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blueeyedclimber
May 21, 2014, 1:15 PM
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This is a powerful, gut wrenching story about a friend of mine. This is the first time I've heard the detailed story and what she has been through for the last several years.
http://cruxcrush.com/...at-almost-killed-me/
Whether you wear a helmet or not, is ultimately up to you, but at the very least……think about it.
Josh
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viciado
May 22, 2014, 2:54 PM
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Wow.
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potreroed
May 22, 2014, 6:34 PM
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...and that's why I always wear a helmet and use a grigri.
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gblauer
Moderator
May 22, 2014, 11:21 PM
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Very tragic story. Sara climbs at great risk, why would she choose to do that to herself and her family?
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veilneb
May 23, 2014, 1:33 AM
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...because climbing is Sara's life, and she lives to climb....
(This post was edited by veilneb on May 23, 2014, 1:35 AM)
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gblauer
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May 23, 2014, 1:37 AM
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There was a similar story about a young kid who had a terrible accident at the gunks. Traumatic brain injury, nearly died. He recovered, went climbing in CO, fell, hit his head again and died. His family went through hell twice...for what?
I understand the passion, I really do. But when it comes to putting yourself at such severe risk and the impact it will have on your family...you have to ask yourself "am I being selfish"
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stagg54
May 23, 2014, 1:48 AM
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Isn't all climbing, at least in some way, selfish?
What is it about your climbing that somehow makes it not seflish?
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gblauer
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May 23, 2014, 1:55 AM
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She is climbing against medical advice, with a condition that will likely result in her death if she gets hit in the head again (fall, falling rock, falling gear etc). How can you put your family through that?
I am not climbing AMA. I do not have a life threatening condition.
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moose_droppings
May 23, 2014, 4:11 AM
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Might be the most compelling and inspirational story I've ever read. Top that with determination and focus and I am truely humbled by the scope and reach of the human spirit.
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granite_grrl
May 23, 2014, 1:17 PM
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gblauer wrote: There was a similar story about a young kid who had a terrible accident at the gunks. Traumatic brain injury, nearly died. He recovered, went climbing in CO, fell, hit his head again and died. His family went through hell twice...for what? I understand the passion, I really do. But when it comes to putting yourself at such severe risk and the impact it will have on your family...you have to ask yourself "am I being selfish"
I agree with what you're saying, but at the same time it's kinda asking her not to live any more.
When I got hurt and got back into climbing people were surprised (not really climbers, but other people). But I wouldn't know what else to do with myself.
Fast forward another 8 years of intense climbing passion and I get people moving on and fidning other things. Climbing is still my main activity, but I get my fair share of biking and running in too now. I don't need to get out Sat-Sun every weekend and I try to have shorter days at the crag.
But if I gave up climbing totally, what would I do? I wouldn't give up the outdoors, so mtn biking? Kayaking? I would be at greater risk for head injury doing either of those sports. Maybe I could get by with just road riding...but there's still risk and I would miss the forest.
Point being, someone like Sara would have to replace climbing with some other physical activity that could still cary some risk of head injury. You couldn't just ask her to just sit at home because her family worries about her.
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lena_chita
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May 23, 2014, 3:01 PM
Post #11 of 17
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gblauer wrote: She is climbing against medical advice, with a condition that will likely result in her death if she gets hit in the head again (fall, falling rock, falling gear etc). How can you put your family through that? I am not climbing AMA. I do not have a life threatening condition.
You don't have a life-threatening condition, but you don't have any special protection either. Just because you haven't suffered a head injury before, doesn't mean that you will get a "waiver" the first time around. She survived. Others in similar situations did not. The first time might be the last time for you.
A question of "how can you put your family through that" is a strange one, coming from a climber. After a serious life-threatening accident, some people give up climbing. Others come back to it with vengeance. Whether it is because they want to prove to themselves that they can, or whether it is because they can't envision life without the activity they love, I don't know. people have their reasons to come back, just like they have reasons to get into climbing in the first place.
We don't live to keep out family worry-free. We try to be careful and safe, sure, but we live life, and do not sit in a mothballed closet wrapped in bubble wrap.
Yes, I wholeheartedly hope that my children will avoid accidents and live healthy and happy, long after I die; Just as my parents have the statistically-reasonable expectation of me still being alive when they are in the end of their years. But even if I gave up climbing today, I couldn't guarantee that.
And neither could Sara. She might give up climbing and all outdoor activities, only to trip on the step and hit her head on the railing on a Subway. Or reach under the table for a fallen spoon, and hit her head while getting from under the table.
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Gmburns2000
May 23, 2014, 3:14 PM
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I only know Gillers a little bit from the Boston crew, but that time after the accident was a bit gut-wrenching waiting to see if she'd make it. She was (and still is) a very likeable person, so everyone was pretty much just hoping she'd not only wake up but recover. Then I remember seeing her at the gym again with her helmet on and I remember thinking, "Good for her." I had just missed her when I was at the New some time after and remember again thinking that it was great that she was on the road. For someone who I knew enough to say hi and converse a little at the gym, but not much more than that, I was never happier for someone than when Roger told me she was heading to the Red.
I'm not 100% convinced that a helmet would have made that much of a difference as it was a sizable piece of rock that had fallen at a decent distance. I trust Jim when he says today's climbing helmets are kind of a joke compared to what's really helpful (my own interpretation of his words). However, I think her crusade is a good one and has to start somewhere. The parallel to skiing is a fantastic one, too. No one wore helmets when I learned and skied back then as much as I have climbed in recent years. I don't always wear a helmet, but I do feel a bit naked without one sometimes.
I hope that helmet technology and culture change over time. I hope that her message gets through and makes a difference. And I certainly hope that she continues to rock it outside. You only live once. Go get it.
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sonso45
May 23, 2014, 4:45 PM
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When I began climbing after my triple bypass it was AMA (Against Medical Advice). Sure, they know medicine but I knew me. You have to choose the level of risk, even the poor kid that got smacked twice on the head, lived his life. Yes, it could be seen as selfish but not uncommonly so.
I wear a helmet 90% of the time and require my belayer to wear one in case I drop my gear on their head.
I have seen one make a difference and will push for their universal use.
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billcoe_
May 26, 2014, 3:47 AM
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Wow, what a story. Wish her well in her journey. But of note regarding this: In reply to: I am sharing this story to reiterate how important climbing helmets are, and I hope that if one person reads this article and realizes the importance of helmets and becomes a helmet wearer, then at least something positive came out of my accident. The accident and the recovery were difficult and full of ups and downs. I thought that once I started climbing outside again, I would stop thinking about my accident, but I was wrong. I deal with the accident and its repercussions every day.
I'm not anti-helmet, but where is the discourse on partners not pulling 50lb rocks onto their belayer? Where is the discussion on belayers being aware of exit routes in the event of a 50lb rock heading your way, or the use of "ROCK! as an early warning. For her, it's all about the helmet, and frankly, thats a bad take away if that's all someone gets out of this story imo.
I know someone who got nailed by a rock and it took her leg off.
Now what?
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iknowfear
May 26, 2014, 9:02 PM
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gblauer wrote: There was a similar story about a young kid who had a terrible accident at the gunks. Traumatic brain injury, nearly died. He recovered, went climbing in CO, fell, hit his head again and died. His family went through hell twice...for what? I understand the passion, I really do. But when it comes to putting yourself at such severe risk and the impact it will have on your family...you have to ask yourself "am I being selfish"
First of all congratulations on Sara's recovery and determination.
I find this discussion quite fascinating, as it is revolves around what constitutes an acceptable level of risk.
I think most of us have heard the "how could you do this" multiple times - I always retreat to saying that climbing is not THAT dangerous, sometimes trying more to convince myself than others, sometimes informing that I am more at risk driving to the crag (or to work) than climbing.
However, what I probably should say, is that I weight my selfish enjoyment (benefit, fun, rush etc.) higher than the risk. I don't free solo but someone who does likely does the same. And yet someone who did calls it the only blasphemy. But then, isn't all climbing "to willfully jeopardize [your] existence" to some degree?
Imho, an acceptable level of risk is something only the concerned individual can decide (assuming an informed decision, and not bumbling noobs- but thats for another thread.)
Cheers
ps:robert_falcon_scott wrote: We took risks, we knew we took them; things have come out against us, and therefore we have no cause for complaint |
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blueeyedclimber
May 27, 2014, 12:12 PM
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billcoe_ wrote: Wow, what a story. Wish her well in her journey. But of note regarding this: In reply to: I am sharing this story to reiterate how important climbing helmets are, and I hope that if one person reads this article and realizes the importance of helmets and becomes a helmet wearer, then at least something positive came out of my accident. The accident and the recovery were difficult and full of ups and downs. I thought that once I started climbing outside again, I would stop thinking about my accident, but I was wrong. I deal with the accident and its repercussions every day. I'm not anti-helmet, but where is the discourse on partners not pulling 50lb rocks onto their belayer? Where is the discussion on belayers being aware of exit routes in the event of a 50lb rock heading your way, or the use of "ROCK! as an early warning. For her, it's all about the helmet, and frankly, thats a bad take away if that's all someone gets out of this story imo. I know someone who got nailed by a rock and it took her leg off. Now what?
Fair enough, Bill. But, I know Sara and I don't believe that was her only take away. As far as an exit route, the crag in question doesn't really have one. The base is a steep hill side. She also got pulled (basically into the rock) because her climber outweighed her. And as for not pulling stuff off, that is a fair question too, as it's usually preventable (but we don't know that for sure and would only be speculation). I consider myself very careful and cognizant of loose rock, am aware of my surroundings, and tread very lightly when need be. But, I have definitely grabbed something before that I thought was solid and turned out not to be.
In response to Gail, yes, she is probably taking on more risk than most climbers, but I would trust her more than half of climbers out there. And like someone said….some climbers would walk away from climbing after that. Some just can't. I don't think, we, especially as climbers, have a right to question that.
Josh
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Gmburns2000
May 27, 2014, 3:44 PM
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blueeyedclimber wrote: I don't think, we, especially as climbers, have a right to question that. Josh
+1
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