer12
Dec 9, 2008, 5:23 PM
Post #46 of 60
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If you're in Canada your best bet is MEC for a good deal. Here's the link right to the quickdraw section...
http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_listing.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302690789&bmUID=1228843322596
Merry Christmas.
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mikeboomer12
Dec 9, 2008, 5:24 PM
Post #47 of 60
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Sorry, helps if I read the whole post...you're in San Francisco. Here's the same link @ REI which I think is you're best bet for a deal in the US...
http://www.rei.com/category/4500682
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anykineclimb
Dec 9, 2008, 5:25 PM
Post #48 of 60
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to the OP, ask you brother what he likes.
My gf is not a climber but knows I like specific gear and asks for specific items, links to sites or asks my partners (when she gets sneaky) when shes getting me a gift.
Asking for "quickdraws" is like asking for a "car"
Lots of options and everyone has their preferences.
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the_leech
Dec 9, 2008, 6:04 PM
Post #49 of 60
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jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: jt512 wrote: dingus wrote: I think the gate open strength of name brand biners is largely unimportant, It certainly is to me. Why? You don't value your life? Jay I value my life. I don't value obsessing over largely equivalent strength ratings. Neither the Pretzel nor the BD biners are substandard. DMT The BDs used to be. They had 8 kN open-gate strength, when better biners had 9.5–10. I found it a little suspicious several years ago when BD biners started coming out marked with 9 kN open-gate strength, with no noticeable change in design. Jay
Fight! Fight! Fight!
Jay and Dingus... TO THE OCTAGON!!!!
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shoo
Dec 9, 2008, 6:07 PM
Post #50 of 60
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the_leech wrote: Fight! Fight! Fight! Jay and Dingus... TO THE #12 HEX !!!!
Fixed it for you.
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